Talk:G-funk

Such a shame that G-Funk is still not the dominant sound in hip-hop, because I've already become tired of the Dirty South's "crunk". G-Funk was a far more versatile sound that could take on a greater range of different tones - aggressive (think "Deep Cover"), laid-back (think "Nuttin' But A G Thang" or "Gin and Juice"), or mellow ("Lil Ghetto Boy"). Crunk, in comparison, is just noisy, obnoxious, and mindlessly rebellious.

Couldn't agree more. G-Funk is the best style of rap by far. Nothing will ever beat it.

Forgot the ones who created G-Funk

I don't want to sound rude, but only write an article if you know what you're talking about. That article isn't that bad, but it forgets a major thing, Above The Law, who are the only ones who deserve credit for originating G-Funk. An article about G-Funk with mentionning Above The law is like an article about General Relativity not mentionning Einstein. I wouldn't know myself how to edit this article in order to make it mention Above The Law, but I'd like that mistake to be fixed.

This http://www.abvdlaw.com/ might be a good source of information for anyone willing to edit this article.

> "In 1992, ATL recorded "Black Mafia Life" which focused on Black enterprises. Around the time Cold 187um established the group’s production company "Black Owned Entertainment." This groundbreaking album featured not only the hit "V.S.O.P.", but the very first "G-Funk" (gangsta funk) record entitled "Call It What You Want" featuring Money B and the late 2Pac from Digital Underground was recorded and released. With this album, Above The Law had created the often imitated and duplicated G-Funk name and sound, but the media decided to overlook that and pen the creation to another famous west-coast producer. Says K-OSS "We the originators of G-Funk, first off, before your Snoop Doggs or Warren G’s…although we don’t try to stay on one type of sound we might go with a slow-type of groove or an up-tempo one. It’s not always that sample of Roger or Parliament.""

Perhaps you could suggest another site. That one is atrocious. I had to read the javascript source just to find anything other than a blank page and then it turns out to be a Flash site, so I can't read it. Is who made the first G-funk a matter of controversy, or is it verifiably certain? The Chronic seems like G-funk to me. Feel free to edit the page to include Above The Law. Tim Ivorson 14:24, 15 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Really I'd like to leave the editing to someone else, as I wouldn't know how to put that into an article, but if you want some more, google "g-funk" "above the law", or read http://www.streethop.com/rapnews/Above_the_Law's_letter_to_the_Source/2400/

You may hear that dre/snoop/warren g created g-funk, that dre/snoop/warren g didnt create g-funk, that above the law created g-funk, but never that above the law didn't create g-funk

http://www.worldwideconnected.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=355 also look at this interview and search "g-funk" in the page to get to the part they talk about the origin of g-funk with "Call It What U Want"

RE: Forgot the ones who created G-Funk

While Above The Law does deserve some credit for helping to bring about G-Funk, they are NOT the pioneers of the genre.

First of all, their album "Black Mafia Life", which they claim is the album on which they pioneered G-Funk, came out in February of 1993, while Dr. Dre's "The Chronic" came out in December of 1992 (check All Music Guide or Amazon for these release dates). Furthermore, even before "The Chronic" came out, Dre had released the single "Deep Cover" (from the soundtrack to the movie of the same name) with Snoop Dogg in April of 1992, which is the song on which he first tried his hand at the G-Funk style.

Second, even on "Black Mafia Life", Big Hutch's production lacks some of the ingredients that define G-Funk. His production did consist of laid-back, slow-rolling tracks that sampled old P-Funk records and used lots of live instrumentation, which is certainly characterisitc of G-Funk. However, G-Funk is also characterized by synthesized, high-pitched keyboard melodies and, more often than not, backing vocals from either talkboxes or female R&B singers (Dre often used Death Row singer Jewell). This is what Dre pioneered on "Deep Cover" (and, to a degree, on the song "Alwayz Into Something" from N.W.A.'s "Efil4Zaggin" album), and popularized on "The Chronic". None of the songs on "Black Mafia Life" follow this template. On the flipside, note that on ATL's third album "Uncle Sam's Curse" (which came out after "Black Mafia Life"), they started to do the same things as Dre; that album's lead single "Black Superman", for instance, contains the same sort of sailing keys heard on "The Chronic" and "Doggystyle".

