Talk:Arlington, Washington

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GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

This review is transcluded from Talk:Arlington, Washington/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Winner 42 (talk · contribs) 22:45, 26 April 2017 (UTC)

Overall Comments

• Going to take a swing at this, should be done by Friday (hopefully). Winner 42 Talk to me! 22:45, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
  • Overall, very nicely done. I have some minor points which I hope you will address, so for now I am going to put this on hold. Winner 42 Talk to me! 02:08, 29 April 2017 (UTC)
    • Thanks for the thorough review. I will be addressing your points over the next few hours. SounderBruce 02:43, 29 April 2017 (UTC)
      • Excellent work, I've reviewed your comments and I'm going to go ahead and pass this shortly. Winner 42 Talk to me! 18:01, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

• The article has inconsistent Oxford comma usage
  • Y I've combed through and fixed as many as I could find. I don't think there are any glaring examples left.
• Excellent work on sourcing
  • Thanks! That's one of my strong points as an editor.

Sectional Analysis

• Lead
  • Do you think Arlington's location relative to Everett is worth putting in the geography section of the lead as the nearest well known city?
    • Y Added Everett to the lead paragraph.
  • In general, I worry about the lead's ability to summarize the articles points in its current (short) state, for example the Economy, Government, Culture, and Education sections don't even get an overview sentence in the lead.
    • Y Added a third paragraph.

• History
  • Is it accurate to describe the exploration of the area in 1851 as "European" consider the area was a US territory?
    • Y I was considering using European as a descriptor for the explorer's race, but instead swapped it to "American" per your point.
  • It would help comprehension tremendously if there was a map showing Arlington and Haller City relative to the river and its forks.
    • How does this look? Whipped it up in Inkscape using an OSM base and eyeing this city map that clearly shows the two cities. SounderBruce 06:32, 29 April 2017 (UTC)
      • Wow, excellent work. I'm very impressed. This definitely helps for those not familiar with the area. Minor nitpicking point though, the map does lack a compass or wording in the caption to show that the map is facing North. Definitely not critical for GA though.
        • I've added a compass rose for good measure. SounderBruce 20:06, 30 April 2017 (UTC)
  • and was followed by a hotel with services for the logging camps -> and it was followed by a hotel which serviced the logging camps (or some other similar wording)
    • Y Re-phrased.
  • as its main sources of income -> as their main sources of income
    • Y Done.
  • What is a fourth-class city? Could a wikilink be provided to an article that explains them?
    • Y Link added.
  • The sentence, "The outbreak of World War II brought the U.S. Navy to Arlington, converting the municipal airport into a naval air station in 1943 and building new runways and hangars." Seems to be a run on, consider spilting or rewording.
    • Y Split into three sentences.
  • Does Wikipedia have an article describing the plane crash?
    • It does not. There is a short blurb on the airline's article, which is sufficient enough for something so minor.
  • The 450% population increase which ended in 2007 began when? (1980)? Also has growth slowed since 2007 if not, is that year relevant to the article?
    • The year is only referenced because it is when the source (HistoryLink) was written. The estimated population of 15,000 in 2007 does make the 450 percent claim valid if measuring from 1980.
      • Fair enough.

