Talk:Tornadoes of 2024

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Delete April 2 Article

This needs to be deleted asap. Someone has once again completely jumped the gun and broke the rules we established years ago by making an article before we even had a significant event underway. And guess what?? Today underperformed. No devastating damage, no long trackers, no deaths, no tornado emergencies, but someone had to “let it slide” because you all got excited over a moderate risk and strong wording, again. We have been over this SO MANY TIMES and I am beyond exasperated. How many times have we said to not make an article until it is abundantly clear we’ve had a major event??? We jump the gun with articles year after year and it’s like you guys never learn. You CANNOT publish article unless numerous strong tornadoes or multiple deaths have been confirmed. We have neither here, and it’s not up for debate. Mark this for deletion immediately. Btw, the reason nobody was helping you with this article is because one wasn’t needed at all. You pushed it into existence with zero consensus or collaboration with other users.

Decided to go ahead and mark for speedy deletion myself. I’m beyond tired of dealing with this.

TornadoInformation12 (talk) 05:35, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The speedy deletion was removed by another user (I endorsed your speedy deletion though), so I immediately moved the article into draft space due to notability concerns. It will most likely be stale-deleted in draft space. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 06:56, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's in draftspace, information is still coming in MemeGod ._. (talk) 11:15, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I am under the impression that it should be put back up! It had a similar number of tornadoes, if not more, to the March 13 to 14 outbreak and happened over a similar area. Also the fact that strong tornadoes happened outside the moderate risk area Jhardaway1115 (talk) 14:57, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Jhardaway1115: — The event has not actually passed WP:TornadoCriteria, which is what is required for a section on this article even, let alone a stand-alone tornado outbreak article. Until WP:TornadoCriteria is passed, there is no use in trying to even think about an outbreak article. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 15:00, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It’s been a week since April 2nd. I think the article should be recreated (there is definitely enough verifiable information about it now compared to a week ago). 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 02:46, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I will also add that it does meet the WP:TornadoCriteria because (at least) three people were injured in Kentucky and West Virginia. 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 02:51, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The criteria specifically says that if a tornado in the outbreak caused at least one death or INJURY that it meets the criteria. This outbreak caused multiple injuries directly. 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 17:26, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just to note, WP:TornadoCriteria is for this specific article, not if the outbreak gets an article. For a separate outbreak article, it needs to pass the WP:NEVENT criteria. For a section in this article, it has to pass WP:TornadoCriteria. Two different criteria’s. It does pass TornadoCriteria, which is why Tornadoes of 2024#April 1–3 (United States) exists. Hope that helps! The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 17:39, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

April 1-3

It was a very notable event. 8 significant tornadoes, although no tornadic fatalities. It had 50 tornaoes in total, making it the largest outbreak so far this year. Also, it had more tornadoes in 3 days than any other month this year in total. This should have an article or should be published if one already exsits. Catsarecool558 (talk) 13:43, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It has not met WP:TornadoCriteria as of the latest report. There is a draft by user:MemeGod27 for the April 1-3 outbreak that you could work on and expand, if you are passionate about putting this event on the wikipage. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 16:07, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It almost passes Catsarecool558 (talk) 16:20, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just checked your account and found it to be a sockpuppet for a blocked vandal. Such a shame. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 22:33, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Uhh yes it has met the criteria. It specifically states that if people were injured that it met the criteria. Multiple people were injured and even hospitalized. 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 17:31, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That does not constitute the criteria for article creation at all. If you are talking about a section dedicated to this event on the Tornadoes of 2024 page, it has passed WP:TornadoCriteria as of April 10th and is published on the page. However, I was talking about the eligibility for the April 2nd outbreak to have its own article, which fails to meet WPN:LASTING and WP:NEVENT due to the minimal damage caused and only injuries reported. Guarenteed no long lasting impacts from that event.

