Talk:Jasenovac i Gradiška Stara

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Problems: "immensely popular" is POV, the poll cited is, IIRC, unscientific "call this number if you support X" thing etc. --Elephantus 10:29, 7 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

SrbIzLike hiding the truth?

I invested quite an effort in finding the source of picture image:Lipadom.jpg and when I finally found out that it was taken in Austria.

I could even delete it from this article because it was not taken in Croatia, but, as a compromise, I decided to just update the caption.

Now, SrbIzLike seams to have the problem with me providing the proof that people on the picture were not under jurisdiction of Croatian police, whick kind of undermines the point hat he is trying to make.

Now, I would kindly ask SrbIzLike to leave my caption because I believe that the additional information I provided is quite relevant for the subject!

--Ante Perkovic 11:02, 23 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Image Lipadom.jpg is taken in Austria, but it's about Croats, who go there every year in May to remember the Bleiburg massacre. Some of them wear the Ustasa uniforms like those that can be seen on the picture, and it is very likely that the people on the picture are Croats.

The sentence "According to recent polls, almost 60% of Croats think very highly of the Ustasha regime, and they are the main audience of such songs" is extremely POV, as well as unsourced. I am deleting it. Mihovil 04:52, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

User:SrbIzLike is a sockpuppet of the banned user PaxEquilibrium. Kubura (talk) 07:56, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Popularized"?

The article incorrectly states that the song was popularized by Thompson in the early 00s. This is not true: the song never became popular, most Croatians first heard it when the tape (presumably recorded in the 90s) resurfaced and was aired on Latinica, a high-profile talk show on Croatian national television. The tape was accompanied with video footage of Ustasha atrocities, clearly condemning it.

I've never heard of it being performed in public (or in private), by Thompson or anyone else. 213.147.97.170 14:29, 17 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Rjecina

Rječino, dont think that I have not read those lies about me. I cant belive how evil zou are. --CreationSCS (talk) 14:53, 9 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

User:CreationSCS is a sockpuppet of the banned user PaxEquilibrium. Kubura (talk) 07:56, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

And if we would try to talk about music, and not bias????

I've put on some phrases more trying to explain what kind of song is really Jasenovac i Gradiska stara, in MUSICAL terms. It because in nearly all of sources it was portrayed like some sort of nazi propaganda, or skinsheads hate song, not the ( still hideous) macabre humor drunkmen's song it is.

Hope it will perceived like a contribution to that mithycal neutral point of view, they always talking about.

Ah, and I like Marko a lot the same!!!Neka vide da nas ima!!!!

Marcellogo (talk) 00:46, 11 January 2008 (UTC)Marcellogo[reply]

P.S. And Crnaci means really Negroes in croatian, it is sarcastical however... and also calling someone a black (evil to the root) man it is a bloody insult in croatian and serb language. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marcellogo (talk • contribs) 00:39, 11 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Marcellogo, you're wrong. Or you've shown serious lack of knowledge or very bad intention, because you've misrepresented data in sensible topics.
First, word "crnaci" doesn't exist in Croatian.
There's a word "crnci".
That word has several meanings:
1) black persons, persons of Congoan race
This term is not a derrogative nor pejorative term, it's normally used in textbooks .
It doesn't mean "negroes" at all.
2) older meaning was: dark-tanned persons, of Moorish tan. Trace of it is in surnames.
3) "crnac" (pl. crnci) was the nick for the members of Black Legion, because of theirs black uniform.
That word is used in this context in this song. Kubura (talk) 07:53, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Lyrics

Lyrics are copyrighted. Unless somebody can provide evidence that these lyrics are not copyrighted, they can't be here. Corvus cornix_talk —Preceding comment was added at 06:30, 13 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The lyrics aren't copyrighted,nobody performed it publicly,and it wont ever appear on any album,so I'm returning them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.3.4.98 (talk) 17:44, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Joško Tomičić

The article doesn't mention that the deceased singer Joško Tomičić recorded a version of the song in the nineties.Also,it seems the original name of the song was Crna Legija,but Jasenovac i Gradiška Stara is more popular because it was named so in Latinica after the first verse. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.3.18.69 (talk) 11:38, 26 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Why are you removing the lyrics?

I would like to know why do people remove the lyrics from the article although they obviously aren't copyrighted,and without them the article isn't really making sense.For comparison,the page about Evo Zore,Evo Dana contains the lyrics.t should also be mentioned that some other singers,Like Joško Čagalj Jole and Jasmin Stavros,have also been singing this song (I can provide you with evidence if you want). The Great Duck (talk) 11:10, 29 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

About removing lyrics:Nobody is removing lyrics but we are deleting edits of banned user which is not allowed to edit.

About laws:Because under US copyright laws lyrics are protected. For example you can see article about song Lili Marlen! You will see that article is without lyrics.--Rjecina (talk) 18:52, 30 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am restoring the lyrics. Copyright law does not apply here, as it is an old folk song. The lyrics is not copyrighted and even if it were more than 50 years have passed since the song was written. —Preceding unsigned comment added by The Great Duck (talk • contribs)

Folk song ? Which part of statement "Wikipedia version of the song was coined in 1942" is hard to understand ? If you for example use Thompson version of song then you are having new copyright problem because lyrics are of Thompson !--Rjecina (talk) 20:17, 5 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The song is not copyrighted

Also, if it were, everything is in full accordance to the law:

Fair use - as per US Code - TITLE 17 > CHAPTER 1 > § 107

§ 107. Limitations on exclusive rights: Fair use

Notwithstanding the provisions of sections 106 and 106A, the fair use of a copyrighted work, including such use by reproduction in copies or phonorecords or by any other means specified by that section, for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright. In determining whether the use made of a work in any particular case is a fair use the factors to be considered shall include—

(1) the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

(2) the nature of the copyrighted work;

(3) the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

(4) the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work. The fact that a work is unpublished shall not itself bar a finding of fair use if such finding is made upon consideration of all the above factors.

--71.252.106.166 (talk) 22:59, 17 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]