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Ivo Herenčić

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Nominator(s): OakMapping (talk)

Ivo Herenčić was an Ustaša who orchestrated an unsuccessful assassination attempt on Alexander I of Yugoslavia in the interwar period. He committed various war crimes and worked in several surveillance departments of the Independent State of Croatia (NDH) during World War II. One of the leaders of the withdrawal of the armed forces of the NDH, he was not able to negotiate passage into Austria but he himself escaped and was never apprehended.

This is my first ACR nom, so I might be overambitious but I believe the article meets A-class criteria. This article is certainly my best work so far and I would love to see it go through rigorous reviews. OakMapping (talk) 14:45, 12 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Gog the Mild

"was a general in the armed forces of the Independent State of Croatia (Nezavisna Država Hrvatska, NDH), a fascist puppet state, where he commanded a battalion of Ustaše Militia that committed many war crimes and atrocities on civilians in the NDH." 1. Could we have dates for this? 2. Optional: consider breaking this long sentence.
- I changed it to "was a general in the armed forces of the Independent State of Croatia (Nezavisna Država Hrvatska, NDH), a fascist puppet state. Where, in 1941, he commanded a battalion of Ustaše Militia that committed many war crimes and atrocities on civilians in the NDH." Is it better?
" He was sent to the Herzegovina region". By whom?
- It says that Pavelić sent him in the body of the article, I don't think that detail is important enough to be included in the lead
"feared by the people". Could you be a little more specific as to who "the people" were?
- Unfortunately I no longer have access to the source I used for that but IIRC it wasn't more specific.
"Economic-Business Higher School". 1. What does this mean? 2. Why the upper case initial letters?
- It's my attempt at translating Ekonomsko-komercijalna visoka škola, I am not sure if visoka škola could be translated as college, I would like to hear another opinion on this. I removed upper case initial letters, added Croatian name, and replaced business with commerce because it's probably a better translation.
"he entered a camp for members of the ultra-nationalist and fascist Ustaše organisation". What does this mean? He was interned? "camp" has a variety of meanings.
- He wasn't interned, replaced entered with joined. Hopefully now it's more clear.
"Hetman". Perhaps an indication of its connotations?
- Added a sentence explaining what hetman is, but he adopted it as a pseudonym
"he had been trained to throw in a training camp". Optional: avoid "trained ... training".
- replaced "trained" with "taught how"
Per the second bullet of MOS:JOBTITLES most mentions of "king" should be 'King'.
- done
"Bosnia and Herzegovina are dup linked. Check for other cases.
- I don't think it is, it's linked in the lead and in the first instance in the body
"while participating in fighting in Bosnia and Herzegovina." Against whom?
- the source doesn't say
"Herenčić was one of the UNS and RAVSIGUR officers whose atrocities made them very feared by the people." 1. Which people? 2. This seems to be in the wrong place, there has been no mention of Herenčić's involvement in any atrocities since he joined RAVSIGUR. If people were especially afraid of him, then ideally the reasons should be detailed; if they can't be, this still IMO needs rephrasing.
- As I said above I no longer have access to the source I used for that. I found no examples of his involvement in atrocities since he joined RAVSIGUR. I see why it needs rephrasing but I don't know how to rephrase it, if you or anyone else has any suggestions for that I would be happy to hear them.
"HOS" is mentioned in the lead, but not the body.
- It's mentioned as "Croatian Armed Forces", it's only mentioned once in the body so there's no need to use an abbreviation.
"should not advance any further". "advance" seems an inappropriate word.
- I can't think of a better word, any suggestions?
"Herenčić, together with Metikoš, Servatzy and Danijel Crljen met with Scott ... Herenčić, Metikoš, Servatzy and Crljen, representing the retreating NDH forces, met with Scott". Is this a duplication?
- No, there were two meetings, I tried making it more clear.
Is there no more detail on his post-war life? Eg, is it known if he had children, or when his wife died, or what he did for a living?
- Only when his wife died, I added that

A really nice article. I have seen worse nominated for FAC. Gog the Mild (talk) 17:59, 2 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you a lot for the review, I addressed all your comments. @Gog the Mild:

Placeholder for PM

Definitely my area, OakMapping. Will take a look once you've addressed Gog's comments. Ping me at that point. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 10:59, 13 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've addressed all Gog's comments @Peacemaker67:

