Talk:Timeshare/Archives/2011

How can developers sell points after ALL weeks have sold as deeded weeks?

I purchased a deeded week at Orange Tree Resort back in the early 1990's when they were originally converted from hotel rooms to timeshare units. To my knowledge, all units sold as deeded weeks. Shell vacation club comes along in the early 2000's and starts selling points for several resorts in there "Club" that include the "Orange Tree" Resort. HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE!!

A friend of mine this past year who paid his dues, on time within one week of receiving his dues notice, was told that there were NO weeks left in this season (1/1 thru 5/1). HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE??

It seems that these large companies are reselling and/or using weeks already owned by someone else to make even more money??

Set me straight and tell me how this works... I dont get it!!! Startup77 (talk) 20:19, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

LEGALLY -> They cannot! The weeks are held by a trustee which monitor the number of weeks sold and will only allow weeks that remain unsold to be sold.

ACTUALLY -> Unfortunately, as in the case of points systems, the trustees must maintain a check on the number of points required for each particular week and the number of points sold. Usually, as with most companies today they are less than efficient and rely on the figures being provided by the Timeshare company that state that there are still points/weeks available to be sold. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.142.68.55 (talk) 23:46, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

POV POV POV all over the place

This article needs to be completely rewritten. It's industry-friendly, talks in industry terms, pretends to cover a lot of information while not going into any depth about timeshare being frequently associated with unethical business practices and high pressure manipulative sales. My coworker was in timeshare sales: people at car dealerships (usually considered high pressure) are nothing comparing to good timeshare reps. He received 3 weeks of elaborate training during which they were taught to essentially find prospects' buttons and manipulate them by emotionally appealing to weak spots - e.g. kids, lack of money and such. They had scripts with responses to every conceivable objection. These are very much the same techniques as they use in multilevel marketing presentations and telemarketing calls.

By his own admission, when you do the math, timeshare is not worth it in most cases for majority of people who take vacations once or twice a year because with air tickets you end up paying more than you would for most package deals. If you think about the lengths they go to get you to buy timeshare, it should be self-evident that you're the one getting screwed here.

High pressure sales and (lack of) value for money aside, there have been outright fraud allegations, especially against the companies selling timeshares in Mexico (http://www.mexicantimesharefraud.com/Complaints.htm)

Oh, and to the timeshare resale people posting previously: please fix the industry first, then provide information. Timeshare has become associated with scam because it has been a scam to enough people.

--- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.131.180.209 (talk) 15:26, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Let's clean this up

This is a really weak article ... as others have noted, most of the language reads as though it was lifted from timeshare marketing collateral. I've made a few initial changes, and I'll be hoping to spend more time on this topic in coming weeks to effect a more neutral style. It seems reasonable to include the following sections:

Timeshare products as real estate investements: what does the record show ? Answer, timeshares are terrible investements.

Ownership: what is ownership, and do timeshare "owners" really own anything as the term is commonly used ?

Sales practices: how ethical are timeshare sales practices ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mpkneip (talk • contribs) 00:05, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Every time edits are made to show the truth about the industry, they are always removed by workers in that industry. In order for potential and current owners to benefit from education, the timeshare industry has to suffer. They work very hard at limiting their suffering, all at the cost of the owners. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.93.169.170 (talk) 19:10, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Completely POV, completely agree

This is WAY POV! Not even ANY criticism, no non-industry references and lots of silly language. Desperately needs verification. 86.130.148.52 (talk) 12:39, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

I concur. The timeshare business is incredibly sleazy (in the same category as car dealerships) but there's no mention of that here. --Coolcaesar (talk) 11:12, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Funny so many should attack this as Developer or Industry POV

In earlier edits I have tried very hard to put this in language that timeshare (TS) owners would want others to understand. I am a timeshare owner not a TS industry person. I purchased my TS from other TS owners on a well known online auction site. I paid a price I felt was fair and I feel secure that I will get my value out of the ownership and one day resell the ownership on the same well known auction site. I personally would (almost) never recommend someone purchase from the developer but that is POV. I too have been to way too many of the high pressure developer presentations. So I am familiar with what you are angry about. Every time I try to put neutral language or link to owner sites such as the Timeshare User Group, these links and discussions are removed as not having references or being biased. So what you have is a page that lists a lot of facts about the industry and that is about it. You may hate the sleazy high pressure sales tactics of the industry developers but the fact is there is a vacation industry called timeshare and many people own these vacation ownerships. Many buy these things and do not understand what they have bought. A page like this may be invaluable to someone like that. It can also be invaluable to answering questions for the resale industry that is not sleazy and is just people trying to sell their vacation ownership to someone new. If you want to add a RANT or HATE section to this page do so. But like when I added neutral owner based information you too will probably have your information removed based on POV. Until then it will remain a page of facts and definitions. These facts and definitions are valuable since the industry is complex but since there is little room on Wikipedia for POV that is all we have. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.107.10.195 (talk) 20:13, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I think this an exaggeration to include so many topics in the Timeshare Timeshare Resales (should be stand alone a wiki) - Point Systems - Timeshare User Groups - Home Owners Associations - Red, White and Blue - Trading Companies … should NOT be included In that case we have to include timeshare for aircraft, pets, horses, cars, farm lands, etc… Surfers will be confused with so many contents,.

