Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Human Factors Lab

Human Factors Lab

Human Factors Lab (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log • AfD statistics)

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non-notable/non-reputable sources and coverage BringThemDown (talk) 03:00, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

• This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 13:17, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

• Delete per nomination. Note that this is about a band that fails the music group notability guideline. NME coverage found by Google News is in fact copied from Wikipedia itself. Other results are false positives. - Smerdis of Tlön (talk) 15:27, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 20:16, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

How could anyone say this band should be deleted? That makes no sense at all. What requirements are they not meeting? This is obviously just an attack. Is wiki just deleting bands now? I saw deadstar assembly got deleted. Another awesome band. Wiki must be circling the drain if they keep this up —Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.133.62.18 (talk) 04:46, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

IN regards to the Notability as set forth by wikipedia, 1.Has been the subject of multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent from the musician or ensemble itself and reliable.,The band has had articles and interview in many national and regional publications including looker magazine, rag magazine, City Link,new times, ect.[1] 4.Has received non-trivial coverage in a reliable source of an international concert tour, or a national concert tour in at least one sovereign country.-They have toured the U.S. 7 times, their 2 most recent tours with Mushroomhead received extensive amounts of press, a quick google search can show some for the pages such as MTV[2], and Blabbermouth[3] that covered the tours.

5. Has released two or more albums on a major label or one of the more important indie labels (i.e., an independent label with a history of more than a few years and a roster of performers, many of which are notable).Toxic Shock records[4] is a notable indie label. HFLs label mates include psychotica, and Team Cybergiest featuring Angel from Dope

6.Is an ensemble which contains two or more independently notable musicians, or is a musician who has been a member of two or more independently notable ensembles.-The band is led only by one person and features rotating live members Seven has also worked closely with other bands such as Crossbreed, and 16VOLT. They also release a remix album with remixes by Crossbreed, 16VOLT,KMFDM, BILE, Team cybergiest, as well as many other national " notable" bands.

11.Has been placed in rotation nationally by any major radio network.-Human Factors Lab has regular radio play national, as well as varies podcasts such as razorblade dance floor,

I think it is safe to that that although Human Factors Lab does not meet ALL 12 of the criteria, (to be notable they only have to meet one,)they do in fact meet 5 right off the bat). Statements made by Elblots and Smerdis of Tlön are indeed false by saying the band does not meet the notability guidlines, Perhaps more research before makeing such statements would have helped —Preceding unsigned comment added by HFLSev3n (talk • contribs) 18:29, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

• The subject of the MTV and Blabbermouth articles is Mushroomhead, not Human Factors Lab. Human Factors Lab is named but not discussed; this is only incidental coverage. Toxic Shock Records may be a notable label, but there's no evidence that it is. The question of its WP:notability is moot because it has no WP article. However, the only other of its bands to have a WP article doesn't seem notable, either. The Rag interview does help establish notability, even though members are as noncommittal as an NSA spokesman when talking about the band. As to the rest, you must produce reliable sources that support what you say. Certainly no one else is going to Google "seven" hoping to confirm what you've said. I think too it's fair to ask, is User:HFLSev3n this "seven" of Human Factors Lab? Yappy2bhere (talk) 20:15, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

• The Subject of the MTV and Blabbermouth articles are in response to the #4 of the 12 guidelines set forth by wikipedia.the band " Has received non-trivial coverage in a reliable source of an international concert tour, or a national concert tour in at least one sovereign country"

