Talk:Missing (American TV series)

International broadcast

I have provided multiple references in the past to support edits stating that this show had its world TV premiere in India. This is a first for any English-language series in this country, and was duly mentioned in major newspapers (which I linked to). I believe this is a tangential but certainly notable fact about this series, and a mention of the same should be made in the article. However, for some reason every single edit mentioning this has been systematically deleted by a user with the dynamic IP address 59.97.x.y. The article history will clearly show the vandalism being done by this user, whose sole purpose seems to be to delete all references to the fact above, for reasons unknown. I request a moderator here to keep an eye on such vandalism to this article in the future. Simply undoing someone's edits without providing any proper explanation for the same is simply ridiculous and I'm sure must be against Wikipedia's rules, so I do hope someone makes a note of this and prevents similar idiotic edits. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.177.15.34 (talk) 22:10, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

I just created a table with all the countries' broadcasts and will keep an eye on any unnecessary removals. Most people on here edit without listing a reason, which is annoying, but can't be controlled. However, vandalism is not tolerated on Wikipedia for any reason, whether funny or just because someone doesn't like what was said. We'll keep an eye on it for you. — WylieCoyote (talk) 20:06, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

This India business has gotten out of hand. An Indian paper claims it made the world premiere in India, which is fine. It's a big deal IN INDIA, but not as a whole. It's an American series, we're documenting American broadcast dates, and the American premiere belongs in the lead. I've moved the note about the early premiere date in India to the international section, where it belongs. --Drmargi (talk) 21:37, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I agree with that, forgetting about the WP:MOS rule about a show's "country of origin." But I still don't see people's fascination with removing it from the page altogether. — WylieCoyote (talk) 23:56, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Series Synopsis and DVD Information Added

I've added some minor information pertaining to the series synopsis description as well as the DVD information as recently announced by TV Shows on DVD. Reference was also added for proof. 98.209.246.195 (talk) 13:47, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Actually, what you've done is plagiarized two sources and posted copyrighted material in violation of WP:COPY. To cite your grade school teachers, use your own words! --Drmargi (talk) 14:54, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

And you even removed the plot information I added from wikipedia cited sources? That's why Wikipedia sucks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.209.246.195 (talk) 15:48, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Drmargi is correct here. Sourced or not, you don't plagiarize another source's information and put it on Wikipedia, which is exactly what was done verbatim. Write your own material, then put it here. This holds true for Leads, Plots, Episode Summaries, even DVD releases. — WylieCoyote (talk) 19:57, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

98, when you plagiarize content as comprehensively as you do you run the risk of wholesale reverts, even if some of what you added is original information. It's not my job to pick through it and find what might follow policy; it's yours to adhere to WP:COPY, thus assuring what you add won't be reverted. If Wikipedia "sucks" (can't you come up with anything more original than that tired word?) because it kept you from representing another's work as your own, that's a good thing in my book. --Drmargi (talk) 20:53, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

98, you did the same thing here for Episode 22, which I removed. You took it from TV Fanatic's finale details, which I doubt you wrote. The point Drmargi and I are trying to make is: it's okay to put anything on Wiki, as long as it's in your own words. Keep plagiarizing, and someone will flag and check everything you do. — WylieCoyote (talk) 01:28, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Show Editing

When the pilot episode was repeated, did any of you watch close enough to notice if the show was edited down for more commercial time. I remember thats what happened on CBS, when the short-lived series "Smith," with Ray Liotta, aired. Great show. It was an action show with lots of location shooting like Missing. Only difference was the main character is a criminal, instead of law enforcement. It was a great show, but maybe it should have been produced as a ten-part mini-series. Maybe some of you noticed the same thing on missing. Probably a point, that you dont want to put into the article, although a brief mention might be made. 74.166.156.250 (talk) 20:03, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Unless a reliable source, meaning newspaper or magazine, notices and reports about the editing, it can't be added here. AMC's show Mad Men cut down their episodic production schedule to accommodate more commercial time too. I don't think it was added to their articles either. Most shows run about 42-47 minutes without commercials. Those times are added in with most main series pages. And that doesn't mean the episodes can't air two minutes of a show then five minutes of a commercial at a time. — WylieCoyote (talk) 00:05, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Aha: You say Mad Men cut down their episodic production schedule. With specific regard to "Missing,"I was not talking about episodic production schedules. Read what I wrote; I said "When the pilot episode was repeated, did you notice if the show was edited down." Im talking about episodic production that is aired once or twice, and then the repeats are trimmed down from the original broadcast, for more ad time. Its something I've see done with other shows; I frankly dont like the practice. 206.192.35.125 (talk) 13:10, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