What's really funny is that in the interviews you've posted, whenever Hutch makes his claim that ATL invented G-Funk, he often talks about how "Black Mafia Life" was released before "Doggystyle" and Warren G's "Regulate", which is true. However, he never references "The Chronic" or "Deep Cover". I think this proves that Hutch doesn't know what he's talking about, because he obviously hasn't done his research. Where I think ATL does deserve SOME credit is for helping to shift gangsta rap from its angry, intense image to the more laid-back "relax and pass the blunt" themes that are best associated with the G-Funk era. If this is the case, then their debut "Livin' Like Hustlers" could be called something of a rough template for G-Funk, since it was a departure from other gangsta rap albums of the time by Ice-T, N.W.A., and the Geto Boys. However, the fact remains that it is Dre whose style came to define what is known today as G-Funk. Anybody who takes a quick look at the release dates and listens to "The Chronic" and "Black Mafia" back-to-back will realize that Dre and Warren G are indeed the ones who deserve credit.

You got some good points. however, I maintain that the term G-Funk was coined by Above The Law (you can hear it said by 2Pac on Call It What U Want, which is supposed being the first track that deserves the title of G-Funk) and that nowhere on The Chronic, you hear the term G-Funk. As for the Chronic's style, it's subjective to say that it's G-Funk style, and easy afterwards to say that it was G-Funk.

That's where I disagree with you, it seems that you want to label something funky and gangsta, like for example The Chronic or Deep Cover or whatever else you want, G-Funk, as if there was nothing both funky and gangsta at the same time before G-Funk was made.

"I think this proves that Hutch doesn't know what he's talking about, because he obviously hasn't done his research."

that's quite funny, as if he needed to do any research... anyways, I keep on disagreeing with you, because since ATL coined the term G-Funk (and I doubt that you can prove that wrong), they are the ones who have the right to define what G-Funk is, and those who appropriate it to themselves, like Dr. Dre or Warren G can shut up.

If you agree with me to say that ATL coined the term G-Funk, then it's a must to admit that they originated it. If you don't agree to say that ATL coined it, but rather Dr. Dre or Warren G coined it, then show me some lyric of a song from before February 1993 where this term appears. --SuperBleda 05:09, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

The person who coined the term does not get a permanent exclusive right to define it. If ATL invented the word "G-funk", then say that and say what they defined it as, but we can't privilege one source over another. Especially in music genres, words are often retroactively applied -- salsa music and the blues, for example, are both often used to describe music made sometimes decades before the words themselves were coined. Tuf-Kat 06:42, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

"The person who coined the term does not get a permanent exclusive right to define it." lol, that's the best want. Can I know why ATL would not be the ones to define the term G-Funk? I mean, all these Death Row rappers stole this term as soon as it came out.

Just look, in The Chronic, which is supposed to be a G-Funk album, the term G-Funk or Gangsta Funk is mentionned 0 times, in Doggystyle, 7 times (I just counted). What happened between The Chronic and Doggystyle? Black Mafia Life! They appropriated to themselves this term as soon as it came out, claimed afterwards that The Chronic was G-Funk, and because of this they should have the right to define what G-Funk is?? Man fuck that, they just stole that word and call their non G-Funk style G-Funk. That's what the article should say, The Chronic, is NOT G-Funk. As for Doggystyle, it's self-claimed G-Funk, but can we say that's what it really is?? You can say that the man who coined the word salsa isn't necessarly anymore the authority to define what salsa music is, this because of the time that separates it's creation and salsa music is great, but the times that separates the appearation of the term G-Funk and it's re-definition is 9 monthes. Did ATL lost the right to be the only one to define what G-Funk is in 9 monthes? I don't think so. Look, it seems that you like all these Death Row rappers much more than me, but here we're doing an encyclopedia, and we gotta show objectivity and common sense. --SuperBleda 15:13, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

I've reverted you at The Chronic. AFAIK, that album is always called G-funk. If you have sources that say it isn't, please explain that it in the article. G funk currently says the genre is sometimes ascribed to Above the Law. What would you like to change it to? Tuf-Kat 15:59, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

You're getting annoying. How could The Chronic be G-Funk if the word G-Funk didn't exist in that time?

"If you have sources that say it isn't, please explain that it in the article" no you, get me some sources from before February 1993 that say this album is G-Funk? oh you can't??? what did people call that when The Chronic came out? That's all I'm asking. The genre displayed gotta be the one displayed when that shit came out. Could we at least get a NPOV tag or something like this on this G-Funk page please?

