Talk:One Piece

Franchise Value

It would be interesting to know the value of this franchise. This is currently probably the most popular currently running manga/anime series in Japan right now. Its sold 140 million volumes which means that its gross worth has been in the billions alone. 128.189.169.23 (talk) 07:39, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Its the third highest selling overall. It hasn't yet gotten to the level Dragon Ball once did, but seems likely as its still on going. For "value of franchise" though, that would be really subjective, and most Japanese companies (and even the American licensors) rarely talk dollars in reporting sales, but rather number of volumes moved. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 08:43, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Cursed/Devil Fruits

I see mentions of them here in this article along with many various sub-articles and they seem to be a notable part of the series, but there's nothing here that explains what they are. This should prbably be fixed.- Norse Am Legend (talk) 23:22, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

The article and list on Devil Fruits were both deleted per consensus as they are not notable in the real world. At best, in those places where they are mentioned, the first mention should give a brief 2-3 word summation of what they are. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 23:29, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Nifty. I think it would be more useful to first-time readers of the subject if basic information on the item were stated in the main article though. Or rather, a basic setting/themes section/article be created to contain information on these items and other bits and pieces of relevant information that seem to exist in a dozen other OP articles. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 23:34, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

If depends. A themes section must be fully sourced to third-party reliable sources. There is some work underway to make a precedent for some of these uber-long series that hit a lot of places to work on a single appropriate spin out article to cover stuff like that, but its still very much a WIP so no example to really look at. For settings, that could be appropriate, as long as it is kept brief and is properly sourced. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 23:42, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Right, basically, if something is confusing or poorly defined, feel free to clarify; saying what devil fruits are is something that should be in the article, but a list of all devil fruits should not be. Doceirias (talk) 23:46, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

(edit conflict)I was thinking of something along the lines of what World of Naruto is attempting to do, which is cover just about every important aspect the series' universe pretty concisely. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 23:49, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

It looks like that article only has three sources, sometimes it's kinda good to think about the aftermath before you make an article. I can imagine the people who created that page are pretty screwed right about now in that sort of area. Why make an article, put so much hard work into it, and have to scrap the whole thing. : ( Definatly not worth it.... – J U M P G U R U @^{Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia} 23:54, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

As it has been commented in a discussion World of Naruto should be merged with Jutsu since they are not able to pass notability by themselves. However, the merge still has not been made.--Tintor2 (talk) 23:55, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Well damn, that's a pretty horrible idea if I've ever heard one before. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 23:57, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, its the only way that World of Naruto and Jutsu could be GA.--Tintor2 (talk) 23:58, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

But not all of World of Naruto is about Jutsus.... – J U M P G U R U @^{Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia} 00:01, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Ops, I meant that Jutsu are going to be merges in World of Naruto--Tintor2 (talk) 00:02, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, the World of Naruto is still very much a WIP and in need of a lot of work to make it notable and avoid an AfD. I knew one of the big series was getting started on it in a more serious way though. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 00:05, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

From the lead: "One Piece follows the adventures of Monkey D. Luffy, a 17 year old boy, who gained supernatural abilities by eating a magical fruit, and his ragtag crew of heroic pirates, named the Straw Hats." and from the characters section: "By accidentally eating a Devil Fruit, his body gained the properties of rubber." Isn't that enough for the average reader to understand what it is? Further more, I am keeping an eye on virtually all sub-articles, and let me tell you: They are without exception of lower quality than this one. Just because those articles give more information, doesn't mean, that this one should too. (If at all - it's the other way around.) -- Goodraise (talk) 00:07, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

It's somewhat misleading and vague, sounding like the devil fruit is a one-of-a-kind thing exclusive to the main character. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 00:10, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

More from the characters section: "gained human properties by eating a Devil Fruit"; "ate a Devil Fruit and gained the ability to create copies of any part of her body on surfaces in her proximity"; "resurrected by means of a Devil Fruit". Perhaps you should read the article, before you start complaining about it. -- Goodraise (talk) 00:26, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

There's really no need for that tone. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 02:09, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Back on the subject of the "World of One Piece" idea, are there currently any decent articles on fictional universes to use as a good basis for it? - Norse Am Legend (talk) 18:34, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Couldn't find anything, but if you're intend to try this, I'd suggest starting from Grand Line. Though it's not a good article, it seems reasonable to begin from One Piece's main setting. -- Goodraise (talk) 19:34, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Wow, I like how that article along with East Blue and North Blue aren't even anywhere in the big table template thing at the bottom of the main page. This series of articles really does need a bit of a rehaul. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 19:38, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Stating with a merge of those three would seem to be a good place to start. Maybe leave a note with User:Sephiroth BCR as I believe he has been working on the World of style articles, so he might be able to offer some good suggestions if one (or both) of y'all would like to take on that task. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 23:11, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Done some more searching: World of Monkey Island might be a good article to take as example. -- Goodraise (talk) 04:43, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