While I am aware several Wikipedians have been cooking up an article for the April 2nd outbreak, it is very certain that it will never be published outright for the reasons above. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 00:59, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It was a very notable event in that more tornadoes were confirmed by the Charleston weather service office in this single event than in any whole year before then (15 tornadoes were confirmed so far; and the previous record for an entire year was 11). 108.147.10.55 (talk) 14:50, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It technically passes WP:TornadoCriteria as two people were injured by the Conyers EF2. However, TornadoCriteria only applies to Tornadoes of XXXX articles, i.e. this article. Since it passes TornadoCriteria, it has a section (Tornadoes of 2024#April 1–3 (United States)). For it to have an article, it must pass WP:NEVENT, which requires passing WP:LASTING. The event has yet to prove it will have a lasting impact (like the 1 year or 10 year rule). Will this event or a tornado/tornadoes from this event have news articles in a month? 6 months? A year? 10 years? Will there be academic articles? If the answer is most likely no (which I think it may be in this case), then it doesn’t pass Wikipedia’s notability guidelines for a stand-alone article. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 16:38, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think it was notable enough. There was a Facebook post from the National Weather Service office in Charleston, WV that said that this was the most tornadoes that the office had confirmed from a single event on record (it even beat the record set during the 1974 super outbreak; at least in West Virginia and surrounding areas). 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 17:33, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
How does a social media post confirming an obscure record for one location in West Virginia constitute the eligibility for article creation? Very absurd. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 01:01, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not only that. But all of the news outlets (at least in the Huntington-Charleston area) as well as the National Weather Service are calling this thing historic. It wouldn’t surprise me to see it mentioned a year later or two years later on account of that. 108.147.10.55 (talk) 14:53, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can you link the source where the National Weather Service stated this was “historic”? The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 15:05, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
https://www.weather.gov/rlx/2024-April-2-Severe 108.147.10.55 (talk) 15:07, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The Charleston weather service office has also confirmed nearly 100 reports of straight line wind damage (and that doesn’t include reports from outside of their coverage area!). 108.147.10.55 (talk) 15:12, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As a P.S. note, the 2023 Rolling Fork–Silver City tornado did not have a stand-alone article for over 3 months after the tornado as WP:LASTING impacts had to be shown. Wikipedia has no deadlines, so since there is a question from editors (myself along with others) about the outbreak’s notability, for once, we need to wait before making an article. I would honestly probably nominate any article for this outbreak for deletion if it is put into mainspace within a week of the outbreak. If by say Tuesday next week (which is 1 week after the outbreak), there is more than say 2 news articles about any tornadoes from this outbreak, then it might pass LASTING. If not, then I would say there is no hope for the outbreak to receive an article. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 16:42, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There are still news articles on this outbreak and it’s been over a week. See WSAZ and WOWK. 108.147.10.55 (talk) 14:54, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There were also several news articles early on that were from national sources such as the Associated Press and FOX Weather. 108.147.10.55 (talk) 14:56, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WSAZ said that the damage to the billboards (both in Cabell and in Putnam Counties in WV) was the worst damage they had seen in the area since the 2012 derecho. Even if the tornado part of the article doesn’t pass LASTING (which I think it probably does because West Virginia doesn’t see tornado outbreaks like this); the derecho part probably does. This thing traveled for over 500 miles. Had Tornado Warnings and Severe Thunderstorm Warnings from West Virginia (and Severe Thunderstorm Warnings into Virginia) all the way back into Missouri and if it wasn’t continuous on the Severe Thunderstorm Warnings; it was at least very close to it. So even if the tornadoes don’t meet WP:LASTING; I would think a derecho traveling over 500 miles would. 108.147.10.55 (talk) 15:02, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

See Draft:Tornado outbreak of April 2, 2024. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 15:14, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I could live with the general headline; it was just as much a derecho as it was a tornado outbreak. But it needs to be updated substantially before anyone even attempts to publish that. It’s still saying things in present tense that should be in past tense. 108.147.10.55 (talk) 15:33, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There are a lot of changes that should be made before ANYONE clicks “publish”; but I do think there should be an article on at least the derecho part of the storm with the tornadoes mentioned. I think both sides together do meet notably criteria. 108.147.10.55 (talk) 15:36, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed Addition For U.S. Includsion Criteria: Multiple or damaging EF2 tornadoes

