Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2006 October 25: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 15:16, 30 October 2006

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Full reviews may be found in this page history. For a summary, see Wikipedia:Deletion review/Recently concluded (2006 October)

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-====[[Ryan Sugden]]====
-The background is in my conversation with the closing admin:
-:Please take another look at [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ryan Sugden]]. The 'votes' were evenly split so this should have been a ''no concensus'' unless there was a strong balance of argument in favour of delete. This was not the case - the guy has played for Oldham Athletic in the English Football League and so meets [[WP:BIO]] as ''Sportspeople/athletes/competitors who have played in a fully professional league ... Articles about first team squad members who have not made a first team appearance may also be appropriate, but only if the individual is at a club of sufficient stature that most members of its squad are worthy of articles.''. He meets both parts of this guideline. [[User:BlueValour|BlueValour]] 01:48, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-::Hi BlueValour, this was a difficult call but a clear delete based on the arguments.  I always suggest a [[WP:DRV|deletion review]] for any delete call that I make that is questioned.  In my opinion, notability rested on the argument raised that he was a trainee at Oldham (where he started 5 times in 4 years) and that all of his other starts were in semi-professional leagues.  This was not refuted in the AfD and was backed by the [http://www.soccerbase.com/players_details.sd?playerid=16726 soccerbase] link.  The question is whether someone who was a trainee on a professional team makes the [[WP:BIO]] cut that you've summarized above.  I didn't think so based on the arguments.  -- [[User:Samir_(The_Scope)|'''Samir''' <small>धर्म</small>]] 02:26, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-I would add that he started as a trainee but graduated to a full member of the squad as [http://www.zanziball.it/en/28/4c36.html here]. '''Overturn'''. [[User:BlueValour|BlueValour]] 02:58, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-*'''Endorse deletion''' made five appearances with Oldham, which was in 2nd division, and hence "third flight" flight as Premier League, Div1, Div2. [[Oldham Athletic]] has a stadium of 10,000 seats, pretty small, so I question whether a guy who played 5 full games is going to get enough of a contract to be described as "fully professional". '''[[User:Blnguyen|Blnguyen]]'''  ([[User talk:Blnguyen|bananabucket]]) 03:05, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-:*'''Comment''' - The four tiers - Premier League and three tiers of the Football League are ''all'' fully professional. It is inconceivable that someone in the squad of a third tier club would not be a full-time professional. [[User:BlueValour|BlueValour]] 03:20, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-:*'''Comment''' - FWIW Oldham's capacity is 13,624 [http://www.football-league.premiumtv.co.uk/page/ClubsLeagueOne/0,,10794~691853,00.html] [[User:BlueValour|BlueValour]] 02:42, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
-*<small>This discussion has been included in [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Football|WikiProject Football]]'s list of football (soccer) related deletions. [[User:BlueValour|BlueValour]] 03:28, 26 October 2006 (UTC)</small>
-*'''Overturn''' Votes were split evenly as noted above, which indicates a likely no consensus decision, and the subject passes WP:BIO. The trainee argument is based on the assumption that Sugden was on a trainee contract for the 4 years he was at Oldham. All the Soccerbase reference asserts is that he was a trainee when he joined, but not the length or nature of any future contracts he may have had with the club. In any case Sugden meets WP:BIO since has he played in a fully professional league. [[User:Catchpole|Catchpole]] 11:36, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-:'''Comment''' Also note that Samir says that the trainee argument was not refuted in the Afd. This [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AArticles_for_deletion%2FRyan_Sugden&diff=82587630&oldid=82538320 diff] shows that it was challenged. Samir's interpretation of the Soccerbase link could lead him to think that Ryan Giggs has played over 400 games as a ''trainee'' [http://www.soccerbase.com/players_details.sd?playerid=2856]. [[User:Catchpole|Catchpole]] 11:48, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
-*'''Overturn''' - I pointed out the soccerbase 'trainee' cite and suggested deletion. The later arguments convince me that he must have had a League 2 contract, which meets [[WP:BIO]]. -- [[User:Bpmullins|Bpmullins]] 14:54, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Revision as of 15:16, 30 October 2006

25 October 2006