Talk:Scalping

The caption of the picture of McGee linked to Little Turtle, the Miami chief, who died in 1812. So I unlinked it. Perhaps Little Turtle should be a disambiguation page.

"...but this belief is not supported by most academic scholars." Could we have a source for this statement, please? Noknokcpu 11:50, 23 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Herodotus quotation

As I found the sentence ' Scyths helped the scalper confess his love for her. ' unintelligible, I looked for other translations of this passage. The translation from which this quotation has been lifted, to be found at http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/History_of_Herodotus/Book_4, doesn't feature it. Another translation, to be found at http://www.gutenberg.org/files/2707/2707-h/2707-h.htm, doesn't seem to have a sentence equivalent to the one in question either. My guess is someone is trying to pull us a leg.

Shady part of a sentence

'To lay hands on him would sully the hands of the warrior, as Custer displayed his cowardice and shot himself upon seeing the Sioux women preparing to kill him [b]in their way[/b] as he was surrounded.' What is meant by 'in their way'?

Scalps for bounty

Surely there should be reference here of the fact that British and American government officials often put bounty on the scalps of Native American people -- men, women, and children -- when they were at war for refusing to give up their land? See, for example, the June 10, 1756 proclamation of the House of Representatives in Boston which placed a bounty of $40 for the scalp of a Penobscot man, and $20 for the scalp of a Penobscot woman or male child under twelve. Later upgraded to 300 pounds per scalp. See Frank Speck's book Penobscot Man, pages xix-xx.

If I write this I will struggle to make in NPOV, but it's a travesty that there's no real mention of the history of the scalping of Native Americans by white settlers here. The only mentions here are disputed cases.

156.56.145.58 (talk) 20:14, 1 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I don't have the sources on hand, but I'm pretty sure the practice of scalping among Native Americans was not commonplace, at least among the Plains tribes until whites began offering bounties in the 16th and 17th centuries.Goldste7 (talk) 20:27, 27 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Coward

The coward statement should be removed unless properly cited. Two wounds were found in Custers body one to the chest another to the temple. It is possible that he committed suicide rather than be captured. Other alternate theories abound.

"Many of the corpses were stripped, scalped, and mutilated; some having their skulls crushed. Custer’s body had two bullet holes, one in the left temple and one just above the heart. His body was stripped but not mutilated; although there were some superficial wounds probably not mentioned by those who found him. Early reports attributed this to the respect the Indians had for his valor but it is doubtful he was recognized as he was dressed in buckskins and his “long Hair” was cut short before the battle. Others claim his body was protected by the Cheyenne, who recognized him from his earlier campaigns against them at the Battle of the Washita." from http://www.blackhillsportal.com/npps/story.cfm?id=2150

"It is said that the Indians did not scalp or mutilate Custer's body out of respect for his fighting ability, but few participating Indians knew who he was. To this day no one knows the real reason they left his body intact" http://www.jalapenocafe.com/portfolio/fame_fortune/things.html

Also Sitting Bulls opinion of Custer from and interview contradicts the coward theory...

Did you know the Long Haired Chief?" I asked Sitting Bull.

"No."

"What! Had you never seen him?"

"No. Many of the chiefs knew him."

"What did they think of him?"

"He was a great warrior."

"Was he brave?"

"He was a mighty chief."

"Now, tell me. Here is something that I wish to know. Big lies are told about the fight in which the Long Haired Chief was killed. He was my friend. No one has come back to tell the truth about him, or about that fight. You were there; you know. Your chiefs know. I want to hear something that forked tongues do not tell the truth."

They kept in pretty good order. Some great chief must have commanded them all the while. They would fall back across a coulee and make a fresh stand beyond on higher ground. The map is pretty nearly right. It shows where the white men stopped and fought before they were all killed. I think that is right -- down there to the left, just above the Little Bighorn. There was one part driven out there, away from the rest, and there a great many men were killed. The places marked on the map are pretty nearly the places where all were killed."

"Did the whole command keep on fighting until the last?"

"Every man, so far as my people could see. There were no cowards on either side."

"I have talked with my people; I cannot find one who saw the Long Hair until just before he died. He did not wear his long hair as he used to wear it. His hair was like yours," said Sitting Bull, playfully touching my forehead with his taper fingers. "It was short, but it was of the color of the grass when the frost comes."

"Did you hear from your people how he died? Did he die on horseback?"

"No. None of them died on horseback."

"All were dismounted?"

"Yes."

"And Custer, the Long Hair?"

The Last to Die

"Well, I have understood that there were a great many brave men in that fight, and that from time to time, while it was going on, they were shot down like pigs. They could not help themselves. One by one the officers fell. I believe the Long Hair rode across once from this place down here (meaning the place where Tom Custer's and Smith's companies were killed) to this place up here (indicating the spot on the map where Custer fell), but I am not sure about this. Any way it was said that up there where the last fight took place, where the last stand was made, the Long Hair stood like a sheaf of corn with all the ears fallen around him."

"Not wounded?"

"No."

"How many stood by him?"

"A few."

"When did he [Col. George A. Custer] fall?"

"He killed a man when he fell. He laughed."

"You mean he cried out."

"No, he laughed; he had fired his last shot."

"From a carbine?"

"No, a pistol."

"Did he stand up after he first fell?"

"He rose up on his hands and tried another shot, but his pistol would not go off."

"Was any one else standing up when he fell down?"

"One man was kneeling; that was all. But he died before the Long Hair. All this was far up on the bluffs, far away from the Sioux encampments. I did not see it. It is told to me. But it is true."

Not Scalped

"The Long Hair was not scalped?"

"No. My people did not want his scalp."

"Why?"

"I have said; he was a great chief."

http://www.astonisher.com/archives/museum/sitting_bull_little_big_horn.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.74.24.2 (talk) 20:55, 12 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

scalping

There is a "scalping" in trading (like Forex), but it seems only very loosely defined as "taking quick profits by entering into a trade and closing it profitably a short time thereafter".

Fixing vandalism

I've erased the section on scalping in Northern Europe. "Joe Scalps?" Come on - at least be clever! Just regurgitated cuts and pastes from various googles of the term "scalp" (i.e. the bibleo references given). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.135.174.83 (talk) 04:56, 22 March 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Turkish Skalping?

Article Vlad III the Impaler states: ("scalping", for the Turks, meant cutting the edges of the face and pulling the face's skin off, while the person was still alive and conscious). Any truth to it? The Merciful 16:40, 17 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hamilton

There were British and American generals who paid for scalps, but the evidence is that Hamilton was not one of them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by BradMajors (talk • contribs) 22:48, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Medical consequences, etc.

There seems to be very little (which is to say nothing) in this article about the actual act of scalping and its physiological repercussions. Could some information on this aspect be added, please. 83.102.22.38 (talk) 15:26, 11 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I wanted to ask the same thing. So, seconded. Shinobu (talk) 16:04, 4 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

North America

The North America section is really poorly written (especially the first paragraph). It's just a mess of random facts that aren't really in order. Someone (with more knowledge than me) needs to re-write it. XAlpha (talk) 19:26, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]