@@ Line 13: / Line 13: @@
 ==== Gog the Mild ====
 *"was a general in the armed forces of the Independent State of Croatia (Nezavisna Država Hrvatska, NDH), a fascist puppet state, where he commanded a battalion of Ustaše Militia that committed many war crimes and atrocities on civilians in the NDH." 1. Could we have dates for this? 2. '''Optional''': consider breaking this long sentence.
+** I changed it to "was a general in the [[Croatian Armed Forces (Independent State of Croatia)|armed forces]] of the [[Independent State of Croatia]] ({{lang|sh|Nezavisna Država Hrvatska}}, NDH), a [[Fascism in Europe|fascist]] [[List of World War II puppet states|puppet state]]. Where, in 1941, he commanded a battalion of [[Ustaše Militia]] that committed many war crimes and atrocities on civilians in the NDH." Is it better?
 *" He was sent to the Herzegovina region". By whom?
+**It says that Pavelić sent him in the body of the article, I don't think that detail is important enough to be included in the lead
 *"feared by the people". Could you be a little more specific as to who "the people" were?
+**Unfortunately I no longer have access to the source I used for that but IIRC it wasn't more specific.
 *"Economic-Business Higher School". 1. What does this mean? 2. Why the upper case initial letters?
+**It's my attempt at translating ''Ekonomsko-komercijalna visoka škola'', I am not sure if ''visoka škola'' could be translated as college, I would like to hear another opinion on this. I removed upper case initial letters, added Croatian name, and replaced business with commerce because it's probably a better translation.
 *"he entered a camp for members of the ultra-nationalist and fascist Ustaše organisation". What does this mean? He was interned? "camp" has a variety of meanings.
+**He wasn't interned, replaced entered with joined. Hopefully now it's more clear.
 *"Hetman". Perhaps an indication of its connotations?
+**Added a sentence explaining what hetman is, but he adopted it as a pseudonym
 *"he had been trained to throw in a training camp". '''Optional''': avoid "trained ... training".
+** replaced "trained" with "taught how"
 *Per the second bullet of [[MOS:JOBTITLES]] most mentions of "king" should be 'King'.
+**done
 *"Bosnia and Herzegovina are dup linked. Check for other cases.
+**I don't think it is, it's linked in the lead and in the first instance in the body
 *"while participating in fighting in Bosnia and Herzegovina." Against whom?
+**the source doesn't say
 *"Herenčić was one of the UNS and RAVSIGUR officers whose atrocities made them very feared by the people." 1. Which people? 2. This seems to be in the wrong place, there has been no mention of Herenčić's involvement in any atrocities since he joined RAVSIGUR. If people were especially afraid of him, then ideally the reasons should be detailed; if they can't be, this still IMO needs rephrasing.
+**As I said above I no longer have access to the source I used for that. I found no examples of his involvement in atrocities since he joined RAVSIGUR. I see why it needs rephrasing but I don't know how to rephrase it, if you or anyone else has any suggestions for that I would be happy to hear them.
 *"HOS" is mentioned in the lead, but not the body.
+**It's mentioned as "Croatian Armed Forces", it's only mentioned once in the body so there's no need to use an abbreviation.
 *"should not advance any further". "advance" seems an inappropriate word.
+**I can't think of a better word, any suggestions?
 *"Herenčić, together with Metikoš, Servatzy and Danijel Crljen met with Scott ... Herenčić, Metikoš, Servatzy and Crljen, representing the retreating NDH forces, met with Scott". Is this a duplication?
+**No, there were two meetings, I tried making it more clear.
 *Is there no more detail on his post-war life? Eg, is it known if he had children, or when his wife died, or what he did for a living?
+**Only when his wife died, I added that
 A really nice article. I have seen worse nominated for FAC. [[User:Gog the Mild|Gog the Mild]] ([[User talk:Gog the Mild|talk]]) 17:59, 2 January 2022 (UTC)
+:Thank you a lot for the review, I addressed all your comments. {{Reply to|Gog the Mild}}
 ====Placeholder for PM====
 Definitely my area, {{u|OakMapping}}. Will take a look once you've addressed Gog's comments. Ping me at that point. [[User:Peacemaker67|Peacemaker67]]  ([[User_talk:Peacemaker67|click to talk to me]]) 10:59, 13 January 2022 (UTC)
+:I've addressed all Gog's comments {{Reply to|Peacemaker67}}