Talk:Luther (TV series)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Episodes section

Added episodes section, because there's no purpose in putting them in the "Cast and Characters" section. Mah. Also, "series one" makes no sense: the series is "Luther" and there is no more than one "Luther"... but there are many season. Learn the language, it's good to know what you're wiki-ing about — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.50.140.68 (talk) 02:18, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

No need to be patronising, the logic's sound. In the UK we don't have television seasons. "Series" is essentially a synonym for "season" so it's entirely appropriate language. Television_program. See the following episode page where "series" is used in place of "season": List_of_Have_I_Got_News_for_You_episodes. DanLowth (talk) 03:08, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

I really must, just wholeheartedly agree with danlowth (apologies for lack of login). I'm a dual citizen, born american but live in england. It is common for americans to correct others on their own native way of doing things, in their own native land. It is less common elsewhere. And an archetypal american would respond with shrill outrage if corrected in a similar way. The evidence is overwhelming for this phenomena, and I would ask the author to think on it. and perhaps travel more widely outside north america. Have you considered west Africa? 78.86.176.22 (talk) 22:25, 10 June 2010 (UTC) (duracell)

Unsourced editing

Have just removed some edits made as they were unsourced & speculative. Personally, I think this is a great series so far, but I wouldn't go adding my hopes to the article, can people remember this is an encyclopaedia not a blog?! Aurelius2007 (talk) 10:03, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Copyright violation

I have removed a copyright violation in this article where the episode summaries have been cut and paste from the BBC website. Can someone please rewrite? Edgepedia (talk) 07:32, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

The works from the website? No copyrights. Whoever's on Wikia, would they like to come edit my Luther Wiki? Trikster87, (Talk) 20:25, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

No, Trikster, like most of the internet, the BBC Website is copyright. See[1] Edgepedia (talk) 08:14, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Right Edgepedia, i read the copyrights! Jeez, i never thought id get such thing wrong! Trikster87, (Talk) 20:25, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Running themes

There seemed to be arunning theme throughout the series of older cars being driven by characters, for example Elba's car. Can anyone confirm this? Tdoublenineone (talk) 23:55, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

Budget constraints, I expect - even one of the BMW jam sandwiches in series one was about seven years old. You have to wonder why the registration of Luther's Volvo changed from G861WVU to H654WKH in the second half of S02E01. If you're enough of a geek, obv. Mr Larrington (talk) 01:15, 17 December 2015 (UTC)

Second series

Any word on whether there is going to be a second series of this? Had a quick google and didn't turn up anything. Skomorokh 10:26, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Episode summaries

These really need to be fixed - they read like advertising fluff. As an aside, the ep 5 summary needs to mention that Reed kills Zoe Luther. Currently that's only mentioned in the ep 6 summary. – ukexpat (talk) 04:14, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Characters section

These are best when they are introductory and do not incorporate plot details past the pilot episode (those can occur later in the article). Spoilers may be allowable, but there is no good reason to put them higher on the screen than they need to be. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.65.166.71 (talk) 06:40, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Please note censorship is not allowed on Wikipedia, and I don't understand why someone would be reading a wikipedia article if they wished to remain ignorant. I fail to see how you can discuss a character without discuss what happens later in the series. Edgepedia (talk) 18:22, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

I have reverted the page back before it was reordered. I don't think I have even seen an article that lists the episode summaries (which refer to the characters) without first introducing the characters. Themeparkgc  Talk  23:17, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

It's not that uncommon. A reader may wonder: if the show is continuing; if the show is critically acclaimed; who is on the show - among others. These days especially, one wants to know if a show ran its course or if it was prematurely canceled. Why not write this article with care? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.59.252.117 (talk) 15:02, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

I can understand what you're saying but the order the article was before featured the episode descriptions referring to characters on a first name basis without previously introducing these characters in their own section. Maybe the production section should be moved up or the lead expanded to cover the scope of the whole article more? Themeparkgc  Talk  00:10, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Second series broadcast

Unlike originally thought and said, it would appear series 2 is being broadcast as four one hour episodes, not two two hours episodes. Need to read more about refs/sources, so I'm not sure how I should edit this, although I thought it should be mentioned. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0120z2z says "Episode 1 of 4 from Luther > Series 2". The BBC TV schedule shows Tuesday's ep (first of series two) is 1/4, one hour long. (apologies if this does not deserve a separate section on talk page) Sten123 (talk) 16:09, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