That doesn't seem like a very good article. No sources, lots of pointless info, etc. If that were an anime-based article it would probably be deleted right now, but since Monkey Island is really awesome it's given more leniency by the Wikipedia elite. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 22:31, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

"Pointless info" is exactly the point (no pun intended). The only reason to make articles like "World of XYZ" is to cram together enough "pointless" material, as to make it less likely to be deleted, easier to maintain, and so forth... And whatever would go into World of One Piece, would with all likelyhood be the "pointless" material from all those random One Piece articles. For example, you might wanna take a look at the histories of the 9 movie articles I merged in here. I cut them down to around 1%. The rest were "pointless" infos like plot iteration and triva. - Don't get me wrong, if you wanna make that article, go ahead. It won't turn out worse than what we have now. But don't fool yourself. What you'll end up with, won't be better than World of Monkey Island. -- Goodraise (talk) 22:57, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

A world of article that is nothing but unsourced, pointless info will end up at AfD. A good world of article, well sourced, sticking to out-of-universe writing, with third party sourcing, not just primary sourcing, and keeping things brief, might survive. Anything else that's just an obvious dumping ground for "fancruft" (for lack of a better world), will go up for deletion pretty quick. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 23:26, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

I think the devil fruits should be mentioned, but just the basics like the paramecia, zoan, logia, the seastone negating their powers, and how they can't swim in water. As for the users, just like how spiderman, superman, even the flash have their abilities in detail, i feel their abilities like luffy and robins should be in more detail, but not their attacks, we don't need another attack list. As for the types i think we should have some pictures to show how drastic these fruits can be. Paramecia should have buggy's pic with his body chopped up, zoan you can have choppers forms, maybe even the rumble ball forms, and logia should have crocodile using the sand fruit. Sanji_1990 (talk) 22:29, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

As it is related to the creation of World of One Piece, as suggested in this thread, I think it's best to mention this here. -- Goodraise (talk) 00:53, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Romance Dawn

I'd like to recommend that Romance Dawn is restored since it's a movie on this year's Jump Super Anime Tour and there's no trace of the notable information in this article. --Defchris (talk) 13:02, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Declined. The old page had no notable information either, just plot summaries. If there is some specific information from there you think was missed in the merge or that you feel is missing regarding Romance Dawn, feel free to suggest that specific info be added (along with sources, of course). Romance Dawn on its own is not notable. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 14:20, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

I though Wikipedia was a place where everybody's opinion count - seems as if the English language version is going to take over the very bad habits of the German's. Merging information, merging articles will always lead into unprecise and so really unnotable information. If a reader wants to know sth. about Romance Dawn and is lead to One Piece where almost nothing of Romance Dawn is even mentionned (but two sentences) I guess it'd be very confusing. Okay then do what you want - I keep on working on the German article, until someone arrives and wants to play "deletion request". -- Defchris (talk) 20:04, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Merged pages

So why was everything merged when there was no consensus to do so? Gune (talk) 22:56, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps you could be more specific? -- Goodraise (talk) 23:13, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Movie pages for example. Gune (talk) 23:55, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

I merged the movie pages, because they didn't meet WP:FICT. -- Goodraise (talk) 00:22, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

Lack of objection to the mere after it was tagged for an appropriate time = silent consensus. The merges have all been appropriate as the film's fail WP:N and the film notability guidelines.-- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 01:43, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

To put it in a less robotic tone, there wasn't really any information on the movie pages besides a large summary of the plot so not much was lost in merging them to here. For bigger summaries on the movies and etc, the One Piece Wikia is good for that. - Norse Am Legend (talk) 19:33, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

Romance Dawn Again (When were they published?)

