Talk:Eurovision Song Contest

China in the 1963 contest ?

I can't find a reference to this, and it has been added into the 1963 Eurovision Song Contest article as well. This seems somewhat at odds with the EBU rules. Am I missing something?AlexandrDmitri (talk) 11:56, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Thank you User:JdeJ for reverting this vandalism on both pages.AlexandrDmitri (talk) 12:12, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

This article is not for "fansite news" (even when referenced)

One editor has recently been trying to add a sentence to this article which speaks of the Czech Republic withdrawing from the Contest. It is accompanied by a reference from the BBC news website.

While this news may be of interest to Eurovision fans, it does not belong in this encyclopædia article - especially not as a disjointed statement in the article's lead section! I am leaving this comment here on the talk page for two reasons: firstly, because the editor in question (an anonymous IP) has now attempted to add the sentence twice, and I do not want to get into an edit war: I am therefore writing an explanation here on the talk page, as is proper. Secondly, as a general guideline for future new editors - please bear in mind that this is an encyclopædia article, not a news page for all the latest Eurovision snippets. Think of this article in a permanent state, in a paper encyclopædia. Think of it being read by someone who has never even heard of the Eurovision Song Contest before, and for whom reading this article is their first introduction to what the Contest even is.

With that in mind, I hope it is clear that - while a broad overview and history of the Contest is suitable for this article, the latest year-by-year news is not appropriate. EuroSong ^talk 00:09, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Seconded, especially given that there are articles for each year's Eurovision Song Contest and even Country X in the Y year ESC articles. -- Александр Дмитрий (Alexandr Dmitri) (talk) 14:22, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Omnipresence of the English language

I recently added some information regarding the omnipresence of the English language in the ESC, I don't want to enter into a edit war, so I wont add it again. But I must say I added on the topic which concerns Criticism and Controversy. I supplied reliable sources stating that many scholars mainly in southern Europe argue that the omnipresence of the English language is depreciating European musical culture. I suppose the paragraph regarding this topic was written on an impartial way, I supplied sources and I added on a topic regarding controversy, I would like to know where is the partiality of this paragraph and why it is not acceptable in one encyclopaedia: "The Eurovision Song Contest shows also a evident submission of European culture to American musical influences due to various songs sung in English and the obvious and patent style of pop music which is commonly broadcasted in America and throughout the world; on the final in Moscow in 2009, 19 of the 25 songs were sung in English. Many scholars in southern European countries, mainly France, Portugal, Spain and Italy argue that this fact represents a clear subversiveness of traditional and popular European music. The French deputy François-Michel Gonnot have already criticized the French television and launched an official complaint on the French Parliament[60][61]. On the other side, participants argue that pop style, and singing in English is more appealing and brings more votes from other participants. Nordic countries used this argument with success, as Sweden, Norway and Finland have already won at least one time the ESC singing in English." 95.93.234.32 (talk) 13:15, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

I wonder if it is the phrasing of "American musical influence" and "commonly broadcasted in America" which is causing a problem. A song being sung in English does not automatically equate to being influenced by the United States of America's culture. There are two issues here: 1. the language used by performers; and 2. cultural influences. As I read it, the text lumps the two together. -- Александр Дмитрий (Alexandr Dmitri) (talk) 14:20, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

I believe it's undeniable that pop music has strong roots in America and it's part of American musical culture. I remember ESC being a contest representative of all languages and all musical European cultures. Each country sang in its own language with an orchestra using national musical cultures. Nowadays performers, changed their music style to pop, and the majority started to sing in English. This, undoubtedly represents a subliminal subversiveness to American musical culture, where, obviously the top charts have pop songs sung in English. Lumping language and culture together I suppose is inevitable, as we all know that language is a intrinsic part of a country culture. And I suppose, as everyone else, that the omnipresence of the English language throughout the world, which I do not criticize generally, has seeds in America. 95.93.234.32 (talk) 18:16, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

The history of pop music does not have its origins exclusively in the United States of America. The spread of international English is also more complicated than your opinion suggests. -- Александр Дмитрий (Alexandr Dmitri) (talk) 18:43, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Dealing with criticism and controversy

Please go to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Eurovision#Dealing with criticism and controversy for some discussion about this issue. Camaron · Christopher · talk 09:22, 27 August 2009 (UTC)