• Geography
  • The "post-war period" refers to post-WWII I assume? The link goes to the general article about post war periods.
    • Y Changed the link to Post–World War II economic expansion.
  • There are 10 planning areas, but only 9 bullets. Is the West Arlington Subarea supposed to be a bullet point?
    • The West Arlington Subarea is the tenth subarea, but it is an amalgamation of several former ones. It didn't feel right to lump it in with the rest.
  • The should the neighborhoods sub section be titled "Subareas"? The use of "which each contain neighborhoods of their own" is confusing. Are you referring to some sort of 2nd order neighborhoods?
    • Neighborhoods are not defined by the government, but rather by non-administrative sources (or the wishes of real estate developers and agents).
  • Is King-Thompson still proposed? If so, should it be included at all and/or in the count of 10 sub areas?
    • It hasn't been annexed yet. Added a little history to its blurb.
  • In general this use of lists seems only marginally MOS:EMBED compliant as children of a preceding paragraph, you don't need to do anything about it, but I thought I would bring it up.
• Demographics
  • Is the auto-generated 2000 census description still relevant enough to be included in the main article (or at all)?
    • For comparison purposes, I think it warrants inclusion. For example, the racial statistics have changed quite a bit between the two censuses. I think it can be removed after the 2020 census is conducted and released.
      • Fair point.
  • What are the 1903 and 1906 numbers in the historical population box sourced to?
    • I found the source for the 1903 population (and added to the box), but failed to find the 1906 population figure. Seeing as it wasn't a census year, I doubt it was anything more than an estimate, and is much less important than the current estimate (2015) or the first estimate at time of incorporation (1903).

• Economy
  • The 12% working, is that 12% of all residents or all employed residents? I know it says "of employed" but if only 12% work in Arlington and 17% and 9% live in nearby cities where are the remaining 62% of workers work?
    • The 12 percent figure is out of employed residents (less than the 9,481 figure mentioned earlier), and the 17 and 9 percent statistics are for employed Arlington residents commuting out of the city; I've added the only other areas over 2.0 percent to the sentence as well. The remaining 48 percent are split thinly between a lot of different cities. (Here is the full report)
  • "produced more shingles" currently produce more or used to produce more at some undetermined date?
    • Seeing as the shingle industry is pretty much dead in the region, I've added "at the time" to the statement.

• Government
  • A note on the governing structure of the school system might be of note, since it was left out of the list of provided services. A brief note on the governing structure of the school district perhaps.
    • Generally, in Washington state, schools are never directly administered by the municipal government. Since this is considered "normal" for here, I had omitted it. I think the governance of the school district belongs in the Education section, as I have also moved non-munciipal governance (libraries, utilities, transport) to their respective sections.
      • Ok, fair choice. I'm personally not familiar with the region (if you can tell :P)
  • This section seems to lack information about the area's D/R split as well as party registration
    • Washington state does not require a political party registration for voters, so that information is not available. Added some presidential and gubernatorial election data from the local newspaper.

• Culture
  • The parks and recreation section seems to imply that all of the open space is in the 17 parks, clarification could be useful
    • Y Added "public" before "open space".
  • How many non-city maintained parks does Arlington have?
    • Only the one county park, along with the park shared with Arlington, both mentioned in the section.

• Infrastructure
  • Is natural gas a major source of electricity generation in PUD? A note on electrical generation types could help comprehensiveness
    • It is not. Hydroelectricity accounts for the vast majority of its energy sources.
  • Was the Cascade Valley a private non-profit hospital or some other configuration?
    • It was a public hospital, mentioned by its inclusion in a public hospital district. It was independently-operated (by the district) until its acquisition.

Review

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it well written?

   A. The prose is clear and concise, and the spelling and grammar are correct:

   B. It complies with the manual of style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation:

2. Is it verifiable with no original research?

   A. It contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline:

   B. All in-line citations are from reliable sources, including those for direct quotations, statistics, published opinion, counter-intuitive or controversial statements that are challenged or likely to be challenged, and contentious material relating to living persons—science-based articles should follow the scientific citation guidelines:

   C. It contains no original research:

   D. It contains no copyright violations nor plagiarism:

3. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. It addresses the main aspects of the topic:

   B. It stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style):

4. Is it neutral?

   It represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each:

5. Is it stable?

   It does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute:

6. Is it illustrated, if possible, by images?

   A. Images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content:

   B. Images are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions:

7. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Image-heavy?

