Talk:Rif Dimashq offensive (August–October 2012): Difference between revisions

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Military history: Middle East Start‑class

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Contested deletion

The page describes a battle already listed as the 2011-2012 Damascus clashes. We even have the events of Aug 22-23 listed on that page. Furthermore article name is pov pushing and out of format with the others as well, but my point is that this article is just a copy of an already longstanding article. Sopher99 (talk) 10:21, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

All that gets added to the 2011-2012 Damascus clashes. Your article is just a copy split from the original page.Sopher99 (talk) 10:56, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The Damascus clashes page is just a compilation of various hit and run operations and some counter attacks. It comes from November 2011 until the Battle of Damscus.

After the battle of Damascus, there is no return to the previous situation. The Syrian Army has started a whole operation to crush the insurgents and it is different from all the operation launched before. --DanielUmel (talk) 11:18, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

They have been trying ot do that the entirety of the conflict, and its all described in the 2011-2012 Damascus clashes article. Sopher99 (talk) 11:39, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The notability of the article is out of the question. Many newspaper are writing about the event, as everyone is able to see that and if someone want's to create a new, more detailed article about the event even better. Nevertheless, this article gives more details about the operation and should remain; with time it could be even more expanded. --Wüstenfuchs 12:45, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Name dispute

It should be listed as battle or clashes, like the rest of the articles. No where else in Wikipedia are articles on battles listed as "counter-insurgency operations". Sopher99 (talk) 12:03, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Furthermore we call it whatever the media calls it. The reliable sources have never once used the term "counter-insurgency". They have described the fighting as battles and clashes though. Sopher99 (talk) 12:04, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You could rename it the Rif Damashq offensive, because the very first source in the article calls it an offensive. Sopher99 (talk) 12:08, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, Rif Damashq offensive seems a much better name and in line with the sources. ~~ Lothar von Richthofen (talk) 16:50, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

About the name, we should consider the WP:COMMONNAME. --Wüstenfuchs 17:32, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Right. Not even SANA [1] [2] [3] calls it a "counter-insurgency". ~~ Lothar von Richthofen (talk) 17:45, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You think counter-insurgency is POV? Not at all. The Free Syrian Army is composed out of insurgents. Well, nevertheless, it's not important what the Syrian Arab News Agency is writing, but every newspaper. Which name is mostly used? --Wüstenfuchs 17:58, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I think that "Counter-Insurgency" is just fine. There are various article with a similiar name, like Counter-insurgency operations during the Second Chechen War also some anti-partisan operations during the WW2. Also, it's impossible that this name is someone's POV. --Wüstenfuchs 12:50, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I would go with Rif Damashq offensive (2012). Also, I would put the start date as 17 August, the day the military started to clear the towns and villages on the outskirts of Damascus from where the military airport was mortared by the rebels. EkoGraf (talk) 19:19, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I tried to see how many results will I get after I enter counterinsurgency in google search, and I gott only few results. I also agree we raname it to offensive, and I would also add that we should follow a more common name, not Rif Damashq but Rif Dimashq. --Wüstenfuchs 19:24, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. EkoGraf (talk) 19:41, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

So the name is Rif Dimashq offensive (August 2012 - Present) or just Rif Dimashq offensive? --Wüstenfuchs 20:24, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think the (August 2012 - Present) is needed. I think Rif Dimashq offensive is just ok, because before this now the military didn't attempt any real offensives in the area since the start of the war. There was only the counter-attack from back in February when they retook Douma and Zabadani. EkoGraf (talk) 20:29, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Battle over

Is this battle over?--Vojvodae please be free to write :) 22:00, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

To be honest, I'm not sure what the scope of this article is suppose to be. There are definitely clashes still going on at Damascus's suburbs. -- FutureTrillionaire (talk) 23:00, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It's not over yet. From what I've been told this is the most important battle taking place at the moment. The main force of the Syrian Army is concentrating on the Damascus region and the rebels have congregated around Harasta and Douma. It's a shame more attention isn't being placed on this battle from credible wikipedia worthy sources. 62.31.145.100 (talk) 13:20, 2 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 54: / Line 54: @@
 Is this battle over?--[[user:vojvodaen|Vojvodae]] [[user talk:vojvodaen|please be free to write :)]] 22:00, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
 :To be honest, I'm not sure what the scope of this article is suppose to be. There are definitely clashes still going on at Damascus's suburbs. --[[User:Futuretrillionaire| FutureTrillionaire]] ([[User talk:Futuretrillionaire|talk]]) 23:00, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
+It's not over yet. From what I've been told this is the most important battle taking place at the moment. The main force of the Syrian Army is concentrating on the Damascus region and the rebels have congregated around Harasta and Douma. It's a shame more attention isn't being placed on this battle from credible wikipedia worthy sources. [[Special:Contributions/62.31.145.100|62.31.145.100]] ([[User talk:62.31.145.100|talk]]) 13:20, 2 November 2012 (UTC)