Talk:Opinion polling for the 2024 Austrian legislative election: Difference between revisions
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A few users unfortunately seem to misunderstand what WP is and have taken to adding personal opinions in the form of disclaimers as well as removing old polls. That is ediatoralising, and it's quite simply not allowed here. There was no consensus to remove older polls, and they neeed to reinstated. A '''sourced''' discussion of the problems with these older polls both could and should be included, but ''all'' users should realise WP is for reporting what sources say, not to make personal commentary. [[User:Jeppiz|Jeppiz]] ([[User talk:Jeppiz|talk]]) 23:46, 5 November 2021 (UTC) |
A few users unfortunately seem to misunderstand what WP is and have taken to adding personal opinions in the form of disclaimers as well as removing old polls. That is ediatoralising, and it's quite simply not allowed here. There was no consensus to remove older polls, and they neeed to reinstated. A '''sourced''' discussion of the problems with these older polls both could and should be included, but ''all'' users should realise WP is for reporting what sources say, not to make personal commentary. [[User:Jeppiz|Jeppiz]] ([[User talk:Jeppiz|talk]]) 23:46, 5 November 2021 (UTC) |
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:This is true. There is simply no consensus for the edits conducted here. [[User:Impru20|'''<span style="color:#E65B00;">Impru</span><span style="color:#0018A8;">20</span>''']]<sup>[[User talk:Impru20|talk]]</sup> 23:55, 5 November 2021 (UTC) |
:This is true. There is simply no consensus for the edits conducted here. [[User:Impru20|'''<span style="color:#E65B00;">Impru</span><span style="color:#0018A8;">20</span>''']]<sup>[[User talk:Impru20|talk]]</sup> 23:55, 5 November 2021 (UTC) |
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::I modernized the article because of a spam of old, corrupted Research Affairs polls. You guys have no clue of the current political situation in Austria and should be more concerned about your own countries. Impru, go back to editing your Spanish articles and leave this article alone ! This article will remain as you edited, because it is up to date and corrupt old RA results are still shown under collapsed old polls. --[[User:The Pollster|The Pollster]] ([[User talk:The Pollster|talk]]) 04:57, 7 November 2021 (UTC) |
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Revision as of 04:57, 7 November 2021
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Gazette
Should we include them? Braganza (talk) 10:37, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
| Polling firm | Fieldwork date | Sample size |
Method | ÖVP | SPÖ | FPÖ | Grüne | NEOS | Others | Lead |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;"| | style="background:Template:Social Democratic Party of Austria/meta/color;"| | style="background:Template:Freedom Party of Austria/meta/color;"| | style="background:Template:The Greens – The Green Alternative/meta/color;"| | style="background:Template:NEOS – The New Austria and Liberal Forum/meta/color;"| | style="background:Template:Independent/meta/color;"| | |||||
| Gazette Oesterreich | 27–30 Sep 2021 | 3,250 | Online | 28.74 | 22.42 | 18.89 | 8.13 | 11.82 | MFG 4.52 KPÖ 2.51 Others 2.08 |
style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 6.52 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 20–23 Sep 2021 | 3,250 | Online | 28.95 | 22.87 | 22.60 | 7.22 | 12.24 | 6.12 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 6.08 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 13–16 Sep 2021 | 2,890 | Online | 28.93 | 22.85 | 22.58 | 7.19 | 12.47 | 5.99 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 6.08 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 6–9 Sep 2021 | 2,960 | Online | 28.26 | 22.40 | 22.18 | 7.25 | 12.28 | 7.64 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.86 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 30 Aug–2 Sep 2021 | 2,950 | Online | 28.08 | 22.44 | 22.14 | 7.07 | 12.02 | 8.25 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.64 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 23-26 Aug 2021 | 2,900 | Online | 28.08 | 22.44 | 22.14 | 7.07 | 12.02 | 8.25 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.64 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 16–19 Aug 2021 | 2,950 | Online | 28.05 | 22.47 | 22.08 | 7.13 | 12.06 | 8.21 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.58 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 9–12 Aug 2021 | 2,900 | Online | 28.13 | 22.48 | 22.00 | 7.07 | 12.11 | 8.07 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.65 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 2–8 Aug 2021 | 2,950 | Online | 27.96 | 22.39 | 22.00 | 7.09 | 12.14 | 8.43 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.57 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 25–29 Jul 2021 | 3,000 | Online | 27.92 | 22.39 | 21.95 | 7.00 | 12.23 | 8.51 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.53 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 11–15 Jul 2021 | 2,950 | Online | 27.91 | 22.24 | 21.90 | 7.10 | 12.05 | 8.52 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.67 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 4–8 Jul 2021 | 2,850 | Online | 28.03 | 23.02 | 21.85 | 6.99 | 12.05 | 8.06 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.01 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 28 Jun–1 Jul 2021 | 2,650 | Online | 28.13 | 23.01 | 21.79 | 7.12 | 11.90 | 8.04 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.12 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 21–24 Jun 2021 | 2,900 | Online | 27.89 | 22.38 | 21.31 | 7.07 | 11.85 | 9.51 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.61 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 13–17 Jun 2021 | 2,900 | Online | 27.38 | 22.41 | 20.98 | 7.55 | 11.92 | 9.76 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 2.97 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 7–10 Jun 2021 | 