Ok so I'm wondering what we do if we get an event with multiple EF2 tornadoes in a rural area, or one single EF2 that causes widespread significant damage but doesn't hurt anyone? Those both seem like scenarios that would be notable enough for inclusion, especially the second. It's not likely, but an EF2 tornado can go through a densely-populated area, cause major damage, but cause zero injuries. The other scenario is an outbreak of multiple EF2s in a wooded or rural area, where there is widespread major destruction to forests, outbuildings, farming equipment, livestock, and power lines, but no injuries occur. I know the current criteria requires an EF3 or stronger OR injuries, and I'm concerned about these two scenarios which could allow significant events worthy of inclusion to "slip through the cracks" so to speak. TornadoInformation12 (talk) 08:40, 7 April 2024 (UTC)TornadoInformation12[reply]

Support In light of recent events, this question of creating sections for tornado events with large numbers of EF2 and weak tornadoes, totally makes sense. And there are valid points to creating such pages, if there are significant numbers of tornadoes (50+), AND significant damage reported ($1+ million in costs) and possibly multiple causalities. However, I believe two of the three points regarding the size and human impacts of such outbreak must be met for inclusion. And of course,

Take for example, the July 16th event or the October 30-31st event from Tornadoes of 2015 for precedence. These were generally weak events in rural parts of Oklahoma and Kansas that were left included in the Tornadoes of 2015 article because of the major damages they caused in both states. Also, 1999 Salt Lake City tornado establishes a precedence that covers your other scenario of an EF2 tornado in a densely-populated area, cause major damage, but cause zero injuries or deaths. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 23:26, 7 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with your sentiment, but the Salt Lake City tornado killed a guy and injured over 100, so it doesn't really make for the best example. There's examples out there, I'm just having trouble thinking of them. Maybe the Spartanburg, SC EF2 tornado of 2017? Cut right though the city, yet the only injury from that one was a guy who had eardrum problems after due to the pressure drop inside the vortex.

TornadoInformation12 (talk) 11:42, 13 April 2024 (UTC)TornadoInformation12[reply]

I would assess this in a couple of days. Preferably, if I may ask TornadoInformation12 if this discussion could possibly wait 3 days to let that RfC conclude. Let's get the base criteria established and then change/admend it from there as needed. But yeah, some addition based on the number of tornadoes and an additional rule for cities over X population may be good additions once the base criteria is established. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 23:42, 7 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support: I would support that. There were a slew of EF2 tornadoes from this event. Including one in Fayette County, WV that was on the high end of that category, if it had been 10 mph stronger, it would have been an EF3. 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 17:35, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

According to this page. There were at least 14 EF2 tornadoes on April 2nd by the way. 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:4DAE:1717:3C0D:C2B9 (talk) 17:38, 10 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@TornadoInformation12: — WP:TornadoCriteria was just ratified. Feel free to open a talk page discussion here to discuss the proposed amendments! Cheers! The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 13:03, 13 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Derecho article now in mainspace

Since there has been so many comments regarding the April 1–3 event, I went ahead and did the very simplistic copy/paste of tornado charts, article renaming, and very slight lead-rewriting and got the April 2024 Pre-Dawn derecho into mainspace. I do not have any time to care about its format right now, but it is over 100,000 bytes currently. I shall let others fix it up. Enjoy y’all. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 15:57, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WP:TornadoCriteria is formally the criteria now

Just alerting for editors that the Request for Comment (RfC) for WP:TornadoCriteria has concluded and with a clear consensus, was ratified as the current criteria for Tornadoes of XXXX (i.e. Tornadoes of 2024) articles. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 13:01, 13 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