Mushroomhead was in the fact the headliner of these tours, Human Factors Lab(toxic Shock Records) and Autumn Offering(Victory records) were also apart of the same tour.In addition to Toxic Shock, Human Factors Lab also works with Viabrent Management[5] yes HFLSEV3N is seven from Human Factors Lab, and has been signed on every post made. I think i have just as much right to defend my position in this debate as any one else, And i am trying to do so in a way that is not only fair to Human Factors Lab, but fair to Wiki as well. i DONT use wiki veyr much, until recently i have not been involved in the cration of upkeep of the bands wiki site so perhaps there is information that could be added to help end this debate. as you can see i am not the only one voting for Keeping the page, and also not the only one wanting to delete it. I do feel that the decision should be a fair one. The nomination itself seems like it is not fair, since it was done as an act of vandalism in an attempt to " bringthemdown" them refering to Human Factors Lab" I dont feel that this debate was started with the best interest of Wiki in mind, but instead with malicious intentions. please understand my involvement in this debate is simple to point that out, as well as make sure it remains a fair debate. I truly believe that Human Factors Lab meets the notalibity guidlines for wiki, maybe they are not as well represented as they could be. I am trying to show that the evidence is there that they do meet them. even if its only meeting one of the 12, or 5 of the 12. I guess that is for us all to figure out —Preceding unsigned comment added by HFLSev3n (talk • contribs) 20:31, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

This bands website has fallen under vandalism attacks by previous members of the band. This deletion request is a part of these attacks and should be treated as an attempt to vandalize the bands wikipedia article, as well as wikipedia itself —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.119.152.6 (talk) 17:33, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

It's been years since I worked on this article, I've no particular opinion on it. I did tend to think it was notable at the time I worked upon it, but whether it's truly notable, I'm not so sure. I'd be inclined to go with deletion for it if I was pushed, but it could easily go either way, I suspect. Nick (talk) 20:53, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

if anyone checks the history i think its obvious this is vandalism. Comments like " small weiner" and other childish things being added to it make this clear. I cant imagine the Human Factors Lab wiki page not being notable, perhaps there is information missing that could help? im not sure.. it seems fairly complete. perhaps there is a way to help the page, instead of lettering Wikipeda fall victim to vandalism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by HFLSev3n (talk • contribs) 23:40, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

This band is in no way valid by the terms set by Wikipedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Elblots (talk • contribs) 01:33, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Total 3rd party here. I don't think it should be taken down. They have national noteriaty. They have played w big name big lable bands. I say keep it! Loogie. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.171.234.186 (talk) 04:59, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

You vandalized articles in two of your three edits [6] [7]. What brings you here? Yappy2bhere (talk) 05:24, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

• Comment BringThemDown, 32.133.62.18, 75.119.152.6, HFLSev3n, and Elblots are all single purpose accounts. Strictly speaking, Elblots was created to argue the deletion of Deadstar Assembly, but since the two bands play together [8] I think it's fair to include the Deadstar Assembly supporter(s) as interested parties. Yappy2bhere (talk) 05:54, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Another 3rd party here it is not the band responsible for the page vandalism it is it's past members who think that since they are not in the band anymore they feel like they should cause controversy within the band.. and as someone metioned the removal of DSA one question. Why? Both great bands with great followings.. Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.51.16.4 (talk) 14:38, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

The terms set forth by wikipedia clearly state that a band must provide NOTABLE REFERENCES. Not word of mouth, not local papers that no ones heard of, no internet radio play. The band claims to have national radio airplay, but no evidence of such was presented and a search provides no support on this. The "label" has only 9 bands "signed" to it, all of which as small or smaller than the band in question and thus not notable, which in no way qualifies them as a big independent outfit. The only mention of the band member working with any notable acts are in the form of remixes (which incidentally does not quality the members as being a part of the musical outfit), most of which are not mentioned by the bands the remix were for. Mention on blabbermouth is valid, however it is a web-blog and thus not a notable reference.

The article has no citations, no valid links to support anything, and as such meets none of the wikipedia guidelines that are clearly pointed out on this page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.2.198.190 (talk) 19:19, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

I would also like to add that there is no notable print reviews (local outfits and blogs are far from a reputable source) on this group. The only mention a google search brings up for them are on sites/blogs/social sites that are run by the band themselves. It would appear that the group is using wikipedia as a self promotion tool (which is against the terms of the site), as well as a way to seem credible to outfits that see that they aren't. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.109.42.91 (talk) 19:24, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

