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Origin of Life: Devoid of oxygen gas or oxygen molecules??
This page desperately needs a chemical structure diagram... Ed Sanville 05:19, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
It also needs to dump the extraneous information about the Krebs cycle and just provide the link. Crick22 08:41, 14 October 2005 (MST)
I say we merge these beasts, hopefully increasing the length and depth of the product along the way. Someone get a molecular sketch in, too. mastodon 22:58, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
- Agree -- Boris 23:20, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
- Disagree. I would like the stub to remain in place- just the stub was useful as I was looking at chemical equations, and it would be harder to use it as a quick reference. However, I would have no objections to including the information in the Pyruvic Acid section. (It would be akin to having a "Crime and Punishment Stub" and including the information under Fyodor Dostoevsky) Interpretivechaos 01:38, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
- Done. I went ahead and merged the two articles. Edgar181 12:58, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
- Disgree. I am not sure there was consensus on merger. Please my reasons below. In short, they are two chemicals with different reactivities. Further, pyruvate is by far the more commonly known chemical in biochemistry and medicine. Merging them unfortunately does two things. 1. The two chemicals become conflated and a source of confusion. Just see how the chembox contains the drawing of the acid but the formula of the base. 2. We are redirecting a great mass of people studying biochemistry into pyruvate, which again is not the same. Ignoring this difference is almost like stating that sodium chloride and hydrogen chloride are the same thing.--Chibibrain (talk) 19:10, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
I don't wish to "undo" your edit without further discussion. There is obviously no consensus, although the merge action was arguably done without consensus as well.--Chibibrain (talk) 19:10, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
Current evolutionary theory on the origin of life
By definition a theory of evolution cannot be about origin. Evolution is about change in that what already exists. (184.108.40.206)
- I'm inclined to agree, the positing of the origin of life relates to abiogenesis, but I don't know what the adjective for that is. 220.127.116.11 (talk) 10:25, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
- Currently, the article is named "pyruvic acid" and I think the chembox info is for acid as well. The confusion perhaps comes from the fact that all links pyruvate have been redirected to pyruvic acid.--Chibibrain (talk) 18:52, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
An article for pyruvate
Pyruvate deserves its own article, instead of a redirect. Given its importance in biology, it is likely what most people mean when they mention pyruvate. I would think most articles in a biochemistry or medical context are actually linking to pyruvate not pyruvic acid. Unfortunately they have been redirected here.
If the proton is ignored, pyruvate is likely by far the more common name. However, I don't think this is an issue of a single subject with two circulating names. In terms of chemistry, the acid and its conjugate base are not the same thing. The difference is not academic. Just try dipping a pH meter in a solution of hydrogen chloride versus a solution of table salt.
Some material actually ignores the important difference, because it pertains to pyruvate but not pyruvic acid. As a result, I think there should be an article on pyruvate. No more redirection. Some of the material here needs to be moved to pyruvate article, because they have to do with the conjugate base, which is not the same as the acid, as any organic chemist would tell you (citation needed?).--Chibibrain (talk) 18:52, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
- You'll have to persuade WP:Chemistry. Consensus there is not to have separate articles for conjugate bases.
- I know what you're saying, but your arguments are a bit muddled. Comparing pyruvic acid to pyruvate is not the same as comparing hydrochloric acid to sodium chloride. You should really be comparing hydrochloric acid to chloride. Or discussing sodium pyruvate.
- My personal opinion is that any confusion could easily be avoided by having a subsection of pyruvic acid specifically discussing pyruvate.