April 9-11 Shouldn't Have Been Removed

I put it back because not only did it indeed cause injuries (NWS New Orleans lists "several injuries" in their entry for the Slidell EF2), but also because this perfectly highlights why I proposed the addition of "multiple or damaging EF2 tornadoes" to the criteria, and why we should weigh major structural damage in populated areas just as heavily as we do injuries. The Port Arthur and Lake Charles EF2s are exactly what I'm talking about when I mentioned that strong tornadoes can sometimes cause major damage in populated areas, but still not hurt anyone. Those two EF2 tornadoes were absolutely significant events, and a lack of injuries does not undo that. I have started a new talk section on the criteria talk page suggesting we add this as an amendment. TornadoInformation12 (talk) 02:30, 15 April 2024 (UTC)TornadoInformation12[reply]

I think it should be deleted. It was much less notable than the April 1-3 outbreak, and does not deserve a section as long as it is. Also, I could not find the sourcing for "several injuries" on any of NWS New Orleans platforms, so if you can link that I am willing to change my sentiment. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 17:53, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The NWS damage survey for the Slidell EF2 notes multiple injuries, so it passes WP:TornadoCriteria. Also, the proposed new criteria discussion that TornadoInformation12 referred to can be found here. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 17:59, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 18:32, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

March 31

Are the March 31 India and China tornadoes spawned by the same storm system? Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 12:53, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

April 15-16

Hey ChessEric, April 15-16 actually already passes WP:TornadoCriteria as one of the EF1s injured two people. (NWS Survey) The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 04:12, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I know, but I really don't think that it should be there right now because the outbreak wasn't that big for April standards, and it's currently just one weak tornado that caused injuries. It can go there later if it's substantial enough. ChessEric 04:16, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Theres a major problem with the current criteria regarding injuries. Hypothetically, if an EF0 simply knocks a tree branch onto someone's head, does it make it more notable than an EF3 that doesn't injure anyone but causes $5 million in damage? Point is, injuries should not be used as WP:TornadoCriteria. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 00:55, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just to note, an EF3 would automatically be included per the criteria. The current criteria was looked at and commented on by a solid amount of editors, who commented either on the first draft, second draft, or the RFC to ratify it. Someone else did mention a possible problem down the road using a single injury as a criteria point. But in reality, yes, an EF1 or EF2 that caused $5 million in damage but no injuries would be less notable than an EF0 that actually injured someone. That said, the current proposed additional criteria (in discussion right now) would add inclusion for 4-5+ EF2 tornadoes (even if no injuries) or if a tornado caused severe damage to a specific town (case-by-case discussion). Remember, this list is suppose to be about global tornadoes, not every tornado. Damage total means nothing for notability. A good example is the North Carolina EF1 on January 3, 2022 which caused $1.5 million in damage. It hit 2 structures. That is a solid reason why damage totals aren't mentioned in the criteria list, but injuries are. A tornado with a high damage total almost always did one of two things: Significant tornado (chances are high for it to be EF3+ or be in an outbreak) or it went through and hit most of a town/city, which would be covered under the new proposed criteria. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 01:13, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

January 8-9

Should the outbreak have a separate article? It had 35 tornadoes and 7 significant tornadoes. 2 people were killed by the tornadoes. Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 11:40, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No. Its already part of another article, so it's fine. ChessEric 18:18, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

PDS tornado warnings

Should there be a page called, "List of PDS tornado warnings"? Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 12:25, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No. We have probably at least 100 of them per year, so there's no notability in such a list. ChessEric 23:08, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe not PDS Tornado Warnings but I do think a list of PDS Tornado Watches might be a good idea because they aren’t very common. 2601:5C5:4201:68B0:3C6E:B155:D63A:8E84 (talk) 21:19, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Updates to article

I copied this page to my sandbox and made some edits to it. You can view the edits i made here: User:Meatballrunfatcat/sandbox. Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 12:51, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Breaking news

There are currently 75 miles of active tornado warnings. This event is currently overperforming. Seek shelter for every tornado warning in your area. Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 23:02, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

April 16-18

Should a draft be made? Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 23:29, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No (or not yet at least). It hasn't reached the level of notability or activity for an article to be needed. ChessEric 23:42, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I will decide if an article is needed after the April 18th tornadoes are rated Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 12:41, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The real question at hand is whether April 16-18 really meet WP:TornadoCriteria? I think we should delete this section, as no injuries or deaths have been confirmed as of April 22. Not sure about damage totals, I will try and source that later.

