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Please start new discussion at the bottom of this talk page, or use the EDIT button beside the section heading to add to it. The edit button is important, so please use it.
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Hi this Prashanth, I would like discuss About Hot issues regarding IT Industry'''Bold text'''
[[Category:Main Page]]
{{notice|1=<div style="text-align: center"><span style="font-size: 185%">'''This page is for discussing the [[Main Page|main page]] only.'''</span><br/><br /><span style="font-size: 150%">This is not the place to ask general questions.</span><br/> To ask questions about using Wikipedia, see the [[Wikipedia:Help desk|help desk]].<br/> To ask questions about Wikipedia policies or operations, see the [[Wikipedia:Village pump|village pump]].'''<br/> For more information on this page, see [[Wikipedia:Main Page FAQ]].<br/>[[Wikipedia:Questions|'''Use ''this link'' to find out how to ask questions and get answers''']].</div>}}
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=General discussion=
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== Main Page Design ==

It could look quite a bit more professional.--[[User:Billscottbob|Billy]] ([[User talk:Billscottbob|talk]]) 23:40, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
:Why should it look more professional? Only some people know that it is here. Do you mean that we sould have a coloured background? Or some other astheatic effect? <span style="cursor:crosshair;"><font face="Edwardian Script ITC" size="3">[[User:Dreamafter|<font color="red">Dreamy</font>]]</font></span> <font size="2">[[User talk:Dreamafter|<font color="purple"><sup>§</sup></font>]]</font> 23:44, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
more ''professional''? what's wrong with it now? <u>''freenaulij''</u> 00:19, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
:Sorry, I didn't mean as in content or layout. Other wikipedia pages (for example portals) seem to have better aesthetics. What about some icons or something. Its merely a suggestion. There is nothing ''wrong'' with the main page.--[[User:Billscottbob|Billy]] ([[User talk:Billscottbob|talk]]) 00:33, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
::Oh... You mean the actual main page, not the discussion... Well, it should look good, it is the most viewed page... <span style="cursor:crosshair;"><font face="Edwardian Script ITC" size="3">[[User:Dreamafter|<font color="red">Dreamy</font>]]</font></span> <font size="2">[[User talk:Dreamafter|<font color="purple"><sup>§</sup></font>]]</font> 00:49, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

::Dude, I've said and read things about this so many times, you've got my support if it goes to discussion but to be honest I don't see it happening, soon someone's gonna say "if it ain't broken don't fix it" (which is my pet peeve by the way) and the conversation will go downhill from there. [[User:Ferdiaob|Ferdia O'Brien]] <small>([[User talk:Ferdiaob|Talk]])</small> 02:43, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia's Main Page should be more decorative and attractive by changing the backgroud and having all sorts of different news like new books and movies that have been released. --[[User:Pure-intellect|Pure-intellect]] ([[User talk:Pure-intellect|talk]]) 17:24, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Honestly, the average user of Wikipedia hardly sees the main page. Most people just type in "wikipedia.com" or something along those lines, and end up at the welcome page and use search, bypassing the whole main page. Besides, I think the main page is perfect the way it is. It wouldn't be my homepage if it weren't. [[User:Snowballinhell7001|snowball71]] ([[User talk:Snowballinhell7001|talk]]) 17:31, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

:If someone does decide to propose a design you might want to look at the main pages of other language Wikipedias - I particularly like the [http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portada Spanish], [http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pagina_principale Italian], [http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hauptseite German] and [http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accueil French] Main Pages. Whilst I'm at it, I also like the way the [http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discuter:Accueil French Wikipedia separates indented comments on talk pages]. --[[User:DTR|Dave the Rave (DTR)]]<small>[[User_talk:DTR|talk]]</small> 18:17, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
=== Change it for certain days like Holidays ===

Since Wikipedia is for English people, we should have the British Monarch's birthday and the US independence day on 4 July as two holidays that can be changed to blue. This works because all English speaking countries are either US territories or part of the Commonwealth!!! Also, I know that Christmass is a religious holiday but in the Commonwealth and in the US it is very much a secular holiday. Or say Halloween, where the background can be changed to orange (for pumpkins) and for christmass it could be green red and white (for snow and for mistle toe). [[User:Tourskin|Tourskin]] ([[User talk:Tourskin|talk]]) 01:21, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