I am a little confused right now. In Wanted! on page 202, Oda states, that the version of Romance Dawn in Wanted! is the second one, whlile the first was not yet published. The article on the other hand currently states, that both were first printed in 1996's Jump special. Can anyone clear things up for me? -- Goodraise (talk) 03:35, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

The ANN source says both were published in WSJ, with the first also published in the Red Data book, and the second in Wanted!. The earlier version said the same thing, I just reworded it some. Alas, no one seems to have WSJ in our magazine library, so hopefully someone else can help clarify if ANN misstated or not. Also, please stop changing the article. The ANN source says BOTH were published in the special summer issue. If you disagree, find another reliable source (or two) to oppose ANN's statements, but until then please stop changing it.-- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 03:43, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Let me clear the whole situation up for you. From http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2008-07-10/one-piece-prototype-romance-dawn-to-be-animated you put into the article the statement, that the two one-shots were first published in 1996. That confused me, because it seems to be a contradiction to what Oda said in Wanted! on page 202 (see above). THAT is where your misunderstanding begins. You stated in your reply (first part of it, see version history of this talk page): "The ANN source says both were published in WSJ, with the first also published in the Red Data book, and the second in Wanted!. The earlier version said the same thing, I just reworded it some." The mistake on your part, which I was trying to point out, was not disagreeing with me, but as I stated in the edit summary, as I first reverted it, a "rewording mistake". From there, you didn't even consider the possibility of being wrong and instead assumed, that I, without a source, had simply decided, that my opinion was worth more than that of ANN. In order to clear things up right there, I stated in the summary of my second revert, that it's about a different matter, than the one I brought up in this very topic. Furthermore, I added to the edit summary the following quote: "Weekly Shonen Jump's Summer Special issue and 41st issue of 1996", from the very source you keep talking about (in your two reverts; both parts of you comment above this one; and on my talk page). This very quote, is what you "reworded" into "the 1996 summer special issue of Weekly Shōnen Jump." Obviously, the only thing you read of that edit summary was: "you made a mistake".

Now, once again, leaving all the edit history aside: "Weekly Shonen Jump's Summer Special issue and 41st issue of 1996" does NOT reword to "the 1996 summer special issue of Weekly Shōnen Jump", unless "Weekly Shonen Jump's Summer Special issue [...] of 1996" and "Weekly Shonen Jump's [...] 41st issue of 1996" are one and the same (in which case I apologize in advance for the following paragraph).

Conclusion: You don't read the sources you reword and you don't read the summaries of the edits you revert either. No wonder you have +30.000 edits... I realize, that I am close to a personal attack here, and I'm not happy to be. But this seems to be the only way to catch your attention, as I don't wage edit wars. Which is also why I'll "stop changing it". I will leave that to you. -- Goodraise (talk) 05:56, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

There was no "close" about it. That was a personal attack and a completely inappropriate and unfounded one. I used the ANN article to source the whole paragraph, which I rewrote. "da drew Romance Dawn as two separate pirate stories that ran in Weekly Shonen Jump's Summer Special issue and 41st issue of 1996" can be taken both ways. I took it one, you obviously took it another. You could have simply noted that they are different issues when I left the message on your talk. The nastiness was totally unnecessary. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 06:28, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

I said why it appeared neccesary to me, to resort to these kind of words, namely to at least get you to read, what I have to say. I even gave examples, of where you did these things (weather or not I was right about these, doesn't matter in this context), so it was not unfounded. If you used the article to source a statement, a parapraph or the whole section has nothing to do with anything, unless (and I'll assume this isn't the case) you still don't understand that the matter, I brought up in the first post of this topic, is a seperate one. Pointing out, that the quote can be understood in two seperate ways, is exactly what I did in the edit summary. That I didn't say, that the WSJ issues are different ones, is because I didn't (and still don't) know if they are. My version simply maintains the ambiguity of the ANN article's wording, while your version does not, making it a "rewording mistake".

I may be stepping over the line, by directly saying things as I see them, but this isn't about personal attacks (in the sense of attacking a person instead of argueing against that person's proposal/idea) or about wordings, it's about you, treating others as if they only have half a brain, because this behaviour of yours (broadly laid out above) left me little choice. It's about your selfrighteousness, arroganz, disrespect towards others and complete lack of the ability to admit mistakes. Or to put it in your language, you constantly, to some extent, violate WP:NOTBATTLEGROUND (yes, I do realize that this very post is in violation of it). If you without halt throw stones in every direction, some will return to you.

