Talk:Muddy Waters discography

Column widths

Tholme: Why is removing all the column widths from the tables an improvement? The tables now jump from one size columns to several, giving the discography an inconsistent appearance. H:TABLE#Setting column widths provides for these settings: "You can also use percentages, such as to equalize the widths of a two-column table by setting one of them to style='width: 50%;' ... One application of setting the widths is aligning columns of consecutive tables." Is there a guideline that contradicts this? —Ojorojo (talk) 13:51, 21 September 2019 (UTC)

"This Pain"

The song, "This Pain" is missing. Appears on 'best of' type albums but I cannot find an origin of release. --Jericho347 (talk) 21:50, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

Many of Waters' songs that were released only as album tracks are not listed – these are beyond the scope of a discography and more appropriate for a "List of songs recorded by" type article. "This Pain" is included on Hoochie Coochie Man: The Complete Chess Masters, Volume 2, 1952–1958 (2004) (listed in the compilation album section) and some other more comprehensive box sets. Wight and Rothwell's sessionography shows it was recorded in Chicago February 3, 1955, during the session that produced "Young Fashioned Ways" and "I Want to Be Loved" [p. 40]. Unlike those songs, however, it was never issued as a single and was first released in 1985 on a Japanese Chess box set. The song is not mentioned in Waters' popular biography Can't Be Satisfied. Dixon is credited as the writer, but he does not mention a recording by Waters in his autobiography. Dixon recorded the different, but similarly titled, "This Pain in My Heart" with Lafayette Leake in 1951 (also released on a Dixon single in 1956 as "The Pain in My Heart"). Hope this helps. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:56, 21 May 2020 (UTC)

"(I Feel Like) Going Home" / "I Can't Be Satisfied" Billboard charts

The source used (see [9] in the "Ref(s)" column for the details) for the chart peak position for "(I Feel Like) Going Home" / "I Can't Be Satisfied", shows that this peaked at number eleven on both of Billboard's Race charts (Juke Box and Best Seller). This shouldn't be changed unless there is a reliable source that shows otherwise. —Ojorojo (talk) 20:09, 30 January 2022 (UTC).

[fixed indentation & added sig] First of all the A-side was "I Can't Be Satisfied";it reached number 1 for 2 weeks.Sources:"The Chess Labels:a Discography vol 1 & 2" by Michel Ruppli (Greenwood Press 1983);"The Complete Muddy Waters Discography" by Phil Wight & Fred Rothwell ( A Blues & Rhythm Publication 1990);The Chess Files and Tape Boxes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk • contribs) 01:24, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Complete nonsense: The Wight and Rothwell discography, which was used extensively as a source for this article, does not once mention Billboard Race or R&B charts nor does it include any chart statistics whatsoever (see their article here). Additionally, they do not indicate which is the A-side or B-side (see the only entry on page 37). Access to the Ruppli book is limited, but a snippet (page 5) showing the entry for two songs does not include any chart or A/B details.

Besides Joel Whitburn, the source for most of the Billboard info in the article, I double checked Robert Gordon's excellent bio, Muddy Waters: Can't Be Satisfied (2002). He writes about the songs' release by Aristocrat, the Billboard review, and states "it rose to number eleven on their Most-Played Jukebox Race Records Chart" (pages 93–94). Additionally, in the Appendix C section on "Muddy's Billboard R&B Chart Hits", he only includes "I Feel Like Going Home" with a peak position of "11" during a two-week run (page 291). A preliminary search of Billboard issues from 1948 shows that "I Feel Like Going Home" appears in two consecutive issues at number eleven on its "Most-Played Juke Box Race Records" (9/18/48 page 29 and 9/25/48 page 29). "I Can't Be Satisfied" appears in release previews and a review, but not on a chart.

Unless there are reliable sources that specifically state otherwise, there is nothing to change in the article. Please restore it to the way it was before; once the WP:BRD process begins, the article should be left as-is.