: And st patricks day!! make it all green!! for real[[User:Tourskin|Tourskin]] ([[User talk:Tourskin|talk]]) 01:23, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

While it would be good, the problem is holidays are not always international. Let me break it down:
*'''The Queen's actual birthday''' is nowhere as big, nor is the equivelant, of the US's Indepedence Day. Yes, there is a "Queen's Birthday" public holiday, but a) it is not actually the Queen's real birthday b) different places celebrate it at different times c) not all places in the Commonwealth do have a Queen's Birthday day. Each country usually has its own national day, so like how the US has Independance Day... Australia has Australia Day and New Zealand has Waitangi Day for example.
*'''Halloween''' is mainly an American thing, and would be very unprofessional.
*'''Christmas''' could work, even though in the Southern hemisphere Christmas is in summer (as you are suggesting wintery imagery, though the association of Christmas and Winter does exist here in Australia due to American influences).
*'''St Patricks Day''' is an American thing, really

::I take serious offence to my country being labelled either a US territory or part of the Commonwealth, and St. Patrick's Day is <u>not</u> an American thing. [[User:Ferdiaob|Ferdia O'Brien]] <small>([[User talk:Ferdiaob|Talk]])</small> 03:22, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

:: Lol sorry I forgot about Ireland having a large number of English speakers but yeah theres something for everyone in my list. Theres nothing else British. And Halloween is not an American thing only. [[User:Tourskin|Tourskin]] ([[User talk:Tourskin|talk]]) 03:59, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Well Halloween did actually originate in Ireland as well, its an old Celtic feast. So if we do change the page on Holidays, Ireland will be featuring quite a bit.... if I have anything to say about it. :D [[User:Ferdiaob|Ferdia O'Brien]] <small>([[User talk:Ferdiaob|Talk]])</small> 14:56, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
:::::Halloween did not originate in Ireland. The 'end of summer' festival on October 31, ie what we now call Halloween, has been celebrated throughout much of Europe since pre-christian times. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/80.2.205.12|80.2.205.12]] ([[User talk:80.2.205.12|talk]]) 13:57, 21 November 2007 (UTC):(</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
::::Sorry mate, I had known that St Patrick's Day has its roots in Ireland but I was under the impression that it was mainly celebrated in America (we don't celebrate it here in Australia, and I've only heard of it mentioned in American TV shows). Turns out I was wrong though, according to [[St Patrick's Day]]. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/122.99.82.107|122.99.82.107]] ([[User talk:122.99.82.107|talk]]) 13:48, 20 November 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:::::No worrys man, I'm a fan of your idea, as I am with most new ideas that are brought to Wikipedia because I think the place is stagnating slightly, but having said that, innovation must be done right, or not at all, so the holidays must be at there historic roots as well as there more popular ones (only both could be considered encyclopaedic) if we were to decorate the main page with them. [[User:Ferdiaob|Ferdia O'Brien]] <small>([[User talk:Ferdiaob|Talk]])</small> 16:56, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Another way to approach it would be to consider different designs for days other than holidays, something more international in flavor anyway. I have no idea what this would entail, just a thought. [[Special:Contributions/67.173.131.28|67.173.131.28]] ([[User talk:67.173.131.28|talk]]) 05:27, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
::::::::So what, specifically, do you all want to do to the main page on these days? I agree in principle, but I would like to see <I>reasonably</I> subtle changes (like google) rather than complete reskins (like, say, [http://uncyclopedia.org/ uncyclopedia]). If people don't like the idea of changing the main page, maybe there could be some kind of preference thingy to govern it (it could be either on or off by default)? [[User:Bistromathic|Bistromathic]] ([[User talk:Bistromathic|talk]]) 15:13, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
:What about all of the Chinese people who speak English? There are almost as many English speakers in China as there are in the USA. And according to England's PM, Chinese English-speakers will outnumber all others combined in twenty years. [[User:Cigarette|Cigarette]] ([[User talk:Cigarette|talk]]) 21:36, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
[[User:MichelleMorganDawn|MichelleMorganDawn]] ([[User talk:MichelleMorganDawn|talk]]) 19:24, 24 November 2007 (UTC)In Canada we celebrate St.Patricks day.
::'''Disagree''' Way too cumbersome the main page would change everyday of the year and even conflict some days... Just because it is the "English" Wikipedia doesn't mean other non-"English" cultures cannot be reflected in the main page. You have all kinds of things during the year in all countries around the world and how do you rationalise a holiday's importance? E.g. [[Guy Fawkes]] Day is recognized in some English speaking countries but not others. Also India is an English speaking country and they among a few Caribbean countries celebrate [[Diwali|Diwali/Divali]] and that is a *very* important time in India but it is days-- long. Also [[Emancipation Day]] in the [[British Empire]] is celebrated on different days by different countries how do you choose??? And lets not talk about British practice of a) holiday, b) bank holiday and so on... Or if a Holiday falls on a Saturday or Sunday etc... etc... [[User:CaribDigita|CaribDigita]] ([[User talk:CaribDigita|talk]]) 23:03, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
:::I was thinking that it could be simple recolourings to reflect the holiday (if that holiday has specific colours associated with it), and perhaps have a related featured article <u>if</u> one exists (which is something we pretty much do anyway), and perhaps to use the google example above, we could change the wikipedia logo appropriatly aswell. [[User:Ferdiaob|Ferdia O'Brien]] <small>([[User talk:Ferdiaob|Talk]])</small> 23:56, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