Also, User:Meatballrunfatcat is a confirmed sockpuppet of Lokicat3345, a blocked user who has vandalized the severe weather project in the past. Cheers! HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 16:21, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Kansas EF1 on the 16th meets the criteria causing 2 injuries. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 16:33, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you so much! Please forgive my lack of knowledge and rash statements. The main news articles I read about don't mention injuries that occurred then which is unfortunate. If you don't mind, I might have to ask you for proper sourcing from now on! Thanks again, sorry for my mistake! :) HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 01:33, 23 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

September 7, 2009

There was a tornado outbreak in South America on that day. It had 28 tornadoes, 12 of which were significant. I think an outbreak article should be made for this event. I posted here because i would probably not get a response on the Tornadoes of 2009 talk page. Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 12:29, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This user is a suspected sockpuppet of LokiCat, who was blocked from editing wikipedia last October. Do not engage with this user and help report him. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 23:10, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Based on the above talk page entries; that isn’t the only sockpuppet of LokiCat. I would also add that Catsarecool558 is also a sockpuppet of the aforementioned LokiCat. 2601:5C5:4201:68B0:437:C6AE:F163:B235 (talk) 18:38, 23 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@TheWeatherWriter Can you archive this conversation? @Meatballrunfatcat has been banned as a result of his sockpuppet investigation. Thanks! HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 19:49, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@WeatherWriter HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 19:50, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

European tornado events

Can we please stop including every tornado event with an IF1 tornado in Eurpoe on this page? It would make more since if we only included events with an IF2 tornado or a tornado that goes through a large city. Meatballrunfatcat (talk) 12:45, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Meatballrunfatcat: I do not know what you mean, as of this message, every event (US or Europe or other places) meet WP:TornadoCriteria. So if you are complaining about one of the listed European events, (Jan 3, Feb 14, Mar 5, Mar 9, Mar 27), then know that the community has already decided those events are notable for inclusion. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 12:50, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, be aware of this user with a cat reference in his username. This user is a suspected sockpuppet of Lokicat going back as far as October 2023, vandalizing severe weather pages and glamorizing destructive events. He is also apparently a blocked user on HypotheticalTornadoesWiki as well. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 23:09, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ref problem from older lists

I normally don't bring issues like this to here, but this may affect current tables, so I will. I was updating the progress of the monthly lists today and was quite alarmed because I had to downgrade the status alot of the lists to not done and half done, leaving only 2 lists as done. The main issue appears to be that there has been some sort of change to cite report refs; as a result, it requires an agency input. When it contradicts the way that a lot of the refs are put in, they display as errors. It may not seem like much of a problem, but there are some list pages with entire ref sections that show up with these errors. It's not a glitch either because there are other older list pages that don't have this sort of problem. This needs to be addressed because this problem is on pages as recent as last year and having that many errors in ref sections is not a good look. ChessEric 04:58, 20 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

RFC for Additional Proposed Criteria for WP:TornadoCriteria

There is an RFC requested that editors choose whether or not two additional criteria should be formally added to WP:TornadoCriteria, the formal criteria for inclusion of articles such as Tornadoes of 2024. You can participate in the RFC here. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 19:13, 23 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reminder: Multiple troughs and long-duration event = Outbreak Sequence

Just wanted to remind everyone and let new editors know that when we have a tornado event that goes on for days and days, and is caused by multiple troughs/storm systems, it isn't a tornado outbreak, but a tornado outbreak sequence. The reason I am bringing this up is because I've seen some people get confused about what the term "outbreak sequence" means, and there is a decent chance we are about to see one unfold. It could begin this afternoon, and will likely continue through the weekend and possibly into early next week. This potential upcoming event will involve multiple back-to-back troughs moving across the continental US, and therefore if it verifies and reaches its full potential, we will be dealing with an absolutely textbook outbreak sequence. However, if only a day or two verifies, or there is a 24-hour gap in tornado activity, it will either be considered a regular old tornado outbreak, or two back-to-back outbreaks. Does that make sense? I hope I explained it well. Just wanted to make sure we are all on the same page. TornadoInformation12 (talk) 17:34, 25 April 2024 (UTC)TornadoInformation12[reply]

Agreed. “Tornado outbreak sequence” 2601:5C5:4201:68B0:3C6E:B155:D63A:8E84 (talk) 19:11, 25 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well said.