I could understand you becoming impatient and unnerved with the crowd of fancruft advocates in this project over the past three years, but treating everyone, even those sharing your oppinions on rules and guidelines, like myself, in this manner, is not acceptable. -- Goodraise (talk) 18:57, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

You gave no explanation at all, just called it a "rewording" mistake without bothering to ask about it, and then presumed I was changing because of this topic - which I do fully realize were two different questions. But, anyway, I won't bother with this anymore. You apparently just wanted an excuse to launch two lengthy personal attacks when my messages to you about this were perfectly polite and civil, as were my edit summaries. You are the only one being disrespectful here. I hope it makes you happy. You beat me all up. Thanks. Glad I made your day. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 19:21, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

"You gave no explanation at all" is plain wrong. Here is the edit summary: "Undid revision 233673049 by Collectonian matter unrelated to issue on talk page; you made a mistake, unless "Weekly Shonen Jump's Summer Special issue and 41st issue of 1996" are one and the same..." If it's lengthy you don't like it. If it's short, you don't read it. But don't worry, I am finished bothering with it too (ironic thing to say, isn't it?). -- Goodraise (talk) 19:37, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Which didn't explain anything. It did not explain that you felt the ANN report was ambiguous. Instead, I took it to mean you felt the original wording, which that replicated, was correct despite the ANN report. You could have simply left a short note to explain what you meant. But ah well. Glad you got to vent and get it all out of your system. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 21:03, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

My copy of Red is buried too deep to dig out - I would bet it actually means Akamaru Jump. Then the second version was in the main magazine, leading to a serial - a standard progression that many manga have followed. Doceirias (talk) 22:32, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

"Fruit" vs. "No Mi"

I'm sorry, but why does every One Piece related article call the Devil Fruits "____ ____ No Mi" instead of "____ ____ Fruit"? "No Mi" MEANS Fruit, leaving it untranslated is simply Fanboy Nonsense. I move that all pages have that changed to "Fruit" (User DemonRin) 10:03, 16 September 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.251.122.110 (talk) 17:15, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Any specific examples? All of the articles should be using the English names. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 17:06, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

All of them I believe. I know Luffy's does, it also used to say "Nakama" before I just now changed it. Blackbeard's entry in the minor characters section did... Let me see how many more I can find, but I think it's every article,

Luffy's does, Robin's Does, Brook's Does, Chopper's Does NOT (Surprizingly) it lists "Hito Hito no mi" in Parenthasis though, and it seems EVERY Devil's fruit mentioned on the "List of One Piece characters" Page also uses "No Mi" (User DemonRin) 10:10, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm...any other editors to the One Piece articles want to chime in on why this was done, and how we go about fixing it? These should all be using the official English names for these items, not the romanji. -- [[::User:Collectonian|Collectonian]] ([[::User talk:Collectonian|talk]] · [[::Special:Contributions/Collectonian|contribs]]) 17:17, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

May I point out: the issue was first brought up by TTN here; a short but related discussion happened here; and currently there is an ongoing debate on weather English names, Japanese names, or no names at all should be used here. To avoid edit warring, I suggest participating in the later discussion, before making any more changes. -- Goodraise (talk) 18:17, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

I haven't edited anything yet, but that debate seems to be about including the Fruits Period, not the Odd Idea of leaving it in Japanese. (User DemonRin) 11:36, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

If you want the names changed to English, say it there. It's the right place, believe me. -- Goodraise (talk) 19:04, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

I recall an older discussion on One Piece terminology which concluded that most should be left in Japanese for the sake of consistency. It was mostly focused on attack names for the episode summaries, but the same principle may apply here: The series isn't all published in English, and the English names are rarely literal translations. Therefore, since we don't know what the correct English terms are going to be, it's simpler to keep them in Japanese. You may or may not find the logic compelling, but I think it's worth pointing out. --erachima talk 19:44, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

A link to that discussion might be useful, though it's probably overruled by project guideline anyways. -- Goodraise (talk) 20:42, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Yes, a link to that discussion would be nice. And I'm not talking about the Names of the Fruits, just turning "No Mi" to "Fruit". IE, Gomu Gomu no Mi would be put as "Gomu Gomu Fruit" (User DemonRin) 14:00, 16 September 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 161.38.223.226 (talk)

Age of characters

I think the age stuff stated in this article must be removed. that's because the sources used as references for their ages were published at different volumes. the first is volume 4 which I believe was published in 1998. next is volume 7 published in 1999. Then volume 19, published in 2001. Then, it is volume 44 published in 2006. The story progresses as time goes on, so their ages too. Luffy, Zoro, Nami, Ussop and Sanji at the start of the series were 17, 19, 18, 17 and 19 respectively. The ages of chopper, robin, franky and brooke were stated in sources published much later. So this means that the ages the crew have in this article are not of the same OP world time. The latest chapters are already years ahead from the very beginning. There's no way, in my opinion, of giving the correct number of years that has already passed and that's why I suggest the ages be removed and not be updated. eStaRapapax ^{xapaparatse! exsatpaarpa!} 10:26, 1 October 2008 (UTC)