::::You guys are still talking about this? Fine, add colors for Chinese new year. [[User:Tourskin|Tourskin]] ([[User talk:Tourskin|talk]]) 00:30, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Why not something sutble like a logo change such as what Google does? (See [http://www.google.com/holidaylogos.html here]) [[User:TheGreatZorko|TheGreatZorko]] ([[User talk:TheGreatZorko|talk]]) 11:05, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

We already recognize holidays in the "On this day..." section. That's enough for me. [[User:Snowballinhell7001|snowball71]] ([[User talk:Snowballinhell7001|talk]]) 17:31, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Three prominent items on the Main Page are Today's featured article, In the news and On this day... When looking at these items, I think its useful for the reader to be aware of the current date. (It actually says the date in the On this day... section already.) Is there an argument for displaying the current date (and maybe the time the page was loaded) somewhere near the top of the page? Perhaps above and aligned with the right of the box containing the Welcome to Wikipedia message? I think this would be a useful addition to the user interface. [[User:Nicgarner|Nicgarner]] ([[User talk:Nicgarner|talk]]) 12:26, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

::The date and time, though, would be [[UTC]] which is known to cause confusion to some people. For example, readers in California would be told that today is, say, Friday whilst to them it is still 6pm on Thursday. [[User:Bazza 7|Bazza]] ([[User talk:Bazza 7|talk]]) 14:22, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

:::True. Is that not already a problem with the date as it is displayed in the On this day... section? Can technology not do something to help with this? I'm not very technological, but I know that the time can be displayed based on the users computer time. I know that's not a good solution, because the users computer clock might not be correct. Is there some way that the location of the user can be detected when the page is requested, and display the time as appropriate? [[User:Nicgarner|Nicgarner]] ([[User talk:Nicgarner|talk]]) 23:01, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

== Newest articles links ==

The top one has links to content that could be harmful to children viewing the encyclopedia for school work or research.

Shouldn't the main page have censored content due to the traffic coming to this page? <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/76.115.130.174|76.115.130.174]] ([[User talk:76.115.130.174|talk]]) 00:39, 22 November 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:Unfortunately [[WP:CENSORED|Wikipedia is not censored]]. The [[List of mammals displaying homosexual behavior|article in bold font]] should be safe to read in school, though. [[User:Awyong Jeffrey Mordecai Salleh|Awyong]] [[User talk:Awyong Jeffrey Mordecai Salleh|Jeffrey]] [[Special:Contributions/Awyong Jeffrey Mordecai Salleh|Mordecai]] [[Special:Emailuser/Awyong Jeffrey Mordecai Salleh|Salleh]] 00:45, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

