User talk:Riverside Motorsports Park

Regarding Riverside Motorsports Park

I have two issues with your edits that were made to the above article.

• The removal of the Merced Sun-Star article critical of Condren

The reasons you've put forth for removing the article were as follows, I will address each one:

• • it was de-bunked in other articles (ref Merced County Times & others)
    • Any assertion that the Sun-Star article is wrong may be challenged by referencing an article that takes an opposing position, however, in order to keep with Wikipedia's neutral point-of-view policy, the original article that made the claims about Condren should still stay in the article to ensure that both sides of the debate are clearly represented.
  • The article was flawed by incorrect statements & omissions
    • An assertion like this must be backed by reliable sources, you have cited nothing that supports your assertion. If you have the specific articles that support this position, by all means post them on the page but don't make such an assertion without providing sources.
  • is copyrighted
    • Just because the newspaper may hold copyright on its content doesn't mean that it can't be sourced and cited. The Wikipedia page on what constitutes a reliable source has the following to say: "In general, the most reliable sources are peer-reviewed journals and books published in university presses; university-level textbooks; magazines, journals, and books published by respected publishing houses; and mainstream newspapers." I don't think I have anything else to say about that.
• The absolutely blatant conflict of interest you have in creating/editing this article
  • Frankly, your own user name makes it rather obvious that you represent the interests of the Riverside Motorsports Park. However, just because that's so doesn't mean that the RMP has the final say on what goes on its Wikipedia page. The fact that you are removing sources critical of your company alone reeks of conflict of interest, and suggests an attitude of article ownership. In a nutshell, no one actually "owns" the articles on Wikipedia, they are freely available for anyone to edit. If you don't want anyone to post anything negative about the RMP, then frankly, you shouldn't have posted the article in the first place.

Regards, TheLetterM 15:46, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Response to the LetterM regarding edits to Riverside Motorsports Park article

In response to your disagreements with the edits I made to remove the reference and link to the article published by the Merced Sun Star, please note that, as the article is about Mr. Condren's personal background, it constitutes biographical information of a living person. Wikipedia policy clearly states that, "We must get the article right.[1] Be very firm about the use of high quality references. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material — whether negative, positive, or just questionable — about living persons should be removed immediately and without discussion from Wikipedia.[2] Wikipedia policy further states, "Editors must take particular care adding biographical material about a living person to any Wikipedia page. Such material requires a high degree of sensitivity, and must adhere strictly to the law in Florida, United States and to our content policies. . . ."

While your edits, and those of one other frequent editor named Jason, who has repeatedly added this reference to the Wikipedia article about the Riverside Motorsports Park development, may reflect a neutral point of view on your parts, and while the referenced newspaper article is verifiable (in that it was published), the article you are linking to and referencing is not neutral in its point of view, and it is not accurate--placing it in the realm of "unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material." The article quotes persons not known by Mr. Condren and with whom he never did business. In addition, as I do represent Riverside Motorsports Park and Mr. Condren, and I provided an interview for the article quoted, I personally can verify that positive statements about Mr. Condren that the reporter told me she had received (from known and reliable sources such has his business accountant) were not included in the published article. The article furthermore includes a quotation that we told the reporter was a complete lie and which could only have been contributed with slanderous intent, but it was included. (The reporter would not identify the source to us during the interview, but named the source in the article, and it is someone completely unknown to Mr. Condren.) Finally names of at least four other sources of information that could have verified information about Mr. Condren were given to the reporter, but these were not contacted.

The Merced County Times published an article titled "The Rest of the Story" on March 22, 2007, that counters statemetns, claims and insinuations made about Mr. Condren in the Merced Sun Star article. As the Merced County Times does not have a Web presence, it is impossible to link to the article, and I do refer you to it.

The Wikipedia article posted here should answer the question, "What is Riverside Motorsports Park," in a factual, verifiable manner. I submit that the introduction of the referenced newspaper story about the founder's background does not contribute to that answer. Rather, it tangentially introduces controversy and a sensationalism common to tabloid journalism.

Respectfully submitted, Riverside Motorsports Park

Thank you for your response. Regarding the MCT article, even if they don't have a web presence it's still possible to use it in the article. If you have the article or its pertaining info, you can still cite it, see WP:CITE, which will show you how to cite the source, and I hope you do integrate content from the MCT article to the Wikipedia article. If you feel that the article in question debunks the MSS one, then you should make a note of it, but I would advise against removing the MSS article so that a comparison between the two sides of the RMP debate can be made by the reader. After all, while you may call the MSS article a flawed article that does not properly address its subject, the Merced Sun-Star as a newspaper in general still counts as a reliable source- the newspaper has a board of editors and is a main avenue of news for those living in Merced County. Of course, you can provide sources that call the article in itself in question.

However, I must still caution you that your involvement in this article (as an admitted representative of the RMP) does still indicate a Conflict of Interest, no matter how impartial you might try to be. So keep in mind that while you are welcome to edit the article, make sure that your edits reflect a neutral point of view, and be welcoming of other editors' contributions to this page. Thank you for taking the time to respond to this message.

Regards, TheLetterM 23:48, 10 September 2007 (UTC)