Another thing to note for this project, is while the current April 26th event may qualify for a preliminary section on this page, please do not create an independent article for this ongoing outbreak/outbreak sequence until the event is fully over and assessed. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 22:55, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Alaska tornado section

While the tornado in Alaska certainly is rare and fits the current criteria, can the current section be deleted for now until it is expanded upon and better sourced? HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 20:25, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please shelve the preliminary April 26th-? tornado outbreak article

This is a clear case of someone "jumping the gun" and breaking the rules this community established years ago. How do we have an article for an hours-old tornado outbreak already, without much significant or credible sourcing for information!? Please, shelve this preliminary outbreak article into the draft space. We jump the gun with articles year after year, with many inexperienced editors creating article drafts just hours after the storms roll through.

Now I certainly understand that today was a significant weather event. We all have seen the many social media posts circulating around, the livestreamed images highlighting the devastating damage and rare tornado emergencies out of Nebraska and Iowa. However, this event is certainly not over as far as we know. This outbreak could turn into an outbreak sequence and I, for one, would rather not have the debate over whether this outbreak is or is not an outbreak sequence now.

In addition to recklessly speculating the unknown future continuation of this outbreak, we CANNOT publish article unless numerous strong tornadoes or multiple deaths have been confirmed. Damage/velocity reports are the not the same as a CONFIRMED damage assessment by the NWS. We have no damage ratings at the moment and we have a significant dearth of sourcing for timeline/location of all tornado paths. IF we are going to publish this outbreak article later this weekend, please ensure that it is aligned with WP:LASTING/WP:Notable. Thanks if you have read this, and are helping to fix the quality of these sections/articles for the better. HamiltonthesixXmusic (talk) 00:13, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Now, I do have to admit I rushed to create that article; but what "rule" did we establish "years ago"? I'm unaware of this; I'm not sure if we did have a "rule" that was established to prevent editors from "jumping the gun" or rushing to create an outbreak article. Also, strong tornadoes or multiple deaths isn't "notable" for creating an article; but rather, the lasting and significant coverage you later stated above. Now, if this is the case, then shouldn't we hold an actual consensus (if we haven't) about deciding the creation of outbreak articles? ~ Tails Wx (🐾, me!) 01:39, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We already have, see the discussions pertaining to the Tornado outbreak and derecho of April 1–3, 2024 article (it was absolute chaos until we all figured something out). I had created the article prematurely, which led to revisions in the criteria for and discussion of outbreak articles. MemeGod ._. (talk) 03:15, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I do see there was a discussion regarding that about prematurely creating tornado outbreak articles ; though I don't see a "rule" or "guideline" or some sort established from that. ~ Tails Wx (🐾, me!) 11:27, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There definitely does NOT need to be such an article (or even a draft of such an article) until damage surveys from the weather service are coming in; and even then; we should wait at least until this time next week because as I learned from someone else on here (I think maybe that Tornado Information 12 guy) if news media are still mentioning it a week or two later, it might be notable enough for a standalone article.

But it can definitely go on the list of Tornado Emergencies article now (if it isn’t already) because at least one (probably more) was issued in Iowa today. 2601:5C5:4380:FD80:D8BE:CE18:331:4E8C (talk) 05:52, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Really happy to see everyone sticking with what we all agreed to. Now with that said, once the damage surveys start rolling out, I can guarantee you it will become immediately that this outbreak will need an article. Plus, SPC is calling for an outbreak of EF3+ tornadoes across Kansas and Oklahoma today, so we're not even done yet. This will very likely be an outbreak sequence article btw because we are dealing with two separate troughs.