::Better they should learn here than on the streets. —[[User:Nricardo|Nricardo]] ([[User talk:Nricardo|talk]]) 07:19, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Though I'm not sure how many streets would teach people about [[List of mammals displaying homosexual behaviour|mammals displaying homosexual behaviour]]. :) [[User:GeeJo|GeeJo]] <sup>[[User talk:GeeJo|(t)]]</sup>⁄<sub>[[Special:Contributions/GeeJo|(c)]]</sub> <small>&bull;&nbsp;12:48, 23 November 2007 (UTC)</small>

::::''Unfortunately''? Your opinion, guy. I believe in freedom of speech and freedom of knowledge. Some things may be controversial, but that's just the way the cookie crumbles. Death, drugs, sex, violence etc are very real things. Its not up to us what children should or shouldn't see or read - that's for their parents, tutors and teachers. --[[User:Soetermans|Soetermans]] ([[User talk:Soetermans|talk]]) 15:34, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
:::::Not that I agree with the OP, but I believe Jeffrey meant 'unfortunately for the OP' not his own belief. —[[User:Vanderdecken|Vanderdecken]]∴ <b>[[User talk:Vanderdecken|∫]][[Special:Emailuser/Vanderdecken|ξ]][[Special:Contributions/Vanderdecken|φ]]</b> 15:43, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

::::::It's important for people to understand that Wikipedia is '''not safe''' for kids, period. Any vandal can add a link to any page that could funnel a kid to a pedophile's Web site or tries to trick him into releasing exploitable information. There's no way that you can have an encyclopedia that anyone can edit which does ''not'' allow Internet's least ethical people free access. The only way to keep kids safe here is to train them to protect themselves - and if you don't want them to learn inconvenient things you'll have to trust them not to look. [[Special:Contributions/70.15.116.59|70.15.116.59]] ([[User talk:70.15.116.59|talk]]) 23:27, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

(unindent)Again, Wikipedia is not censored for minors. Sorry, just something that is. <span style="font-family:copperplate gothic light"><tt>&lt;[[User:Dreamafter|<font color="crimson">DREAMAFTER</font>]]&gt;<sup>&lt;[[User talk:Dreamafter|<font color="purple">TALK</font>]]&gt;</sup></tt></span> 23:41, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

== Proposal to add "Today's featured list" to the main page ==

See '''[[Wikipedia:Today's featured list]]'''.

'''''[[User:The Transhumanist|<font color="#880088">Th<font color="#0000FF">e Tr<font color="#449900">ans<font color="#DD9922">hu<font color="#DD4400">man<font color="#BB0000">ist</font> &nbsp;&nbsp;]]''''' 09:56, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Sure, if we can make room. Ultimately though, people hardly see the featured picture as it is. Adding more stuff will just clutter it up more. [[User:Snowballinhell7001|snowball71]] ([[User talk:Snowballinhell7001|talk]]) 17:41, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

== Portals on the main page ==

Regarding the listing of portals on the very top of the page, what ever happened to the major category called '''Health'''? You could easily add another row and/or column to this display section which would add back three more major portal categories. -- [[User:John Gohde|John Gohde]] ([[User talk:John Gohde|talk]]) 15:32, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
: That would be cool, or even moving "All portals" down to the menu line to make room for another portal link. [[User:The Transhumanist|The Transhumanist]] ([[User talk:The Transhumanist|talk]]) 11:28, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

:At {{tl|browsebar}} we just changed all the links to be directly to subsections of [[Portal:Portals]], instead of individual portals. We would advocate doing something similar here. -- [[User:Quiddity|Quiddity]] <small>([[User talk:Quiddity|talk]])</small> 19:46, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

== History ==

When is this Website is first formed and created? How did the makers made a website like this? How did the Admins create this? Where is the device that the people used to make this Website?([[User:Thunderclacker|Thunderclacker the F22]] ([[User talk:Thunderclacker|talk]]) 07:20, 25 November 2007 (UTC))
:See [[Wikipedia]], [[History of Wikipedia]], and [[MediaWiki]].-<font face="cursive" color="#808080">[[User talk:gadfium|gadfium]]</font> 08:11, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

== Contradiction in messages regarding main page ==

When I select "View Source" on the main page, I get the message "You do not have permission to do that, for the following reasons: This page is currently protected from editing..."