The articles that the band appears in are a mixture of Regional( or as stated "local") articles as well as national. The Looker Magazine article linked earlier is in fact a globally distributed release. The band has had a lot of regional press, but has done so on a national level. there have been printed articles and interview in college magazine or local music magazines, but these have been done on a national level. not just to the local area in which the band resides. in regards to the label, yes it is small in the sense of only haviing 9 bands. But the 2 bands listed above, Psychotica, and Team Cybergiest on their own are very notable. Psychotica was a part of the lalapolooza tours ,as well as a few tour with Tool, and have a number of national and global released and distributed albums . So your claim about the labels and the bands is simply an assumption you made having little or no knowledge of the subject, and not researching the topic before making the statement.. its completly false. bands members working with notable acts, as stated Seven has worked with both 16VOLT, and CROSSBREED. these bands ALSO did remixes but his work with theses bands was independant of Human Factors Lab The mentions on blabbermouth and MTV were simply examples. if internet sources are not valid there are just as many if not more print sources available,what citations ad valid links are needed? perhaps they could be added. You say no notable print reviews, as stated the band has had hundreds of printed reviews and articles, what to you is " notable" ? the looker magazine article didnt seem to be notable enough for you, and that has global distro. . The band is NOT using Wiki for self promotion, the band was not involved in the creation of the wiki site ,ad has had very little to do with it at all until the past 6 months, these edit over the past 6 months were only to update and have more acurate information, as well as to undo the many vandalism attacks that have taken place by EX members —Preceding unsigned comment added by HFLSev3n (talk • contribs) 20:07, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

In the future, please sign your edits with four tildes (~~~~), HFLSev3n, so that it's clear who is saying what. If the "Fetish Chic Cheat Sheet" is the Looker magazine content that you're speaking of, then I don't understand how it's relevant to this band. Perhaps you can explain. If there are "hundreds of printed reviews and articles," then cite a few. In any case, please stop fighting with your mates and address yourself to the issues instead. Yappy2bhere (talk) 20:34, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

The point still stands that the label is by far not major, nor notable in any way. Working on a remix for a band does NOT make them a member of the groups, and thus the original statement stands.

There are no links to support any of the claims being made. One un-cited publication does not make you valid by any means. College and local papers are also not notable.

This debate is being held by the band singer himself as is observed by the username, which is a conflict of interest, and has been the main updater of it for a while now, so the statement about how he has had little involvement is also false. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.2.198.190 (talk) 20:22, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I have been a major part of this debate, but im not sure how that is a conflict of interest, please explain? Are you saying to do not have a place in this debate? i feel that i have offered fair and factual evidence and examples of why the page should not be deleted. I stated before that i did not crate the wiki page, and up until the last 6 months, i have not been involved in the editing, this fact can be seen by viewing the dit history. Most of my edits have been a combination of undoing vandalism, as well as updating the page to current and correct information. As far as my involvement with 16VOLT and CROSSBREED i stated that i worked with both bands OUTSIDE of Human Factors Lab in addition to their remix work they did for HFL. I was part of the 16VOLT Denial HWY tour 2008 filling a number of roles, including live guitars, live keyboards, [[9]] Also worked in the studio with crossbreed on their New Slave Nation EP. —Preceding unsigned comment added by HFLSev3n (talk • contribs) 20:40, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

65.2.198.190 (talk) 20:45, 5 February 2010 (UTC) Touring as a fill in member of a band isn't exactly notable. As for the involvement in/with other groups, even if those were in fact valid, there is no proof/citations on the matter.

The Nature of 16volt, as well as many bands in the industrial rock or Industrial metal genres is that they are often led by one main person, and in a touring situation there are varies live touring members. examples of this would be NIN, KMFDM, Ministry, ect. Eric Powel is the driving force behind 16volt and the people he chose to fill the live positions were chosen because each of them held a degree of notability among the fans of Industrial Music. Steve white(KMFDM), MIke Peoples(daniel Ash band) , Jason baznet(CHEMLAB) and Seven(Human Factors Lab) Im not sure why you would say " even if those were in fact valid" i included a link to the 16volt site. but you can also check ANY press release made in regards to the 16VOLT denial HWY tour and you will find the same information i am providing you with here.