I think it should be like it was before and external links can only be non-profit organizations representing the industry and references can only be articles from established publishers. As an example: "Timesharelink.com - Timeshare Glossary". Should NOT be in that page it is a commercial company that is trying to link their website with an excuse of “Timeshare Glossary” —Preceding unsigned comment added by Accountedit1 (talk • contribs) 09:21, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

We should not complicate a simple issue!

I think this an exaggeration to include so many topics in the Timeshare

Timeshare Resales (should be stand alone a wiki) - Point Systems - Timeshare User Groups - Home Owners Associations - Red, White and Blue - Trading Companies … should NOT be included

In that case we have to include timeshare for aircraft, pets, horses, cars, farm lands, etc… Surfers will be confused with so many contents,.

I think it should be like it was before and external links can only be non-profit organizations representing the industry and references can only be articles from established publishers.

As an example: "Timesharelink.com - Timeshare Glossary". Should NOT be in that page it is a commercial company that is trying to link their website with an excuse of “Timeshare Glossary”

Ad a link

Dial An Exchange is mentioned in this article. Can we have it linked to our website, please? We offer classes for timeshare owners, free, to get the most out of their ownership in addition to being a free membership, no annual fee, low cost exchange company offering exceptional customer service. Cooper1965 (talk) 18:44, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Secondary market

I think it's OK to have links to some high volume and/or established secondary market sites were individuals can trade shares: TimesharesOnly Worldwide Timeshare Hypermarket Timeshare Resale World Sell My Timeshare NOW LLC timesharereview.co.uk.

I do not know however which of these places are "high volume" or "established". Please contribute if you have knowledge of this market. User:Abune (talk) 19:42, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

Easiest way to determine the legitimacy of a resale site, is to ask if they charge upfront fees to sell your timeshare. Valid and LICENSED agents will work for a commission, not charge you upfront to "market" your timeshare. Hundreds of scams have existed for years with more companies joining the fleecing every week to part desperate owners of their hard earned money with lies and promises of "we have buyers waiting" or "we can get you more than you are asking for", right before asking you to pay hundreds of dollars to them to get the process started.

Fact is, there has never ever been a worse time to try to sell a timeshare. 75 to 99% depreciation is not at all uncommon for the resale market now. Anyone who tells you differenly is about to ask you for money. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.93.169.170 (talk) 19:06, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Secondary Market material

In the section "Timeshare Resales", the second and third paragraphs are excessive detail, and could be greatly reduced - especially the marketing info, it's not needed here and could just be removed. The same is true of the "Timeshare Rentals" section - the second and third paragraphs can be reduced and merged - no need for that much detail on pros/cons and obstacles. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 15:53, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Disputed neutrality?

Shouldn't we stick a tag at the top of the article? At least that way, until any edits are made, people are made aware of the problems with the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Flyboysama (talk • contribs) 08:45, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

No allowed usage as primary residence?

Is the following a common component to timeshare agreements, or is this only specific to the Disney Vacation Club?

Disney Vacation Club at Disney Boardwalk Villas, Condominium Lease agreement

• Section 1, Article 12: Use restrictions
  • 12.14: No Domicallary Intent - No one may use the condominium property with the intent or desire to become legally domiciled in the State of Florida, and all persons waive release and remise and such intent or desire. No one may use the property with the intent that it be their primary dwelling, and they must maintain a principal dwelling at all times at a location other than the condo property.
  • (Reference: Disney Vacation Club, Condominium Lease Agreement, Orange County Comptroller's Office, Orange County, FL - http://or.occompt.com/recorder/eagleweb/downloads/myPdf.pdf?parent=DOCC10251775 )

DMahalko (talk) 17:32, 2 April 2011 (UTC)