That doesn't make sense. I didn't select an icon to edit the main page, only to view the source. I am allowed to view the source (but not edit the page). It does display the source of the page much further down.

Is there any way this can be amended please?[[Special:Contributions/90.204.70.87|90.204.70.87]] ([[User talk:90.204.70.87|talk]]) 22:46, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

:Perhaps "permission to do that" should be changed to "permission to edit". This goes for all protected pages, not just the [[Main Page]]. --[[Special:Contributions/199.71.174.100|199.71.174.100]] ([[User talk:199.71.174.100|talk]]) 22:51, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
::Humm...after a bit of research, it looks to be like the offending text (found, in the [[Wikipedia:MediaWiki namespace|MediaWiki namespace]] at [[MediaWiki:Permissionserrorstext]]) seems to have something to do with the cascade protection, it dosn't appear in regualrly protected pages. I also had a look at the cascade protection related pages in MediaWiki, and it doesn't appear to be related to any of them. My guess is it only shows up when a page is protected two ways, the full protection and the cascade, as is the main page and not many, if any, others. An admin, then, would need to change [[MediaWiki:Permissionserrorstext]], but, being that the wording doesn't mention protected pages, I'd make sure its not doing something else before changing it.--[[User:Fyre2387|Fyre2387]] <sup>([[User talk:Fyre2387|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Fyre2387|contribs]])</sup> 02:59, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
:::It's the catch-all for protection permissions that haven't been properly set up; it may also occur under certain other events. It doesn't occur when attempting to delete or block a user when not an admin, but there may be certain circumstances where it does (perhaps if I tried to use [[wikipedia:checkuser|checkuser]]?) and as such, it should be kept general. [[User:Smurrayinchester|<span style="color:#00BB55">Laïka</span>]] 20:04, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

== Featured Pics ==

Why does it seem that many of the featured pictures are so disturbing, nauseating, and utterly disgusting? I know, I know, Wikipedia is not censored, but why must we have a picture of a boy burning to death? I know it is reality for him, but must this photo be viewed by millions of people every day? I really think that some more thought needs to be given to Wikipedia policies regarding, not all images, but the ones that go on the front page where they are viewed by a vastly greater audience. <font color="#008080">[[User:Bmrbarre|Ben]]</font><font color="#008000">[[User talk:Bmrbarre|ja]]</font><font color="#000080">[[Special:Contributions/Bmrbarre|min]]</font> 01:22, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::I agree, even though Wikipedia is not censored an image like this is pushing it for a page that will be viewed by such a vast amount of people. These images have a place on Wikipedia, that place is not on the main page in my opinion. What is our next featured image? A close up of a man getting blown up by an RPG? [[User:Dodo48|Dodo48]] ([[User talk:Dodo48|talk]]) 03:12, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Currently on [[Template:POTD/2007-12-04|December 4]] there will be a boy holding a grenade launcher. [[User:Evil Monkey|Evil Monkey]] - [[User talk:Evil Monkey|Hello]] 03:33, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::::These complaints are not new. This is not the first, fifth, tenth, even fiftieth time someone has objected to the main page featured image. The community at large strongly opposes imposing restrictions on what may be shown on the Main Page, and this is very unlikely to change in the future. [[User:RyanGerbil10|RyanGerbil10]]<small>[[User_talk:RyanGerbil10|(Говорить!)]]</small> 04:47, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
:::::Is it the community at large or is it just those who know how to voice their opinions? I doubt you can truly say more people want these images than those who don't based on the entire viewer base of Wikipedia. Don't get me wrong i support that Wikipedia is not censored i just think we should make the main page more universally suitable. Some people take pictures very seriously and can get very uneasy with pictures like these. Those people obviously do not search for pictures like these, why throw one in their face on the main page? Showing a dead young man burning in a picture on a main page is kind of extreme. Please don't respond with "Think about the children!" this is not what i am getting at. [[User:Dodo48|Dodo48]] ([[User talk:Dodo48|talk]]) 05:05, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::::::I'm sorry that you find the realities of our world disturbing. So do I. You may, however, wish to address your complaints to the world rather than to Wikipedia. Censoring Wikipedia to shield readers from the world's horrors (war, in this case) only makes it more likely that those readers will continue their unwitting toleration of those horrors in real life.[[Special:Contributions/71.235.98.141|71.235.98.141]] ([[User talk:71.235.98.141|talk]]) 07:09, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
: Start uploading and nominating pictures you prefer, guys. --[[Special:Contributions/74.13.128.15|74.13.128.15]] ([[User talk:74.13.128.15|talk]]) 06:17, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