Series Three announced

See link here BBC One Orders 3rd Season Of Idris Elba’s “Luther” " BBC One controller Danny Cohen announced at the ongoing Edinburgh TV Festival that a 3rd season of Luther, the critically acclaimed psychological crime drama starring one Idris Elba, has been ordered.". --Anon (talk) 03:28, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

I've updated the article. Thanks for the spot. Edgepedia (talk) 06:13, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

"4 hour long episodes" means four episodes of an hour, right? The sentence is a bit ambiguous --145.53.119.228 (talk) 10:12, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

I've changed the wording. The source said 4 60-minute episodes, but I imagine this was changed so has not be a direct copy. You can see the source if it's online by clicking on the number in the square box at the end of the sentence which will take you to the reference and then clicking on the link. Edgepedia (talk) 11:39, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

I meant to put this up ages ago but forgot, soz. Seems that BBC America is co-producing season 3 as part of BBC America's 'Dramaville', production launch date August 2012. http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118049304 Twobells (talk) 17:43, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

Update: Luther series 3 is now official, shooting starts in November 2012 and will consist of 4 episodes. Twobells (talk) 21:23, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

It's a shame, really. The first series was amazing, but I don't know what possessed them to virtually cut Alice Morgan out of series 2. The interaction between her and Luther was the most interesting thing about the show. - Lisa (talk - contribs) 01:39, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

References

Short overall "Plot" summary

(Hey - was just compiling an item on talk page that started with "Apologies, Thewolfchild, I should have started this as a "Talk" item", when I then saw that they re-undid my last change. More in a moment - but wanted to get this mea culpa up immediately. Jmg38 (talk) 06:51, 18 January 2016 (UTC))

The paragraph under the "Plot" section was clearly written to address Series 1 only. There's a couple of ways to address this. Perhaps this short section could be cut back to end after mention of Luther's dark side and motivation, as this is a common thread to the entire four series run of 16 episodes (to date). It could, instead, be expanded a little to touch on specific motivations through each of the 4 series: S1 dealing with Alice and Ian; S2 protecting Jenny; S3 dealing with DSI Stark investigating against him; S4 dealing with Alice's death; all while bringing his brilliant mind to stopping various murderers. Look forward to comments. Jmg38 (talk) 07:17, 18 January 2016 (UTC)

Fair enough, I just think that jamming all those descriptors of Alice (along with the "potential" qualifier in brackets) into the last sentence made it look clunky. If you want to rewrite the plot so that covers the all the series instead of just the first, I'm ok with that. It just needs to be more balanced. Also, we only need a couple of descriptors for Alice, not a half dozen. I just finished watching the entire show, again, so I'm happy to help. Take your time write it the way you'd like and post it here. That way I and any other interested parties can contribute as well. - ^theWOLFchild 07:27, 18 January 2016 (UTC)

Right - I was guilty of using Alice's actions/developments through the next three series as a stand in for those episodes's plot developments. I'll wait a day or two to see if others have comments, before using my second suggestion above as a starting point. Jmg38 (talk) 08:59, 18 January 2016 (UTC)

The majority of the paragraph does explain the ongoing themes and motivations of Luther and, thus, the entire show. Could actually drop the last sentence, about Alice (and clearly written when only Series 1 existed), and leave it at that?

Another idea would be to break the existing last sentence in two, expand a little on how Alice contributes to his motivation and actions throughout all 4 series, even after her (likely) death in Series 4:

"Due to lack of evidence he can use in court, he is unable to arrest Alice Morgan, the brilliant, sociopathic murderer from the opening of the first episode. Luther and Alice form a bond that permeates all four series, as she becomes his confidante and friend (or pseudo significant other?), while giving him insights into the motivations of other criminals."

Thoughts about these two options? Jmg38 (talk) 19:39, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Sure, or this; In the very first episode of the series he investigates brilliant psychopath and murderer, Alice Morgan. Ultimately he is unable to arrest her due to lack of evidence, but as the series progresses, she becomes both his nemesis and unlikely companion. As she pursues her infatuation with him, he gradually relents as he is able to glean insight from her on some of the cunning criminals he pursues.. - ^theWOLFchild 20:31, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