@SounderBruce: You say this is image-heavy, but I think rather the contrary. Compare Seattle, or even Grand Forks, North Dakota, also featured articles. - Jmabel | Talk 15:59, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

Seattle and Grand Forks have layout problems caused by squeezing too many images into tight spaces and thereby creating text sandwiches. Please see MOS:IM for the relevant guidelines. Finetooth (talk) 21:19, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

@Jmabel: As Finetooth says, there's some layout issues, but I also think a small gallery of NRHP buildings isn't necessary when the section already links to their respective articles. The only images I think this article need are from outlying suburban neighborhoods (which I plan to drive around and get) that better reflect the character of the city. SounderBruce 01:17, 12 June 2017 (UTC)

Wikipedia Standard for US Places is to Have Estimates in Historical Populations Tables

This is not up for discussion for this single article, as it's a Wikipedia-wide standard. We can move the discussion to the US places project, but I doubt anyone wants to rewrite their bot just to delete it, so upon no complaints, I'll change it back again. DemocraticLuntz (talk) 01:21, 17 June 2017 (UTC)

The standard only exists for articles that have not undergone a more rigorous peer review, like the FA process, which this article has. Thus it should not be subject to the same "standard" (which is not documented anywhere) and should defer instead to the very fresh review. Please stop edit warring over this, it's pointless. SounderBruce 01:25, 17 June 2017 (UTC)

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Origin of "Arlington"?

According to the article,

The new town was named "Arlington" after Lord Henry Arlington, member of the cabinet of King Charles II of England.

Any idea why it would be named for a 17th-century English personage than, say, for another American Arlington such as Arlington, Massachusetts, or Arlington, Virginia, as are most other American Arlingtons? —  AjaxSmack  16:51, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

There's a conflicting account that claims this Arlington was named for the Arlington House, but it's not from a reliable source like Meany's article. Considering that the name was decided by the railroad and its executives, anything goes. SounderBruce 23:57, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

References

Sources for my claims that were deleted

Text that was deleted:

Prior to American settlement in the 19th century, the Puget Sound region was primarily inhabited by many indigenous Coast Salish peoples. The Stillaguamish, a Lushootseed-speaking people, had prominent villages along the two forks of the Stillaguamish River where they followed fish runs, with other tribes in the area, such as the Skagit, Snohomish, Sauk-Suiattle, and Swinomish, using the area for fishing, hunting, and gathering. The name for this area is stiqayuʔ, meaning "wolf," on account of a story that there was a large wolf living on a hill south of the modern settlement. The Stillaguamish had a village located at Arlington, which was called Skabalko (Lushootseed: sq̓ʷuʔalqʷuʔ), owing its name to the confluence of the rivers. It was located on the north bank of the Stillaguamish River, at the joining of its two forks, where a farm now stands. In the village, there were two large winter longhouses, and at least 200-300 people lived there. The neighborhood of Kent Prairie, known in Lushootseed as xʷbaqʷab, was once a flourishing prairie where the women of the tribe would collect berries, grasses, roots, and other materials.

Passages and my sources for them:

1) Prior to American settlement in the 19th century, the Puget Sound region was primarily inhabited by many indigenous Coast Salish peoples.

- General knowledge, posited by this article and other articles already

2)The Stillaguamish, a Lushootseed-speaking people, had prominent villages along the two forks of the Stillaguamish River

- Hollenbeck, Jan L.; Moss, Madonna (1987). A Cultural Resource Overview: Prehistory, Ethnography and History: Mt. Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest. United States Forest Service.

- "At the time of the Treaty, it was understood that the Stillaguamish Tribe occupied the territory of the 'Stoluckwamish River' from its headwaters to its mouth." (151)

- "In some of the early documentation, a Stillaguamish subgroup is identified for the South fork of the River. ... The name is dropped from the records sometime around 1858, and subsequent references simply refer to the Stillaguamish Indians" . (151).