::I agree with the first two comments - today's picture should not be shown. Children will be disturbed looking at this picture - and many adults will as well. Please consider who will check out the front page before putting images like this on the front in future. I know Wikipedia is not censored - but with that freedom comes responsibility.[[Special:Contributions/194.105.120.80|194.105.120.80]] ([[User talk:194.105.120.80|talk]]) 08:27, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

The problems is/are who decides and/or how should the community decide what image should appear. --'''[[User:Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">Howard</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">the</font>]] [[User talk:Howard the Duck|<font

color="#FFA500">Duck</font>]]''' 08:52, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

The point is not whether these images should be included in Wikipedia but rather whether presenting them in the Front Page, which I (and other people) use as our home page, without any sort of warning, is fair. It's one thing to find these images while looking for them and another to have them shoved into our faces. For years I had little trouble with this but recently I've been fearing to scroll down to the bottom because of the disturbing imagery. I'm tired of this and will not check the Picture of the Day anymore until some guarantee is given to us that better judgment will be used in the picture selection. Alternatively: how about giving us the option of simply blocking the PotD image, as is the case with the ad for the Wikipedia donations? That would at least give those of us who check the Front Page regularly the ability to do so without effectively having to hide from our own Home Pages. -[[User:Wilfredo Martinez|Wilfredo Martinez]] ([[User talk:Wilfredo Martinez|talk]]) 13:50, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps Wikipedia should just go ahead an implement the "Featured Flower or Non-Predatory Insect That Is Not Mating" [[Special:Contributions/72.10.110.107|72.10.110.107]] ([[User talk:72.10.110.107|talk]]) 13:52, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

:If you care to answer [[User:Howard the Duck]]'s comment above (who will decide what should or should not be shown), then the problem will be solved and no-one offended any more. I think it's an excellent example of the sort of picture which more people should see. Whilst the event it shows happened over half a century ago, the same is happening now to similar people in various places around the world. Perhaps if more young people were exposed to what really happens in conflicts, rather than just receive the sanitised TV versions of events, they might be more informed in later life when it came to choosing who they wish to be led by. [[User:Bazza 7|Bazza]] ([[User talk:Bazza 7|talk]]) 14:34, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::This whole argument about what should and should not get on the front page, whether as TFA, INT, DYK or OTD, goes right to the heart of censorship. People bandy terms such as "better judgement" about, without considering that what one person considers "better" isn't necessarily what another would call it. That's what censorship is about; one person, or a group of people, with their own principles and morals imposing those morals and principles on others. Who is to judge whether one viewpoint or another is correct? Certainly I wouldn't trust anyone who appointed themselves sole arbiter of what we may and may not view, within the bounds of law. The answer can only lie in user choice; whether by allowing users to opt out of seeing the picture (doesn't help non-registered users), to educate users (go get Firefox, install AdBlock, set it up so you don't see the picture, for example), or some other means...that is the question. Anything other than user choice is censorship, and talking about sensitivities or "protect the children" (who play 1st person shoot-em-up video games, watch the blood and gore Hollywood churns out, etc etc) just hides censorship behind "morality" or "good taste". These continuing and pointless debates about individual PoTDs don't get anywhere, and do no good.
::The day that Wikipedia falls into the hands of any group that restricts freedom of choice, freedom of expression, or civil liberties is probably about the day that Jimbo and many other people go off and set up a competitor. [[User:Carre|Carre]] ([[User talk:Carre|talk]]) 15:24, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Wikipedia, by necessity, already restricts all of these things to some extent (even if in some cases only due to legal considerations). It would be better to recognise that and lay down more non-changing rules (beyond the likes of NPOV and others) to clarify exactly what boundaries there are. "Anything goes" is not a Wikipedia principle, even if "Anything you can get away with" is often a de facto principle. [[Special:Contributions/193.1.100.110|193.1.100.110]] ([[User talk:193.1.100.110|talk]]) 15:50, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::::This would be impossible to implement, I tell you. --'''[[User:Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">Howard</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">the</font>]] [[User talk:Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">Duck</font>]]''' 16:14, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
To Wilfredo Martinez, you have every right to not check the picture of the day, that is the proper response to something that disturbs you. You do not have the right, however, to prevent other people from viewing that content. This is an encyclopedia, and I oppose wholeheartedly any censorship, even on the main page. If you don't want to see it, don't scroll down that far. [[User:Mad031683|Mad031683]] ([[User talk:Mad031683|talk]]) 16:38, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

