Talk:Everything Will Be OK

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Requested move[edit]

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consensus for move. Vegaswikian (talk) 15:07, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Everything Will Be OK → Everything will be OK (animated short film 2006) — Everything will be OK is also the title of numerous artworks, publications and other video works. Quasihumano (talk) 13:37, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Survey[edit]

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.
  • Support This is an article about a specific animated short film in 2006 that is antedated by a number of unrelated yet significant works of the same title, for example the book called Everything will be OK, published by This is a magazine in 2005 (ISSN 1721-4904) which was critically acclaimed in several publications and distributed world wide. It is also the title of the accompanying DVD which is a compilation of original video artworks and animations (but NOT the animation from this article) shown in several film and video festivals throughout Europe, including Colophon 2007 (Luxembourg), NextFestival 2005 (Vilnius), Senko Studio 2005 (Viborg, Denmark), Netmage 2005 (Bologna), PICA 2007 (Australia) and others. There is also a powerpoint performance on This is a magazine called Everything will be OK from 2005. There are a number of artworks in the form of artist multiples by Andy Simionato such as balloons, stickers and tshirts which carry the meme "Everything will be OK" distributed in museums and galleries world-wide. Finally there is a unique internet/video artwork called Everything will be OK .com by Andy Simionato exhibited in galleries and festivals since 2004. All of which would indicate that this article, regarding only an animated short film from 2006, should be moved to a more specific page indicating its medium and year of production. Quasihumano (talk) 15:54, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"If a film shares its title with one or more non-film topics on Wikipedia, compare all topics and determine which one is the primary topic. ...If the film is not the primary topic, name its article after the film's title with "(film)" added at the end." Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(films) This article is about an animated short film that is not the primary topic. Quasihumano (talk) 15:54, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. None of the other things mentioned have articles on Wikipedia, which is the only reason why we disambiguate. This film is the obvious primary topic. Everything Will Be OK (book) was created from the nominator's own contributions and may not be notable enough for an article. 90.219.50.171 (talk) 23:09, 1 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I agree with the above. Of all these, Everything will be OK the film is the most popular, primary topic. If Everything will be OK is also the name of the single issue of a magazine (something called "This is a Magazine"), it seems to make more sense to create a page for "This is a Magazine" than to disambiguate here. Meanwhile, the artist Andy Simionato who is said to use this phrase in artwork does not have an article of his own on Wikipedia either - and I don't think his using the phrase Everything will be OK in his work is notable enough to disambiguate. Finally, the website noted, www.everythingwillbeok.com, does not have any identifiable content or authorship that I can tell other than a video loop of a balloon. Sleepyjuly (talk) 00:50, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose The only other article in contention for this name is of highly questionable notability and IMO is a candidate for deletion. As the anon pointed out above, this content is also the nominator's own contributed material and this RM is likely driven by self-interest. At the very least, let's see a keep-worthy article first before we talk about moving other articles to accommodate it. Ham Pastrami (talk) 01:57, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The other article as mentioned was made by the same author as this article and not by "self-interest" as has been claimed. Everything will be OK was a major book and an art event widely covered in books, magazines and other media, including the the V&A museum's Interplay (UK) which considered it "highly influential". Indeed since the book and the video artwork (of a dancing inflatable stick figure, and not a balloon) have been exhibited extensively in various countries and film festivals since 2004 and so predating the animated film discussed in this article, it would appear that it was itself "influenced" by the previous works. Quasihumano (talk) 02:15, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Despite claims of the work being "highly influential" and an "art event," nominator has not provided any supporting sources. I'd also like to first see articles created for these particular magazines and artists, to determine if there is even anything worth disambiguating here. Right now we don't have any information but the nominator's own material. "Everything will be OK" is a commonly used phrase in the English language, and to suggest it was invented by an artist in 2004 is a little silly. Sleepyjuly (talk) 02:42, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The project Everything will be Ok (book and dvd) features original works by a number of international artists including Miltos Manetas and other neen artists, contemporary greek artists such as Andreas Angelidakis, Angelo Plessas, the band Animal Collective, works by George W. Bush and Pamela Anderson, artists MTAA, Rafael Rozendaal's Bicycle Wheel,Sergei Sviatchenko... the book and dvd has been shown in the Palais de Tokyo, netmage... all before 2006 the year of the animated short-film release. If nothing else the article should be moved to a less ambiguous page. Quasihumano (talk) 02:57, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Wiki states that popularity is not sufficient cause for primary topic candidacy. I do agree with Sleepyjuly, '"Everything will be OK" is a commonly used phrase in the English language' and for this reason this article requires the disambiguation of '(animated film, 2006)' or similar. The artist Simionato did not invent the phrase he/she appropriated it through purchasing a domain and making a series of collaborative and ongoing art projects and artist multiples. (Simionato may even be pleased that this appropriated meme has been so effective as to become the title of a film, he/she may even consider the film an extension of his own project) thanks. Quasihumano (talk) 03:13, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It took some digging but I've finally located what I believe nominator has been referring to. The 4th issue of the 82 page magazine, "This is a Magazine," was titled Everything will be OK. This issue was published in 2006 and therefore does not predate the animated film whatsoever and could not have possibly influenced it, as nominator suggests. Additionally, less than 1500 copies of this issue were ever printed. Here is my source: (http://www.thisisamagazine.com/everythingwillbeok/compendium.html) This is not notable enough to have its own article, let alone require other articles to disambiguate. Thumbs down. Sleepyjuly (talk) 03:20, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Im afraid Sleepyjuly that you are referring to the second edition on the website - the first was published with a DVD also called Everything will be OK which was registered with the national office of copyright in italy (SIAE) in september 2005 (each copy has a holographic copyright infringement sticker which carries this date) I have one of these books and dvds! Both editions sold out. Furthermore the website and unique artwork www.everythingwillbeok.com was registered and published 2004 (specifically Creation Date: 2004-05-17 from whois.com) Quasihumano (talk) 03:48, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
