Talk:Bible code

Pascal reference

Blaise Pascal (like a huge number of writers before him and after him) believed that extra hidden meanings could be found in the words of the Bible. This is not the same thing at all as looking for messages hidden in the letter-by-letter text. Claiming more than Pensées actually says is an interpretation that cannot be unused except if cited as the opinion of some authority. McKay (talk) 12:43, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

okay so change it to say that he believed that information could be found in the words of the bible, its still simmilar enough to torah codes to count as relevantg.j.g (talk) 17:43, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

What about the vowels?

As was pointed out by at least one author writing a refute of the Bible code, the WRR experiment leaves out the vowel marks under the Hebrew letters. If we did the same in English, leaving out the vowels, 'cd' could mean 'code', 'acid', 'cod', 'coda', 'dice', 'cad'... In a document as long as the Bible, varying letter skips between words, having liberty to spell words either forwards or backwards, isn't it almost inevitable that related information will seemingly miraculously be produced side by side? Not to say that I think the Bible is a fraud, but these issues need addressed or they could put unwarranted doubt on the Bible. --Millar153 (talk) 17:56, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Further popularization

I cannot recall further details but should it be mentioned that the bible code was a premise in The Omega Code? I remember the film had something to do with a code, the bible, and end time prophecy but it all could have been a coincidence with my recollections.--Kevin586 (talk) 18:22, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Sir Isaac Newton Information / His own words

Wiki Page Quote: “An early seeker of divinely encrypted messages was Isaac Newton, who, according to John Maynard Keynes, believed[5] that "the universe is a cryptogram set by the Almighty", and in the structure of the universe, Newton sought the answers to "a riddle of the Godhead of past and future events divinely fore-ordained".

Perhaps we should use actual writings from Sir Isaac Newton here instead of a quote from another man. I find it is best to look at a man’s actual writings rather than to read a second party biography – especially since recently many of Sir Isaac Newton’s writings have become available for study.

Sir Isaac Newton actually wrote about his ‘Method’ of reading the Prophetic text, the Bible, in a straight forward manor – it has nothing to do with hidden meanings but rather a through search and understanding of the many places in the Bible where the prophetic writings contain the same prophecy,

Sir Newton quote: “He that would understand a book written in a strange language must first learn the language & if he would understand it well he must learn the language perfectly. Such a language was that wherein the Prophets wrote, & the want of sufficient skill in that language is the main reason why they are so little understood. Iohn did not write in one language, Daniel in another, Isaiah in third, & the rest in others peculiar to them selves; but they all wrote in one & the same mystical language as well known without doubt to the sons of the Prophets as the Hieroglyphic language of the Egyptians . to their Priests. And this language so far as I can find, was as certain & definite in its signification as is the vulgar language of any nation whatsoever: so that it is only for want of skill therein that Interpreters so frequently turn the prophetic types & phrases to signify what ever their ffansies & Hypotheses lead them to. He therefore that would understand the old Prophets (as all Divines ought to do) must fix the significations of their types & phrases in the beginning of his studies. Something in this kind has been done by former writers, & as I have endeavoured in the following discourse to carry on the designe further so I hope others will bring it to more perfection. The Rule I have followed has been to compare the several mystical places of scripture where the same prophetic phrase or type is used & to fix such a signification to that phrase as agrees best with all the places, & if more significations then one be necessary to note the circumstances by which it may be known in what signification the phrase is taken in any place & when I had found the necessary significations to reject all others as the ofspring of luxuriant fansy. ffor no more significations are to be admitted for true ones then can be proved.” (Source: The Newton Project Website)

And he also said:

“The first Principles of the Christian religion are founded, not on disputable conclusions opinions or conjectures or on humane sanctions, but on the express words of Christ & his Apostles; & we are to hold fast the form of sound words. 2 Tim. 1.13 And further, it is not enough that a Proposition be true or in the express words of Scripture: it must also appear to have been taught in the days of the Apostles in order to baptism & communion.” (Source: The Newton Project Website)

He thoroughly rejected all that could not be proven or as he himself said: “to reject all others as the ofspring of luxuriant fansy. ffor no more significations are to be admitted for true ones then can be proved.” and “The first Principles of the Christian religion are founded, not on disputable conclusions opinions or conjectures or on humane sanctions, but on the express words of Christ & his Apostles;”

In fact on the Isaac Newton Wiki page a more clear statement of what Sir Isaac Newton did is more in line with his actual quotes above: “Thus, the clarity and simplicity of science was seen as a way to combat the emotional and metaphysical superlatives of both superstitious enthusiasm and the threat of atheism,”

This seems to me to be a more accurate statement. But perhaps it’s just me. -- NorCal RS (talk) 03:53, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

ELS extensions

I would like to know if an ELS extension like that one showed in the main article of the Bible Code can be found in other texts like "War and Peace",for the sake of comparison it would be very interesting,and very simple to compare.If no it would be clear that the phenomenom is real--Vilnag (talk) 18:14, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

No, not really the Bible Code

Before Michael Drosnin, the Bible Code meant something entirely different. It was more akin to finding the spiritual meaning from parables and scripture that was possibly written in parables. Finding the spiritual meaning in a parable or scripture has nothing to do with playing "word finder" in the Hebrew Text of the Bible.

I'm sorry, but Michael Drosnin has muddied the phrase. I was alive and talking about the Bible code before Drosnin wrote his books and changed the meaning of the phrase "Bible Code" to something much more meaningless than finding the hidden spiritual truths in parable and metaphor in the Bible.

Luckily, I personally found what I was looking for in the "law of correspondences" put forth in Emanuel Swedenborg's theological system.