:Perhaps one of the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Main_Page_alternatives alternative main pages] would be to Mr. Martinez's liking. There isn't one that looks exactly like the current layout sans POTD, but [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Main_Page_alternative_%28Classic_2006%29 Classic(2006)] comes close. [[Special:Contributions/72.10.110.107|72.10.110.107]] ([[User talk:72.10.110.107|talk]]) 17:06, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

::''I know it is reality for him, but must this photo be viewed by millions of people every day?''

::This ''is'' reality for millions of people, everyday.[[Special:Contributions/67.173.131.28|67.173.131.28]] ([[User talk:67.173.131.28|talk]]) 19:06, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

:::It's trivial to create one: [[Wikipedia:Main Page alternative (no TFA)]]. This should be exactly the same as the main page, but minus TFA. [[User:Smurrayinchester|<span style="color:#00BB55">Laïka</span>]] 20:54, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::::You mean "no TFP". I'd fix it myself, but I'm not 100% sure how, sorry. [[Special:Contributions/72.10.110.107|72.10.110.107]] ([[User talk:72.10.110.107|talk]]) 21:40, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
:::::Moved. You do it by clicking the 'move' tag at the top of the page, but you have to be a registered user whose account is at least a few days old. [[User talk:Algebraist|Algebraist]] 01:36, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Why are you complaining? The picture isn't easy to see. All you have to do is read the comment. If you don't want to see a dead boy. You can safely avoid it. But this is important. To show the reality of war. Shielding reality is the reason why war hawks and armchair warriors drive nations to wage wars. <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/91.84.107.45|91.84.107.45]] ([[User talk:91.84.107.45|talk]]) 21:35, 27 November 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

I'm not advocating censorship *at all*, I'm defending the right of people not to see disturbing imagery if they don't want to. To those of you who think doing so would increase awareness of injustice, it's a noble idea but such shocking approaches can backfire by driving people *away* from the topics that you want to be discussed; think about that, or better yet, research it here in Wikipedia. Right now, I just want to be able to go back to reading the Main Page every morning without having to wonder what new disturbing image has been posted. I'm going to try the alternatives mentioned, because it would feel really silly to avoid the images just by not scrolling down, especially when many of the FPs HAVE been interesting and educative. -[[User:Wilfredo Martinez|Wilfredo Martinez]] ([[User talk:Wilfredo Martinez|talk]]) 22:52, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm just wondering-have you considered spending your time at [[Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates]]? I mean, there's always plenty of criticism when a controversial image is featured, but at that time nothing can be done about it. If you want such images not to appear on the main page, you should raise the concern at [[WP:FPC]]. This image's [[Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/German V-2 rocket attack aftermath and victim|nomination]] passed with 15 supports, and 0 opposes. The only concern raised was the POV-ness of the caption, and that was fixed. [[User:Puchiko|Puchiko]] ([[User Talk:Puchiko|Talk]]-[[Special:Emailuser/Puchiko|email]]) 22:54, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, but no. I believe I have done my duty to Wikipedia by voicing my concerns here. I have now changed my Home Page to the NFA alternative, that is enough for me. Of course, this doesn't resolve the PR problems the image selection is causing Wikipedia, but that is in other people's hands now. -[[User:Wilfredo Martinez|Wilfredo Martinez]] ([[User talk:Wilfredo Martinez|talk]]) 23:21, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