- "The Stillaguamish Tribe identified their territory as inclusive of the North and South Forks and their respective tributaries, and the mainstem of the river" (151)

3) where they followed fish runs

- Already in the article

4) with other tribes in the area, such as the Skagit, Snohomish, Sauk-Suiattle, and Swinomish, using the area for fishing, hunting, and gathering.

- Hollenbeck, Jan L.; Moss, Madonna (1987). A Cultural Resource Overview: Prehistory, Ethnography and History: Mt. Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest. United States Forest Service.

- "This area was used in common with neighboring tribes, including the Sauk and the Snohomish, with whom the Stillaguamish had many familial ties."

- "...was apparently used by people affiliated with several villages of the surrounding area, including the Lower Skagit, the Kikiallus, the Snohomish, Snoqualmie, and Stillaguamish" (Kikiallus were a Swinomish band)

- Nels Bruseth's book Indian Stories and Legends of the Stillaguamish, Sauks, and Allied Tribes.

- "From Toll Dachib to Skabalko, the junction of the rivers at Arlington, were several temporary camps. Skabalko was known far and wide. Sauks traveling to the Sound and back, Snohobish coming down the South fork, parties coming up river to dig . for roots, spaykoolitz and leek at Ba-quab (Kent's Prairie) nearly always stopped there and camped. At Bah-quab lived an old man and woman about 50 years ago." (Skabalko)

5) The name for this area is stiqayuʔ, meaning "wolf,"

- https://www.heraldnet.com/news/arlington-formally-recognizes-homeland-of-stillaguamish-people/

- "Before it was Arlington, the land was known as stiqa’yuʔ, Haller or “wolf” by the Stillaguamish people." (Tracy Boser, Cultural Resources Dept.)

6) on account of a story that there was a large wolf living on a hill south of the modern settlement.

- Nels Bruseth's book Indian Stories and Legends of the Stillaguamish, Sauks, and Allied Tribes. Written in conjunction with Stillaguamish tribal members and then-chief James Dorsey and James Price.

- "Some say that Wolf once used to live on the hill between Skabalko and Bah-quab." (No page number since I don't have a physical copy on me at the moment but it is in the story Sti-Kieo and Skobie)

7) The Stillaguamish had a village located at Arlington, which was called Skabalko

- Already in article

- Hollenbeck, Jan L.; Moss, Madonna (1987). A Cultural Resource Overview: Prehistory, Ethnography and History: Mt. Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest. United States Forest Service.

- "Skabalko. Two large houses at a village near the present site of Arlington (Kent Prairie), occupied by “several hundred (200-300) people. There was also a cemetery at this village (Bruseth n.d.:11). (T31N R5E Sec.2)"

8) (Lushootseed: sq̓ʷuʔalqʷuʔ), owing its name to the confluence of the rivers.

- Tracy Boser, Stillaguamish Cultural Resources Dept.

- "Skabalco was the place of a permanent Stillaguamish village. It is where the north and south forks of the river come together. Many from other villages traveling up and down the Stillaguamish River would stop at sq'ʷu'ʔalqʷuʔ to visit and to trade . goods. The spelling I have for it is sq'ʷu'ʔalqʷuʔ which translates to confluence."

9) It was located on the north bank of the Stillaguamish River, at the joining of its two forks, where a farm now stands. In the village, there were two large winter longhouses, and at least 200-300 people lived there.

- Hollenbeck, Jan L.; Moss, Madonna (1987). A Cultural Resource Overview: Prehistory, Ethnography and History: Mt. Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest. United States Forest Service.

- "Skabalko. Two large houses at a village near the present site of Arlington (Kent Prairie), occupied by “several hundred (200-300) people. There was also a cemetery at this village (Bruseth n.d.:11). (T31N R5E Sec.2)"

- https://www.heraldnet.com/news/arlington-formally-recognizes-homeland-of-stillaguamish-people/

- "Today, the ancestral village is farmland and home to baseball and soccer fields."