On the topic of editions: this is not a popularity competition but about an imprecise positioning of the article. The Everything will be OK editions are in permanent collections and libraries around the world (available through EBSCO) Everything will be OK is a series of public artworks available on www.everythingwillbeok.com, and they are also ongoing projects in the form of artist multiples. All of which predates the release of the animated film. I feel that the article would be better positioned with a reference to its year and medium. thankyou. Quasihumano (talk) 03:55, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Even if one were to accept that a single issue of an Italian art magazine with a total print run of less than 3000 copies (both editions), is noteworthy enough for its own disambiguated Wikipedia article - nominator provides no sources or solid content to support this claim other than his own opinion and speculation. Quasihumano, rather than debate details with me, please review the advice and recommendations of the other users here and follow Wikipedia policy. Sleepyjuly (talk) 04:31, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
However positioning the article as the primary topic seems to ignore the possibility of (albeit unintentional) plagiarism and therefore creates the wrong impression. Over 1 million online editions of This is a magazine have been downloaded since 2002, with approx 180,000 copies of the Everything will be OK edition distributed in 2004, the hard-cover folio-sized book and DVD is distributed world-wide. I dont mean to labour details, simply correct some obvious misunderstandings and incorrect claims. And i certainly hope that Sleepyjuly is not implying that an italian publication is somehow less noteworthy than if it were, let's say, an american publication? i'm afraid this IS about details. Finally, if the fact that the project is called "This is a magazine" creates a prejudice then i would suggest you visit this project (http://www.thisisnotamagazine.com) Quasihumano (talk) 04:59, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I suggest to the nominator that voting eight times in your own nomination is quite enough. Just so you know, engaging in behavior like this has a counterproductive effect. Ham Pastrami (talk) 06:16, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I have refactored the entries above so that Quasihumano and Sleepyjuly have only one !vote each. Beyond My Ken (talk) 05:51, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
im sorry i didnt realize i was voting. i was trying to correct some misunderstandings, and participate in a discussion (which is very productive i feel) for example it appears that the underlining debate is centering on whether (a) film is more noteworthy than literature and the visual arts, there seem to be certain geographic prejudices emerging as well, for example the references to "italian" and so on, these may be secondary - and why is it that you directed your comment only to me and not to anyone else who may be mutltiple-voting? Please excuse my ignorance in these matters. thankyou Quasihumano (talk) 06:29, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
For someone who claims this is not a RM driven purely by self-interest, nominator has a surprisingly vast knowledge of every obscure detail of this publication and a tenacious nature to repeatedly defend it :) I could not find much more than a shred of information about this publication through multiple Google searches. Sleepyjuly (talk) 07:48, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
i do believe that last comment sounds a little like a kettle calling the pot black :) defending the primary topic for this article is simply misleading for readers. wiki guidelines seem to suggest that a film requires disambiguation if it conflicts with other pages. 'Everything will be ok' has strong meme qualities, it has wide-spread usage from everyday conversation to cultural activity. perhaps we need to make a specific disambiguation page for it, listing all the dozens of artists (both contemporary and through history) that have adopted the phrase? i believe there is even an artist somewhere that has written a thesis on the phrase... i will look him up. perhaps he can help! thanks Quasihumano (talk) 08:14, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It is probably a moot point, but Everything will be OK (the animated film), is directly based on a series of comics and writings Hertzfeldt created for his website in 1999 and 2000. This fact is noted in this very article, which I wonder if you have read. I don't mean to be rude, but I simply don't think you understand how Wikipedia works or what is required of you when you make unsourced claims and submit unverifiable information. I encourage you to do some research and then create new pages for these other artists and publications that you admire. I will step aside now so others may contribute here. Sleepyjuly (talk) 08:54, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Im sorry but i can find no evidence to support your claim that the comics were called "Everything will be OK" in 2000 (if that is what you are claiming). I simply feel that giving this article primary topic status is a little misleading - i dont wish to detract from the merits of the project itself. As far as copyright issues are concerned the DVD "Everything will be OK" ISSN 1721-4904 is registered and copyrighted 2005, and this is not really the place for legal discussions i'm sure (nor does it really interest anyone else other than the publishers of the original dvd and the producers of the article's film :)) Quasihumano (talk) 09:31, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Now you're just trolling me. Sleepyjuly (talk) 09:49, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I have not made any negative comments about this (your?) article in its form or content, nor have I questioned this (your?) film's merits which I am sure are many. Im sorry you do not take my words in the good faith that they were intended. Quasihumano (talk) 11:05, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - If it were necessary to move this article, then Everything Will Be OK (film) would be sufficient, there is no need for "(animated short film)". However, the current state of affairs seems reasonable and not in need of "fixing". Beyond My Ken (talk) 05:53, 9 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion[edit]

Any additional comments:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Yet another proposed move[edit]

From what I can gather, the official capitalization of the film is "Everything will be ok". I propose we make the necessary correction. --Goodbye Galaxy (talk) 23:40, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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