I've already pointed out that music genres are often applied retroactively. It doesn't matter what anyone called The Chronic in 1993 -- that would be an interesting, though non-essential, addition to The Chronic. What is your NPOV concern regarding There is some debate concerning who first performed G-funk. The progenitor of the sound is variously claimed to be Eazy-E, fellow NWA member Dr. Dre, through his 1992 album The Chronic, or Above The Law? It's short, simple, and explains that different people have different views on where G-funk came from. However, if you'd like to add a NPOV tag to this article, go ahead. Please suggest a replacement wording here on the talk page, if you do. Tuf-Kat 19:15, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

"Please suggest a replacement wording here on the talk page" what you mean? And then, OK, maybe that thing about the NPOV is enough, but um, I never heard anyone claiming that Eazy-E had to do anything with G-Funk... --SuperBleda 17:44, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

Yeah, I wondered about Eazy-E too. I suppose that could be removed unless anyone has any documentation to back it up. Tuf-Kat 17:59, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

The replacement paragraph I've written should be sufficient, though I've excised mention of Eazy-E (he has never claimed to have invented G-Funk...I saw one interview in fact where he backs up ATL on their claims). Anyway, this whole debate over "The Chronic isn't G-Funk because the word wasn't invented" is BS; so what if that word isn't mentioned? We don't know if Dre and Warren G came up with it behind the scenes but simply didn't shout it out on the album, or if ATL did. Tupac saying "G-Funk" on the song "Call It Whatcha Want" may be the first RECORDED use of the term, but that doesn't mean it was the first time ever in human history the phrase was uttered. That is to say, withholding proof, it doesn't give ATL the right to claim they invented the term by itself. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 193.61.200.145 (talk) 01:16, 15 February 2007 (UTC).

To settle this debate

OK, I'd like to recant on a certain point. Earlier, I mentioned how I didn't think "Black Mafia Life" really fit into the G-Funk template. I'd like to take that statement back. I've listened to the album in its entirety (before, I'd only listened to a handful of songs I had on MP3), and I'm starting to appreciate that it is, in fact, very much a G-Funk album in the same vein of "The Chronic"...the whiny synthesizers, wah-wah guitars, Parliament-style bass grooves, etc. are all there. But here's the problem with that...not only do "The Chronic" and "Black Mafia Life" sound a lot alike stylistically, but it's actually pretty obvious that SOMEBODY is copying someone else. I came to this conclusion after listening to ATL's song "Pimp Clinic". Notice anything familiar about it? It sounds a lot like Dre's "Let Me Ride", and the reason for this is because both songs use two of the same samples - "Mothership Connection" and "Swing Down, Sweet Chariot", both by Parliament. And they both derive the hook from the latter song, except that Jewel sings it on "Let Me Ride", while Kokane sings it on "Pimp Clinic". Coincidence? I doubt it, or do I?

The only question is, who came first? "The Chronic" was released first (3 months ahead), but which album was made first? I had a fairly long talk recently with a West World Records/ATL entourage member about this on the group's official web site forums. He linked me to an article from years ago in which Hutch and company claim that they were working on "Black Mafia Life" tracks at Ruthless and that Dre heard some of their work before he left for Death Row, and that he used their style to make "Deep Cover" and later "The Chronic". In other words, they're acknowledging Dre's style is indeed "G-Funk", and also claiming that he copied them. But I don't know if they've shown credible proof that this is true. It makes so little sense to me because "Deep Cover" came out a full YEAR before "Black Mafia Life". Which implies to me that the album was near completion around that time, if Dre copied it. But why did ATL wait a whole year to release "Black Mafia Life", then? I realize delays happen in the music world, but a year to release a completed album? That wouldn't happen unless (A.) Ruthless was short on money for release/promotion or (B.) Ruthless considered the album unmarketable. Neither sounds too plausible, and I've never heard ATL say anything about that.

So to settle this debate, "The Chronic" and "Black Mafia Life" are both G-Funk albums, it's clear ATL came up with the term (since it's never used once on "The Chronic"), and it's also clear, as I said before, that somebody copied somebody else. I'm just not sure who it is yet. If ATL can really provide support for their claim that Dre copied their style and used it to put out both a G-Funk single and a complete G-Funk album before they released their first G-Funk album, then I'll believe them. But I do need to see more proof first. Until then, I consider this an unresolved debate.

Also, one other point - did Eazy-E really ever claim that he invented G-Funk? I've never heard about that. If he did, I would think that Hutch and ATL would be as pissed at him as they are at Dre, since he'd be taking credit for their work (supposedly). But ATL has nothing but praise for Eazy in interviews.