This debate is as gay as [[Talk:Jyllands-Posten Muhammad cartoons controversy/Arguments/Image-Display|this]]. --'''[[User:Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">Howard</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">the</font>]] [[User talk:Howard the Duck|<font color="#FFA500">Duck</font>]]''' 06:41, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

== Tendentious caption ==

"killed and set aflame" - aside from the fact that "cremated" might be a more accurate description, it begs asking the question whether a dead body can be referred to as a "boy". Coupled with the fact that there is no comment on the allied soldiers casually strolling by, I'd say this is straight American propaganda. Shame on you! [[User:Let&#39;s be impartial|Let&#39;s be impartial]] ([[User talk:Let&#39;s be impartial|talk]]) 06:24, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
:Eh? It does appear to be a boy who was killed and set aflame. I suppose "Two soldiers walk past..." could be prepended, if that helps any. If not, I'm not entirely sure what the nature of your complaint is. &ndash; <span style="font-family: Garamond">[[User:Luna Santin|<font color="#1E90FF">'''Luna Santin'''</font>]] ([[User talk:Luna Santin|talk]])</span> 06:52, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
::1. That's not what "cremation" means.
::2. Are you actually disputing that the picture shows a young boy who has been killed and set aflame?
::3. Those soldiers are British, not American.
::4. Any assertion that those soldiers are "casually strolling by" is not supported by the content of the picture. For all we know, they're "surveying the damage resignedly." Both of these assertions are plausible; neither should be presented in the caption as fact.
::[[Special:Contributions/71.235.98.141|71.235.98.141]] ([[User talk:71.235.98.141|talk]]) 07:09, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

== Why a fair use image on the main page? ==

Didn't Jimbo ban fair use images from the main page? [[:Image:Angel-gabriel.jpg]] is clearly a fair use image since [[Folke Heybroek]], the artist who created this work of art, died in 1983. The work of art depicted is not even 30 years old and [[Panoramafreiheit]] doesn't apply in Sweden. [[User:Valentinian|Valentinian]] <sup>[[User_talk:Valentinian|T]] / [[Special:Contributions/Valentinian|C]]</sup> 08:14, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

:And this image was tagged with {{tl|c-uploaded}} even though the filename corresponds to no image in Wikimedia Commons! --[[Special:Contributions/74.13.128.15|74.13.128.15]] ([[User talk:74.13.128.15|talk]]) 08:33, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

::Not only that, all {{tl|c-uploaded}} images must also include a copy of the source information and the licence tag from the Commons along with the image.[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:C-uploaded&diff=42429072&oldid=41754925] This also helps verify that the source and copyright are correct and valid, especially if the image was uploaded locally here on Wikipedia by a ''non''-admin, which in this case was. '''Clearly, the admin who posted it on DYK missed the ball on that one hi.''' [[User:Zzyzx11|Zzyzx11]] [[User talk:Zzyzx11|(Talk)]] 15:21, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

== Any featured pictures of old white guys? ==

We're <i>so</i> close to the quintuple combo... --- [[User:RockMFR|RockMFR]] 04:48, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
:Very funny :) [[User:Raul654|Raul654]] ([[User talk:Raul654|talk]]) 04:50, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
:*What is the quintuple combo may I ask? -[[User:Susanlesch|Susanlesch]] ([[User talk:Susanlesch|talk]]) 05:23, 28 November 2007 (UTC)
::*Presumably all 5 main page images being of old white men. [[User:Christopher Parham|Christopher Parham]] [[User talk:Christopher Parham|(talk)]] 05:29, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

:I've swapped in a cropped picture of [[Nancy Astor, Viscountess Astor]] at SA/OTD. Hope this helps in WP:CSB for pictures of middle-age white males on MainPage. --[[User:PFHLai|PFHLai]] ([[User talk:PFHLai|talk]]) 06:36, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Revision as of 10:49, 28 November 2007

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