—Ojorojo (talk) 14:52, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

The Chess boxes & tapes are not enough for you?That bio compared to Ruppli book is not good. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk • contribs) 16:27, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Please provide links to images of those sources which clearly state that either of the songs reached number one in Billboard. All of the other sources do not support this, including Billboard itself. Otherwise, your additions will be reverted. —Ojorojo (talk) 16:50, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

[fixed indentation & added sig] why you added some link for your sources?i said those sources are cited in the booklet of "Muddy Waters:The Definitive Collection" (Chess),if you can search for it.Sure i can't provide links for the Chess Tapes & Boxes — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk • contribs) 17:32, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

That would obviously be a typo, #1 instead of #11. Again, all of the other sources show number eleven, including Billboard itself. An error doesn't belong in the article. —Ojorojo (talk) 17:52, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

ahahah it's your error #11 instead of #1;your internet sources are not good,i have direct sources too (important musicologists/critics),but they consider wikipedia bad;for me is not but people like you ruin it;it's not your property.But i said your Muddy Waters article is quite good,i dont understand you started flaming and talking of vandalism...i never did it — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk • contribs) 23:05, 30 January 2022‎(UTC)

I've submitted a request for a third opinion.[1] It may take up to six days for a response; a break from editing the article probably would be good for us both. —Ojorojo (talk) 18:53, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

I can fully confirm what Ojorojo says - the Billboard R&B chart as presented by Whitburn shows a peak position of number 11 for "I Feel Like Going Home", and no place for "I Can't Be Satisfied". Ghmyrtle (talk) 20:51, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Where did you see?a friend of ojorojo...that's ridiculous.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk • contribs) 21:30, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

I saw it in the book. On the desk. In front of me. Stop it. Ghmyrtle (talk) 21:37, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

This is revisionism — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk) 21:42, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Another nonsensical claim. Past copies of Billboard are readily available online.[2] If there are later attempts to rewrite Muddy's chart history, the actual Billboard charts for the time period should be able to confirm the original chart positions. Knock yourself out. P.S. Same for "Boom Boom". —Ojorojo (talk) 17:17, 1 February 2022 (UTC).

Good:you're all wrong.Taking a look to the source you linked here,i found the big error:chart position #11 for "I Can't Be Satisfied" is not r&b chart position,but MOST PLAYED JUKE-BOXES,and was first week since the song was released.Most played juke boxes is not the same as r&b top 100.Second you said always that no source esplicitly says what it was side 1 or 2:not true...on a link posted by YOU there are matrix numbers:1112 for I Can't Be Satisfied,1113 for (I Feel Like) Going Home...what does it means for you?is obvious.Anyway i trust more of liner notes from cd "Muddy Waters:The Definitive Collection",which is an original Chess/Geffen ,sources of which are Chess tapes and boxes,than your internet random sources which don't state what you support.Go on my friend,continue to live on wikipedia,i'm going to listen to Muddy Waters on my high quality hi-fi.From now on i will never write more here so if continue to write i will not answer.Bye — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.98.130.202 (talk • contribs) 23:23, 2 February 2022 (UTC)

"I Can't Be Satisfied" reached number 11 on both the sales chart and the juke box chart, according to Whitburn's book. Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:45, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Well, it doesn't look they were able to find an actual Billboard issue with a chart that shows that "I Can't Be Satisfied" reached number one (I only see that "(I Feel Like) Going Home" reached number eleven). Anyway, in their confused ramblings on Talk:John Lee Hooker, they made what may be seen as a legal threat, which has been reported at ANI.[3] It's probably a good idea to cease all discussions with them until it is resolved. —Ojorojo (talk) 15:09, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

here it is the image from the booklet of Muddy Waters "The Definitive Collection" (an official Chess/Geffen release) where it is written "I Can't be Satisfied"/"(Feel Like) Going Home" was #1 in the r&b charts in 1948, as is written on the "Chess Box" too; liner notes are by Mary Katherine Aldin. 37.100.101.28 (talk) 16:32, 16 September 2022 (UTC)

[4]https://i.discogs.com/MLriuMc_LplBM7B3ilNI37zZftFpKnT7ak4pIoUCIMQ/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:592/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTU5OTc1/MjgtMTU5NDMxMjM4/Ny0yMDY5LmpwZWc.jpeg 37.100.101.28 (talk) 16:33, 16 September 2022 (UTC)

[5]https://i.discogs.com/HBygu24N-UWjhhkzTEGeZxPflt9bVTweEt7uVH7-sNI/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:592/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTU5OTc1/MjgtMTU5NDMxMjg1/MS03Njc4LmpwZWc.jpeg 37.100.101.28 (talk) 16:34, 16 September 2022 (UTC)

i posted a link to the sources too 37.100.101.28 (talk) 16:35, 16 September 2022 (UTC)

no reply........ 151.73.205.63 (talk) 21:16, 20 September 2022 (UTC)