International Broadcast, again

As was mentioned above, "Missing" airs in India on Sundays, four days prior to the US airdates. As from episode three, it also airs in Canada on Tuesdays, two days prior to the US. Unsure which of these is considered the relevant "Original Air Date", I've added all two/three dates to the episode listing, with annotations and refs. Anyone with a firmer grip on policy/precedent, please feel free to (re)move the extraneous bits. - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 12:13, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

But why just the Indian dates, Why not Bulgaria, Russia, Romania, Hungary? - 117.219.115.244 (talk) 12:20, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Because the Indian and Canadian airdates are the only ones preceding the American ones, making them at least viable candidates for the field "Original Air Date". Succeeding dates are of no concern either way. - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 12:24, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

As its an American show, the American air dates are considered as the original air dates. - 117.219.115.244 (talk) 12:27, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

It aired on the same day in USA, Canada, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Poland, Serbia and Slovakia. And according to GMT it aired in the European countries before USA. So, if you post the Indian dates then the dates of these countries too should be posted. - 117.219.115.244 (talk) 12:31, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

There's a simple solution to the endless edit warring and vandalism in aid of "We saw it first!" I've changed the heading on the table to read ORIGINAL U.S. AIRDATE. It's an American show, and as ducky as it is that India gets it four days early, the primary viewing audience is American, and we're tracking American ratings, so the American airdates need to be in the table. I have no idea where this mania for removing India from the international broadcast table is all about, but the IP vandals are all from India, and the registered vandal has been warned twice. --Drmargi (talk) 12:46, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I agree that the US airdates should absolutely be given - for the sake of current utility, if nothing else. The questions, as I see it, is whether global original airdates are of encyclopedic relevance in and of themselves. Clearly, a case could be made. Off the top of my head, I remember three episode listings which concerned somewhat similar situations:

- List of Stargate Atlantis episodes includes US and Canadian airdates for a "Canadian-American" production.

- List of Caprica episodes includes US and Canadian airdates for an "American" production.

- List_of_Primeval_episodes includes German airdates for a "British" production. Possibly Germany was involved in a co-production deal for that season, though, I'm uncertain.

Doesn't conclusively support one view or the other, it seems to me, thus my asking for more guidance. However, discounting India simply on the grounds that it is somehow seen as more exotic and less relevant to American viewers than Canada seems a bit iffy to me, so I'd err on the side of caution and give both a global and a domestic "original" date. - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 13:11, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

This is an American production, period. Stargate was, as you say, a joint production, as are a good few others. The sci-fi editors get pretty nationalistic and possessive of their shows, so editor consensus plays a role there (I'd remove the Canadian dates from Caprica, for example.) I can't speak to Primeval beyond knowing the latter seasons are British/Irish productions with involvement from BBC America. Meanwhile, there are a good few British/American productions, notably Downton Abbey, that don't include US airdates. Another problem with the international dates is how few are sourced, and we don't know we have accurate first episode dates for each country or the accurate first broadcast of each episode. That it's India is an assumption based on a lot of noise made by the Indian broadcaster that stops short of saying 'first international broadcast'. Sometimes, you go with what works best, and in this case, that's clearly the U.S. dates. We're talking about a ten-episode series that probably won't be renewed, based on its ratings and what ABC has renewed so far. It's not worth becoming a battleground. --Drmargi (talk) 13:22, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for taking the time to convince me. :) - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 13:36, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

No problem. I also tagged your talk page with a 3RR warning just as a heads up; you're OK for now, but were getting a bit close. --Drmargi (talk) 13:38, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Yep, I saw the notice just now. I actually adhere to a (self-imposed) 1RR policy at all times, so you needn't have worried. :) - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 13:46, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Oh, one further question, just for future reference: Does the "of origin" argument only apply to countries, or also to individual channels/companies? If, for some hypothetical reason, this series were to air on another US channel the day before it aired on ABC, which date would be the relevant one, considering that it's an ABC production? - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 13:58, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm not sure, given that wouldn't happen in the U.S. --Drmargi (talk) 18:07, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Harrumph. - 46.115.0.103 (talk) 18:24, 28 March 2012 (UTC)