Not to confuse things more, but I have a 12" single by barrington levy from 1991... with a "g-funk" remix of the song. No production credit is given, but it certainly does fit in the "g-funk" style....Reggaedelgado 03:43, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

I doubt we'll ever discover who copied who but its really difficult to decide whether to believe ATL as we all know they must have been quite angry with Dre for not only stealing their sound but for leaving Ruthless to go to DR. You know what rappers can be like whilst beefing.--XdiabolicalX 14:40, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Well, yeah, except that it's pretty much a one-sided beef, since ATL released quite a few diss tracks directed at Dre while Dre (as best I know) has yet to mention them even ONCE in interviews or anywhere else...basically pretending they don't exist. I mean, let's face it...ATL has obviously been trying to play this debate out to draw attention to themselves (even if one believes they are the legitimate inventors of G-Funk) since they've been forgotten while Dre is legendary. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 193.61.200.145 (talk) 01:11, 15 February 2007 (UTC).

Lists of notable stuff

I have removed the lists because they violate WP:NPOV, which is a policy of this site. They violate NPOV by presenting opinions (which albums, performers, etc. are notable) as fact. Tuf-Kat 00:58, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

But WP:N means we have to make a judgment as to what is notable and what isn't. For example, it's assumed that the artists mentioned in Hip hop music meet the notability criteria. I think it would be remiss to have an article on G-funk without telling which artists are part of it. Would you object to me creating List of G-funk artists? Λυδαcιτγ 01:43, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

We don't make that judgement. We rely on cited sources to do that. Eight persons and groups are already mentioned in the article. If anyone additional is notable, they should be included in the article text, along with (referenced) information establishing that notability. I have no qualms with a List of G-funk artists. Tuf-Kat 02:18, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Influence on the Notorious B.I.G. debut

I don't know about the Easy Mo Bee statement, but in the April 2004 issue of XXL, Chucky Thompson said the synth line on "Big Poppa" was influenced by what he was hearing from the West at the time: http://xxlmag.com/online/?p=408

The Real G-Funk

I Been Hearing All This Non Sense About Who Originated The Genre And Here's A Wake Up Call....Who The Fuck Cares??? All I Gotta Say Is That Even If It Was Above The Law Who Invented It, Man It Wasen't Until Dre Tha It Became So Huge And Actually Made Something Out Of It. He Was In My Opinion The One That Made It Such An Influential Genre. Now Listen To All The Artist In The 90's That Were All Affiliated Somehow With Dre, They All Carry The G-Funk Sound!!! You Got Lil Half Dead That Was From The Dogg Pound Crew, Warren G's (Brother Of Dr.Dre)Posse, The Twinz, Dove Shack, Foesum,Tha Dogg Pound, Nate Dogg, Snoop, RBX, Lil C-Style, And The List Goes On & On! So Really Who's To Crae Where It Came From?? I Know I And The Rappers Themselves Don't Care. Why?? Cause Is Music!!! Everyone Got Their Own Style, Period.

Nate Dogg

I can't believe an article was written about G-Funk and not once was Nate Dogg mentioned. He along with Dre and Snoop had one of the most influential impacts on G-Funk and music today.

dopeman?

"There has been some debate over who should be considered the "father of G-funk." Dr. Dre is generally believed to have developed the sound; the first hints of the whiny syn-leads and Parliament Funkadelic-style bass grooves in Dre's work appeared on N.W.A.'s single "Alwayz Into Something" from their 1991 album Efil4zaggin." Did Dre produce Dopeman from NWA and the Posse because it sounds pretty G-funky too?--72.198.15.206 (talk) 16:23, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

The fathers of G-Funk is Above Tha Law...Eazy-E Said it himself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Souljaman (talk • contribs) 12:49, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Here are the facts. Above the Law coined the term "G-Funk". The Chronic came out before Black Mafia Life. The Chronic is considered a G-Funk album. Those are the facts. What this says to me is that Dr. Dre came up with the sound and ATL put a name on it. Just because ATL came up with the name doesn't mean they invented G-Funk. Look at hip hop. DJ Kool Herc is considered the one who "invented" hip hop but he was not the one to give it a name. As for Dre stealing the sound, think about it. He was THE sound behind N.W.A. Dre even produced ATL's first album. I think it more likely ATL were in the studio learning from Dre and HE influenced THEM68.164.85.197 (talk) 21:26, 31 March 2008 (UTC)