Talk:Ruslan Kogan

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This article sucks[edit]

woo woo wooooooo — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.58.44.82 (talk) 17:47, 20 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Absolutely shameless promotion. Probably unimportant, since the presence of this type of promotion is not a surprise in this context. Damaging to the reputation of Wikipedia (because of the lack of balance) but unlikely to actually mislead anybody (because of the tissue thin transpacency) Probably not worth trying to improve, but is there a 'junk' rating on the quality and importance scale?Jhunt29 (talk) 23:29, 22 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, and there's quite a few issues that I tagged. Feel free to fix each issue and remove the appropriate tag. Widefox (talk) 11:10, 30 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]
(as per the same issues commented on at Talk:Kogan Technologies POV yes, advert yes. There's multiple serious concerns with this article, including the POV which I didn't tag (just left an advert tag). Is there is an editor who has a WP:COI here? please can you disclose that as per that guideline. Widefox (talk) 11:24, 30 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

What a promotion[edit]

Agree with above - I have never seen such a poorly written article about ANYONE. It's like every part of his life has been summarised into a well-targeted line within the introduction, without any regard for factual or chronological presentation. When I get an account I think this will definitely be up-and-coming for a nice cleanup! --Vogez (talk) 01:28, 13 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Edit of "Kogan Technologies" section[edit]

I agree with the remarks made above - there are multiple problems with this article. I've therefore begun to edit it to address the issues that have been raised. Tonight, I edited the "Kogan Technologies" section, making the following changes:

I changed the title from “Starting Kogan” to “Kogan Technologies”, since the section deals with the company's history in its entirety, not just its inception.

I went through the section's sources and made sure there were no more bare URLs.

I amended “large organisations” to just “organisations”, and removed “stayed up for several days”, so that the events are related from a neutral perspective, rather than as a David-and-Goliath drama.

I amended “Ruslan was in a position where had had begun pre selling the TVs on eBay” to “When Kogan began to sell TVs on eBay” - in the interests of clarity and readibility.

I removed “He started the business with no external funding or capital, and it has gone on to become one of the fastest growing companies in Australia.” - most of this information is repeated just a few paragraphs later, and seems better placed there. I also added this sentence's citations to the later paragraph, and also the words “He started the business with no external funding or capital”, since they gave information that was not included there.

I removed “Ruslan revealed in October 2010 that there were many initial roadblocks; namely that Chinese factories would not deal with him, and his closest advisors and friends thought he was crazy for thinking people would buy TVs online.” - the factories' refusal to deal with him has already been dealt with in this section's third paragraph, and the part about his closest advisors and friends seems to be the kind of excessive detail that the “Intricate Detail” tag is highlighting. I also moved the citation used here to the third paragraph, since it concerns the events related there.

I removed “claiming to be the cheapest option for consumers”, since it read like an advertisement.

I condensed “In October 2010 Ruslan Kogan revealed in an interview that he would be expanding the Kogan brand to the UK, following the successful launch of Milan Direct in the same year. In November 2010 Ruslan Kogan announced the opening of www.kogan.co.uk.” to “In 2010, following the launch of Milan Direct, the Kogan brand expanded to the UK, with the launch of www.kogan.co.uk.” - in the interests of conciseness and clarity.

I removed “Ruslan Kogan appeared on the cover of the March/April 2011 Wealth Creator magazine.” - this seemed superfluous, and was also perhaps contributing to the problems highlighted by the “Advertising” tag.

I removed “The company projects sales of over $100 million in 2011-2012.[47] It recorded its highest single day of sales ever on July 31, 2012, exceeding $1 million in transactions.[48]” - this seemed like the kind of excessive detail highlighted by the “Intricate Detail” tag.

I also made a number of more minor changes to the wording of this section, in the interests of clarity and readability. Mermish (talk) 03:27, 6 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Edit of "Awards", "Open Source", "LivePrice" and "Kogan Lifestyle brand" sections[edit]

I went through these sections and repaired the numerous citations with bare URLs.

The "Awards" section was chaotically organised, with the various awards appearing in largely random order. I therefore reorganised the list so that it runs in roughly chronological order. I removed the last award on the list, because the source cited was a dead link.

The open source section consisted largely of quotations from Kogan himself, which caused problems with both neutrality and the kind of excessive detail highlighted by the “Intricate Detail” tag. I therefore rewrote the section to address these issues, summarising the salient points from the quotations whenever possible, rather than quoting directly, thereby making the section more condensed and concise. As part of this process, I removed the “Android” and “Chromium” subheadings, which seemed unnecessary. Mermish (talk) 06:27, 7 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The "Kogan Lifestyle brand" section seemed to work better in this part of the article, rather than at the end, where it was formerly located - I therefore moved it here. Note also that I have changed the title of this section from "Lifestyle" to "Kogan Lifestyle brand", to make it less ambiguous.

