User talk:Nadsab

various Early Settlers categories

Hi, before you expend too much more effort into populating these categories, a couple of things to consider. First, the categories are mis-capitalized. The "Early Settlers" is not a proper name and should not be capitalized in the category names. Second, what is the criteria for inclusion in such categories? What is an "early settler"? Is it anyone who happened to be among the first settlers in a community regardless of when (I mean some parts of northern Michigan and the UP were not settled until relatively late). That may seem too imprecise of a criteria. Also, when would a person no longer be considered an "early settler" of a place? Also, given the way the categories are named, it seems inappropriate to include places within the categories. Third, the general rule is to only create categories and subcategories when there is a need to divide a larger category that is already over-populated (or at least where there already exists a substantial number of articles that would fit the criteria for the new category). Is it really necessary to have subcategories for each county in Michigan when at present there are relatively few articles. I mean, there may be enough to create categories for southeast Michigan counties and perhaps Kent County and a few others, but there may not be any articles present on early settlers in many of the counties, and may not ever be any in some cases, making the existence of the empty categories unnecessary (and distracting, since you have to open the category to discover that it is empty).

My suggestion is to begin slowly, rather than creating a large number of categories that may ultimately end up being deleted. You might want to start by putting together a list or two of names for existing articles and likely candidates for new articles (remember that not every early settler necessarily merits a separate encyclopedia article). older ≠ wiser 18:19, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Hi there older - wiser , Thanks for the thoughtful input. As to the The "Early Settlers of the United States" category, I left that astray and switched to the "United States Early Settlers" category which I think is a bit easier to find as a sub under the Settlers cat - the original is deleted. I was thinking that the criteria for inclusion in such categories would be something like - the very first folks who settled in what is now known as a community. For example, one would likely not consider an early settler a person who came to a town that had been on the map for 30 or 40 years. However if someone came to a township or a city, village, county, etc. within the first five or ten years of it's existence, I think it would be fair or appropriate to include such a person in the cat. Common sense would dictate that. Yes, some parts of northern Michigan and the UP were not settled until relatively late - how would you classify as being relatively late? If a community was not founded until say, 1920, should early settlers be excluded for consideration? Personally I don't agree. If a town was founded in 1980 then yes, the first few folks in that town could be considered being early settlers of that town. Needless to say the chances of finding anyone on wikipedia, or anywhere else for that matter, who would be considered an early settler of a town which was incorporated in the past few decades are either remote, or would not hold much historical interest for anyone to include such folks on such a list.

I do agree with you that not every settler merits a seperate article. I don't agree that it is inappropriate to include places within the categories - this is a common occurance in wikipedia and one could find many examples, i.e., county categories, etc. I was starting out by including only articles which referred to specific individual settlers, not articles which used the concept of settlers as an umbrella sense or in a generic sense.

As far as the idea of not creating new categories unless there already exists a substantial number of articles that would merit the creation of a new category is concerned, I have found over 500 articles which are related to early settlers throughout Michigan - settlers in about every county in the state. It may or may not be absolutely necessary to have county subcategories for these settlers that's true, but it would be easier to search for settlers if an individual was looking for early settlers in a particular county. They could be all lumped together in the Michigan cat or by state cat, and as the state early settlers category list(s) grow, it could be later sub divided into counties - that's a good idea.

My plan was to also nicely format each category page with some highlights of early settlers for that state, county, etc.

For further discussion see Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_February_18#NEW_NOMINATIONS thanks. Nadsab 19:47, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

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Category:United States Early Settlers

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Category:Kent County Early Settlers

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