2,850 | Online | 27.09 | 22.35 | 21.08 | 7.51 | 12.11 | 9.86 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 4.74 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 31 May–3 Jun 2021 | 2,800 | Online | 27.69 | 22.36 | 20.96 | 7.69 | 11.92 | 9.38 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.33 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 25–27 May 2021 | 2,700 | Online | 28.16 | 22.49 | 21.14 | 7.61 | 11.89 | 8.71 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.57 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 17–20 May 2021 | 3,000 | Online | 28.13 | 22.37 | 21.21 | 7.50 | 12.19 | 8.62 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.76 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 10–15 May 2021 | 2,800 | Online | 26.93 | 23.47 | 22.22 | 7.91 | 12.26 | 7.56 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 3.36 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 2–6 May 2021 | 3,000 | Online | 28.25 | 22.48 | 20.83 | 8.93 | 12.09 | 7.43 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 5.83 |
| Gazette Oesterreich | 26–29 April 2021 | 3,000 | Online | 28.89 | 22.40 | 20.40 | 8.84 | 12.18 | 7.69 | style="background:Template:Austrian People's Party (2017)/meta/color;color:#FFFFFF;"| 6.49 |
- It is an online poll with no statistical data on whether participants are weighted to reflect actual population. I think that hasn’t got the necessary quality. Great work though of putting that all together --FantinoFalco (talk) 10:21, 2 October 2021 (UTC)
- No, not include. It is no opinion poll, it’s a poll aggregator. --The Pollster (talk) 04:11, 8 October 2021 (UTC)
Corruption/faking investigations: Should "Research Affairs" polls for Ö24/Österreich newspaper be removed from the article ? Or remain there with a warning sign ?
Research Affairs polls for the tabloid newspaper "Österreich" or "Ö24" have been part of an ongoing criminal investigation here in Austria, because the state prosecution says they were bought by Kurz and some of his aides and manipulated in their favour to paint his predecessor Mitterlehner in a bad light so he would ressign (which he did, and Kurz succeeded him). Later, RA faked the numbers to make the new turquoise ÖVP under Kurz get higher polling numbers than other established pollsters showed at the time. Today, RA's founder Sabine Beinschab, was arrested by police after text messages showed her printing fake bills for her fake polls and she also deleted her computer hard disk and company server during the last week (https://www.politico.eu/article/austrian-pollster-linked-to-corruption-probe-was-arrested/). So, should all RA polls be deleted as a result or should they remain because of archive purposes ? Or should they be "hidden" with a collapsed section below the main polls ? For example, the updated poll section should only start after the text where it says on October 9 that Kurz resigned ? --The Pollster (talk) 15:17, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
- I would say keep them (for now at least) with a disclaimer noting these events. After all, the published information as of now pertains to a specific number of polls previous to Kurz's rise to power back in 2016/2017, and this does not automatically invalidate all and any opinion polls published by them (specially considering their results, at least since the 2019 election, are not dissimilar to those offered by other pollsters). Impru20talk 15:50, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
- Maybe, but I think they should at least be removed from the main poll table and hidden in a collapsed new table somewhere at the bottom where nobody can find them quickly. After all, their boss got arrested for faking the numbers today. These polls have no place in visible charts. --The Pollster (talk) 16:10, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
- But again, that would be assuming something that, as of yet, is not supported by sources; the criminal probe revolves on a number of polls from the 2016/2017 period, not those listed in this article. We should pursue a due balance between giving full credibility to a pollster that is currently under investigation (note this, since there is no judicial ruling as of yet that condemns it for any crime) and outrightly removing everything that has to do with such pollster. For now, I think a disclaimer on the pollster's current situation is enough. Depending on the situation's evolution, and if the probe extends into the polls shown in this article, we may decide how to act on them directly. Impru20talk 16:33, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
- Maybe, but I think they should at least be removed from the main poll table and hidden in a collapsed new table somewhere at the bottom where nobody can find them quickly. After all, their boss got arrested for faking the numbers today. These polls have no place in visible charts. --The Pollster (talk) 16:10, 12 October 2021 (UTC)
Horrible state of article
A few users unfortunately seem to misunderstand what WP is and have taken to adding personal opinions in the form of disclaimers as well as removing old polls. That is ediatoralising, and it's quite simply not allowed here. There was no consensus to remove older polls, and they neeed to reinstated. A sourced discussion of the problems with these older polls both could and should be included, but all users should realise WP is for reporting what sources say, not to make personal commentary. Jeppiz (talk) 23:46, 5 November 2021 (UTC)
- This is true. There is simply no consensus for the edits conducted here. Impru20talk 23:55, 5 November 2021 (UTC)
- I modernized the article because of a spam of old, corrupted Research Affairs polls. You guys have no clue of the current political situation in Austria and should be more concerned about your own countries. Impru, go back to editing your Spanish articles and leave this article alone ! This article will remain as you edited, because it is up to date and corrupt old RA results are still shown under collapsed old polls. --The Pollster (talk) 04:57, 7 November 2021 (UTC)