10) The neighborhood of Kent Prairie, known in Lushootseed as xʷbaqʷab, was once a flourishing prairie where the women of the tribe would collect berries, grasses, roots, and other materials.

- Hollenbeck, Jan L.; Moss, Madonna (1987). A Cultural Resource Overview: Prehistory, Ethnography and History: Mt. Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest. United States Forest Service.

- "There was also [a summer camp] near Kent Prairie , in the vicinity of Arlington, a site well known as a place to gather roots and berries." (151)

- Nels Bruseth's book Indian Stories and Legends of the Stillaguamish, Sauks, and Allied Tribes.

- "Some say that Wolf once used to live on the hill between Skabalko and Bah-quab."

- "From Toll Dachib to Skabalko, the junction of the rivers at Arlington, were several temporary camps. Skabalko was known far and wide. Sauks traveling to the Sound and back, Snohobish coming down the South fork, parties coming up river to dig . for roots, spaykoolitz and leek at Ba-quab (Kent's Prairie) nearly always stopped there and camped. At Bah-quab lived an old man and woman about 50 years ago." (Skabalko) PersusjCP (talk) 04:25, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

"General knowledge" is not appropriate for any article, let alone a WP:FA. Sources here have to be high quality to adhere with the WP:FACR, so Bruseth's book cannot be used, and others need to be vetted for their accuracy and reliability. Any and all additions must come with a proper inline source as well, which is the main reason why I've had to revert the last two attempts. Let me comb through this first and add back what is usable. SounderBruce 05:41, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

It was already used in the article, so it should be deleted from the original too then. PersusjCP (talk) 05:44, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

I've added back the place names, but much of the other content is unusable and not suitable for this article. Retelling a legend and mentioning "flourishing prairie" are both not appropriate for an entry focused on the modern city; those belong in the Stillaguamish people article, which is sore need of development. SounderBruce 05:52, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

t̕igʷicid. I've been meaning to write up some things for that Stillaguamish article and the others related to it. Anyways, I have a few notes on what I think could be improved.

1. The Sauk had no camp at Arlington, no source I can find mentioned this. The territory of the Sauk-Suiattle was on the Sauk and Suiattle rivers, out past Darrington. Nor was there a settlement at the prairie, as far as I know. There was a temporary campsite (basically a few mats) there. The cemetary was at the main village of sq̓ʷuʔalqʷuʔ.
2. stiqa'yuʔ is not a word, the correct spelling is stiqayuʔ. The dictionary confirms this under s√tiqayu. The reason why it was spelled like that is because often á (a') is added to the syllable with stress to help with pronunciation.
3. The specific area of the settlement was called sq̓ʷuʔalqʷuʔ/Skabalko, with the general area surrounding the city of Arlington called stiqayuʔ. The ethnography says this in the entry for Skabalko.
4. Usage of the word camp is disingenuous, since they were permanent structures and permanent settlements. There were many camps that were used for hunting, like near Oso, but the settlement near Arlington was a village with two houses. I think the population is fine to include too since both of those measures

PersusjCP (talk) 06:06, 29 December 2022 (UTC)

Some notes on Precontact Habitation

1. The Sauk had no camp at Arlington, no source I can find mentioned this. The territory of the Sauk-Suiattle was on the Sauk and Suiattle rivers, out past Darrington. The Sauk and many other tribes would likely visit the village during migratory seasons, but there were no other permanent settlements of other tribes.

2. The prairies was a gathering ground, not a settlement, according to the Stillaguamish About Us page.

3. The village was at Skabalko, according to every source. Stiqiyu is what the area around Arlington was called, according to Tracy Boser, who is the Stillaguamish Cultural Resource Specialist. This is from this Herald Article.

PersusjCP (talk) 22:22, 28 January 2023 (UTC)

Also, I think the Trafton sentence should be removed since it isn't relevant to Arlington. That information should just be added to the page for Trafton. PersusjCP (talk) 22:27, 28 January 2023 (UTC)