Edit of "Controversies" section[edit]

The “Controversies” section seemed overly lengthy in relation to the rest of the article, and was full of the kind of excessive detail that the “Intricate Detail” tag highlights. It also used too many quotations, which not only contributed to making it too long, but also perhaps caused problems with neutrality. I therefore reworked it to make it more concise and neutral, making the following changes:

I went through the "Internet Explorer 'Tax'" subsection and repaired all of the citations with bare URLs. Also in the “Internet Explorer 7 Tax” subsection, I removed the part dealing with the comments from Mashable, and Kogan's reply to those remarks, since it seemed like the kind of excessive detail highlighted in the “Intricate Detail” tag. I also ensured that the section always refers to the 'tax' using single quotation marks, to ensure that the article's language is distinct from that of the campaign itself, thus helping to address the issues raised by the “Advertisement” tag. I took care to leave the quotations, so that the article simply reports Kogan's opinions of Microsoft, rather than wikipedia voicing those opinions itself – again, in the interests of neutrality. I also made some minor changes to the wording, in places, in the interests of readability and clarity. Mermish (talk) 07:59, 7 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In the “Cable Con” subsection, I repaired all of the citations with bare URLs. Again in the "Cable Con" subsection, I made sure that the phrase “Cable Con” always appeared in quotation marks, so that it is clear that this is Kogan's opinion, rather than Wikipedia's. I also reduced the amount of quotations, although taking care to preserve enough of them to ensure that Kogan's opinion is not represented as that of Wikipedia. I also made minor changes to the wording in the interests of readability and clarity. Mermish (talk) 09:16, 7 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The "Divorce from traditional retail" and "Website glitch" subsections were less problematic in terms of neutrality, and the changes I made there were made more in the interests of conciseness, reducing the amount of quotations and ensuring that the overall length was in proportion to the sections' overall significance to the article as a whole. Again, I also repaired all of the citations with bare URLs. Mermish (talk) 10:25, 7 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In the “Australian Government Set Top Box scheme” subsection, I replaced the word “slammed” with “criticised”, and the phrase “far too much” with “too much money” - both of these changes being in the interests of neutrality. I also made more minor changes in the interests of conciseness and readability, and repaired all the citations with bare URLs.

The “Apple” and “JB Hi-Fi” subsections seemed to be detailing different stages in the same controversy, and the “Apple” heading was also problematic in that this was a dispute between Kogan and JB Hi-Fi, rather than between Kogan and Apple. I therefore combined these two sections into one, entitling it “JB Hi-Fi”. I entirely removed the sentence “At the Annual General Meeting in October 2011, a JB shareholder claimed consumers were "being screwed" by JB Hi-FI, when responding to the comment, the chairman and CEO of JB Hi-Fi acknowledged the "challenging conditions" they face due to the cheaper prices online.[107]” - this is concerned solely with JB Hi-Fi, rather than the relations between Kogan and JB Hi-Fi, and therefore seemed superfluous, adding the kind of excessive detail highlighted by the “Intricate Detail” tag. I also made more minor changes, throughout the section, in the interests of conciseness and readability, and yet again, repaired the citations with bare URLs. Mermish (talk) 07:56, 8 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In the Harvey Norman subsection, I removed the phrases “war of words”, “the dispute erupted” and “another swing”, since they seemed overly dramatic, and lacking in neutrality. I also amended “a complete hoax” to “a hoax”, and “actually manage to open up” to “succeeded in opening”, for the same reason. I also merged the “2011 Harvey Defence” section into this section, and cut the length of that section's quotation, in the interests of reducing the “Controversies” section's over-reliance on quotations. Mermish (talk) 08:52, 8 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I also made minor changes in the "McDonalds" subsection - repairing a bare URL, and rewriting in the interests of clarity and conciseness.

I then removed the "Bare URLs" tag, having at last repaired them all.

I think that the issues raised by the Advertisement, Intricate Detail, Close Connection, and Neutrality tags are all resolved, now, too. Could somebody please remove them? Thank you.

With regard to the Primary Sources and Reliable Sources tags: I read over Wikipedia's guidelines, on the “Reliable Sources” page, and notice that it does not disallow the use of primary sources, but states that “Material based purely on primary sources should be avoided.” It seems to me, having looked at this article's sources in considerable detail during the course of this edit, that although the article does use primary sources, it is not overly-reliant on them, employing them as a means of putting flesh on the bones provided by its reliable secondary sources. Could these remaining two tags also please be removed? Again - thanks. Mermish (talk) 09:17, 8 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It's been a couple of days, now, since I requested that someone consider removing this article's tags. Since no-one has responded, I've removed them myself. Please feel free to leave me a talk page message. Mermish (talk) 16:16, 10 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Flagged as Résumé and for Neutrality[edit]

Many of the edits were made by the subject of the article himself, this is a highly promotional article and needs to be cleaned up or nominated for deletion. 75.137.75.238 (talk) 15:33, 13 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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