User talk:Action potential

Nice edit on the psychology page

Good catch on the Psychology page (change from "Freudian psychology" to "Freudian psychodynamics"). -DoctorW 05:35, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

New NLP

Blimey you have been busy AP! I hardly recognised it. Haven't looked much recently as the whole AT thing was a bit time consuming. Fainites ^barley 22:19, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

GA nomination

Quick! Fix those two cite errors! Fainites ^barley 22:55, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

Pseudo etc etc

These are the 4 categories on Wiki. I think the argument lies between numbers 2 and 3. Some would say 2. If its 3. then the fact that a number of notable scientists consider it pseuodoscience should still be in the article. NLP does seem to have quite a number. Has anybody notable from the NLP world ever specifically answered the pseudoscience charge or do they just ignore it as irrelevent?

• Obvious pseudoscience: Theories which, while purporting to be scientific, are obviously bogus, such as Time Cube, may be so labeled and categorized as such without more.

• Generally considered pseudoscience: Theories which have a following, such as astrology, but which are generally considered pseudoscience by the scientific community may properly contain that information and may be categorized as pseudoscience.

The ArbCom ruled that the following should not be regarded as examples of pseudoscience:

• Questionable science: Theories which have a substantial following, such as psychoanalysis, but which some critics allege to be pseudoscience, may contain information to that effect, but generally should not be so characterized.

• Alternative theoretical formulations: Alternative theoretical formulations which have a following within the scientific community are not pseudoscience, but part of the scientific process.

Fainites ^barley 22:49, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

Grinder and Bostic St Clair offer a reply in Whispering and in a recent seminar they laid out their position. Essentially in the late 2007 seminar Grinder agrees that the hyped up versions of NLP are pseudoscience/New Age. NLP has been commercially exploited. Unethical trainers and practitioners are offering services in the name of NLP without proper training, accreditation or qualifications. But he argued most of the so called evidence-based did provide any evidence for their claims and have not properly investigated NLP. That's why he proposed a framework in Whispering to bring the field back into line with neuroscientific, and cognitive linguistic research. Grinder and Bostic St Clair's reply to critics are partly laid out in their refined epistemological position, proposed research, and refined operational definitions for various patterns. Grinder clearly distinguished the NLP epistemology from an empirical epistemology which he believes is overextended in western society. They propose further research and attempt to correct some of the flaws in previous studies. The stressed the importance of making a distinction between "NLP modeling, NLP training and NLP application" as Grinder believes the application of NLP to psychotherapy, business communication is not the core of NLP but the products of the modeling process. This distinction has often been lost in the research and by various practitioners. So, I think that NLP is bordering 'generally considered pseudoscience' and 'questionable science' but sections of the community are attempting to bring it in line with legitimate scientific practice. In a way this is similar to psychoanalysis. There is no enough evidence to put it in "generally considered pseudoscience" because many papers that have NLP as its focus suggest further research. As a discipline, it is still in its infancy and is still agreeing on definitions, terms and rules for argument/evidence. ----Action potential ^{t c} 03:47, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

It looks to me as if a whole section is needed on this then because the issue is never going to go away. Its a perennial battle on the NLP page. How about we have a section devoted to this vexed question which says what the likes of Beyerstein/Lilienfield etc etc say, and why they say its questionable science or pseudoscience. Also, briefly, the extent and limitations of what research there was. Then the replies and distinctions as you've set out above and any other material on the issue. As long it's all verified and notable etc. It's worth it's own section as its the one issue that causes 90% of all the disputes. We could call it Science or pseudoscience? Fainites ^barley 10:55, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

Systems theory‎

You added that attributions are needed in the systems theory article. I think a lot more copyediting is needed there. I haven't found the time to rewrite the whole article, so once in a while I change small parts. If you have any idea's, please go ahead. That's more then welcome. -- Mdd (talk) 15:28, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

My subject knowledge is limited. I'll first dig out some reliable texts and other source, then help you with copyediting certain sections. The attribution tag was just to specify who was referred to by the phrase, "many were led to believe". Many, of who specifically? Especially if you're active on that article, I'd like to copyedit it with you. Best regards, ----Action potential ^{t c} 01:21, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

At the moment I'm only a little active with the WikiProject Systems and controling the edits made to systems science related articles. Best regards -- Mdd (talk) 19:58, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

Congrats AP ! [1] Fainites ^barley 14:12, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Thanks Fainites, if it works out I'll return to my resting potential. ----Action potential ^{t c} 14:37, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

This may interest you...

I'm contacting you because you look like Wikipedia's resident expert on NLP.

We don't yet have a List of basic neuro-linguistic programming topics.

If you were to build one, it might give you a fresh perspective on the topic.

The lists in the set all have the same basic format (but not identical), so to start the list, click on the redlink above, and add the following line to the page and click save:

{{subst:BLT|neuro-linguistic programming|Neuro-linguistic programming}}

Then fill in the list with links, changing and adding headings as needed.

When (near) complete, add it to Lists of basic topics. Browse the lists on that page for examples and ideas on structuring your list.

If you do create it and work on it, I'll be sure to drop in and help.

The Transhumanist 09:22, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Sounds very interesting as having a basic list of topics would help refocus the project and article. ----Action potential ^{t c} 03:09, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

AfD nomination of NLP Modeling

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