I prefer your wording. I'd drop the last sentence, as "gradually relents" really only applies to the first 5 or 6 episodes, and "glean insights" dies with her before episode 15. Actually, I like your "pursues her infatuation with him", and would suggest it is applies to both characters. Perhaps pull that phrase into the second sentence; In the very first episode of the series he investigates brilliant psychopath and murderer, Alice Morgan. Ultimately he is unable to arrest her due to lack of evidence, but as the series progresses, their clinical infatuation with each other evolves (or transitions them) from nemeses to unlikely companions. - Jmg38 (talk) 21:31, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

If you think about, she does the pursuing, not him. At first he wants nothing to do with her. Than it's just coffee. Than it's only some advice. Than it's hiding out with her. But even at the end of the third season, he choses Mary over Alice (and in a big way! He chooses Alice to "die" and then pursues his relationship with Mary). There are points where he threaens to never see Alice again and she completely flips out. Even at the when she gets him a fake passport, he resists. It's not until the Season 4 special episode that we learn he "planned" to go away with her, but we really don't the extent of that. So that's why I wrote "gradual", it really does drag on through-out the entire series. The pursuing is primarily one-way and I also don't think "clinical" applies, certainly not for Alice's attraction to him. And while he recognizes her for what she is psychologically in the beginning, his interest in her is not clinical at all. As time passes he loses everyone - his wife, his best friend Ian, his partner Justin - and he loses everything - his home. his career, his faith, his drive. The only thing he has left is Alice and he realizes that she understands his broken psyche. That's probably why he was willing to "go away" with her... whatever that means. Anyway, it'll be intersting to see what comes next. - ^theWOLFchild 22:43, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Excellent points. I fall back to your original 3 sentence suggestion earlier today (yesterday in UTC). The only change I'd suggest, to tie in with the British use of "series" rather than "season"; ... but as the plot progresses through the first four series, she becomes... - Jmg38 (talk) 02:10, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

Good catch. I just updated the whole article for British Eng. - ^theWOLFchild 14:59, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

Looks good. Was a pleasure collaborating with you. Farewell. - Jmg38 (talk) 03:17, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

The plot synopsis appears wrong:

It ultimately transpires that Alice faked her own death after her life with Luther did not match their expectations. Two years later she returns to extort money from organised crime boss George Cornelius, who sabotaged her previous diamond exchange. Embroiled in her schemes again, Luther's relationship with Alice heads towards its destructive climax.

My understanding was Alice was selling diamonds to Cornelius to finance a future with Luther and no mention is made about ‘life with Luther did not meet expectations.’ She apparently has been on the lam and is planning to run off with Luther but is killed during the sale of said diamonds. Luther only finds out she is in fact dead after he resolves matters with Cornelius and discovers he was being manipulated throughout the series by the female antagonist. This section needs drastic cleanup. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.190.233.44 (talk) 04:23, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

Feel free to offer a suggested re-write. - wolf 19:54, 7 February 2022 (UTC)

Series vs Season

@JackErskine: - As already stated, both in my previous edit summary and at the top of this talk page, this article in written in British English, meaning certain words and spellings follow that convention. What is known as a tv "season" in North America, is called a "series" in the UK. The only reference to "season" in the article body is under the subsection that discusses an American version of the show, so that usage is correct. Once you were reverted, you should have come to the talk page, not reverted your edit back in again. Further, that a page (might) contain an error is no reason to re-add another one. That is just moving backwards. - ^theWOLFchild 17:32, 10 February 2016 (UTC)

runtime

The article currently shows infobox datum:

Running time	57 minutes

But the US region 1 DVD of series 4 contains two episodes each about 61 min long.

Are these originally broadcast in a 60min slot on BBC? Should the infobox be changed to a vaguer "approx 60 min" runtime? -71.174.184.36 (talk) 22:18, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

Future

The source states "will there be a series six? The short answer is: it’s not looking likely." It says "not likely" - "not likely" is not "no", which means that there is not an official confirmation, not from Idris Elba or from the BBC, that there will be no sixth series at all. The article does not even confirm nor deny that the sixth series won't even be made after the film. That means that there is no word on the sixth series at the moment, before or after the film. A cancellation can only be listed in an article once it has been officially announced by the BBC and supported by reliable sources. Therefore, the series' end date remains as "present" until either the series is either officially cancelled, or a year has passed with no official news. -- /Alex/₂₁ 10:41, 6 January 2019 (UTC)

Noting that over two years have now passed, not to mention that the film is confirmed as happening, so there is no issue in closing the end date. U-Mos (talk) 11:04, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

Opening credits

Notoriety for the artistry of the opening may be worth a mention. WillieHowardCO67 (talk) 13:13, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

References