Talk:Electropop

shouldn't list include anthony rother? he's created lots of cult electronic music, including 'electro pop' album.

Electropop Musicians List

There are a lot of artists on that list that are merely pop artists who have taken electropop influences and used them in their own work. A number of them shouldn't be included in a list of "notable electropop musicians". Someone needs to clean up that list. I mean Sugababes and Hilary Duff?!! Christ....

An article that talks about a particular genre of music and gives a list of notable musicians from the genre should be mainly listing artists that have had something substantial to contribute to the genre. If there's a wiki article on jazz music should we then include Christina Aquilera as a "notable jazz musician" because her last album had jazz influences? Strictmachineaddict 10:54, 12 May 2007 (UTC)IOI I agree but you are wasting your time on wikipedia, when it comes to music it is too subjective. Most people who are serious technopop/electro fans know what the genre is and they would know that Britney is not electropop. The actual wiki article on Britney classes her as Pop so why is she classed as electrpop here? Sources are important but they must be GOOD sources. I can find a source backing up any opinion but it doesn't make it authoritative. However this small insignificant article is not worth my time.

I did add YMO to list the list but it will probably be removed despite the encyclopedia of popular music listing them as second only to Kraftwerk in terms of pioneering electronic music.

Subgenre?

Who says that electropop is a subgenre of synthpop? COuldn't it be exactly the opposite?--Doktor Who 12:57, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Good point. The intro now reads... "first flourished from 1978 to 1981 in both England and Germany. Electropop laid the groundwork for a mass market in chart-oriented synthpop, but later became seen by musicologists as merely a subgenre of synthpop." 9th August 2006.

The only subgenre SynthPop is New Wave and nothing more. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.119.131.29 (talk) 23:26, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

Synthpop has become a broader term to indicate a variety of pop made with synths.... so of course electropop falls under that category. Its pop made with synths after all. Having said that "synthpop" should be among the "derivative forms"...not in the "stylistic origins" as it is now. there was NO synthpop before electropop....electropop was the first form of synthpop(and infact in its origin the terms were used as synonymous).

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Sequencer07 (talk • contribs) 16:29, 29 March 2009 (UTC) x

Simply wrong

Everything in this article is wrong. --Dr. Who 01:59, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

• Why don't you fix it, then? Be bold! :) Ianthegecko 15:29, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

• AAAHHMMM....DUB has been around since the late 60's. Just experimental madness and spin offs from rocksteady and reggae production. Because DJ's and Producers discover it in the mid 90's does not make it anything new. It would be a subgenre of reggae, as with Dancehall.

I agree, 1978 - 1981? more like 1978 - 1983 at least. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.175.196.223 (talk) 04:05, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

i agree with extending it to 1983. the original author of this article confused the futurist movement of 1978-1980 with electropop which actually peaked from 1981 to 1983.(the electropop tag was actually created to break away from experimental "futurism" underlining its pop nature) infact the first bands and records to be defined as electropop by UK media of the time ("Smash Hits" and "Sounds" UK magazines)all date to 1981 : Depeche Mode-speak&spell, Human League Dare (their earlier work fell into "futurism") and SoftCell Non stop Electronic Cabaret. the term stood for Elecronic Pop (POP!) and was heavily in use up to mid 80s all across europe. There was a debate between Human League and OMD on who invented electropop....with OMD claiming they had invented the electropop formula in 1979 with "Electricity" but with other bands dismissing such claim as the song didn't have a fully electronic sound (it didnt have an electronic beat). 1978-1983 covers the whole scenario and accounts for the massive electropop hits which were released up till 1983 (from yazoo "don't go" to eutythmics "sweet dreams" ,depeche mode "get the balance right"...with new order "blue monday" in 1983 closing the era).

 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sequencer07 (talk • contribs) 18:58, 26 March 2009 (UTC) 

Mainstream artists

Please forgive me if I do so incorrectly, but I assume that the only reason Rachel Stevens, Hilary Duff, and Girls Aloud were removed from this article is because they are mainstream artists, but they all release electropop records. Rachel Stevens's Come and Get It is widely regarded as a seminal pop album (a review), and Hilary Duff's new album is receiving a similar reception. Girls Aloud were one of the acts that brought electropop back into the pop mainstream in 2003-2004.

In short, please don't remove artists and groups from the list because you don't like them, ESPECIALLY when references are given, as opposed to every other artist in the list. 68.185.182.12 07:11, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry but if you're going to list artists in a "notable electropop musicians" list they should have atleast contributed something substantial to the genre as opposed to pop artists who have taken on influences from a genre. What qualifies Rachel Stevens and Hilary Duff as notable electropop musicians? Strictmachineaddict 10:57, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

The fact that they have sources. One of these days I am going to gut the entire list and leave only the artists that have sources declaring them "electropop." Hilary Duff, for instance, does, and will not be deleted. Rockstar (^T/_C) 14:53, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

they are mostly reviews of their music, which as I stated takes influences from electropop. I wouldn't consider them notable electropop musicians. Perhaps these people who want Hilary Duff and her ilk to be included in the article should make a separate list of people whose music is influenced by electropop - that would be more accurate. They are pop artists - I don't see how they've done anything notable in the electro field. Even Kylie Minogue her material is more pop that's only recently taken on electropop influences. The term "electropop" gets bandied around by pop fans as if every person releasing an album with even a vague synthesised beat is an electropop musician. Strictmachineaddict 02:30, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Whether or not what you said is true, Wikipedia is not a place for original research, and this project cares more about what reliable sources say than what the truth is. A better explanation of this can be found in the FAQs of WP:V. Rockstar (^T/_C) 05:52, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Right, but Mixel Pixel and Lo-Fi-Fnk are notable.

Please note, [[1]] says "Any edit lacking a source may be removed." This wording would seem to imply that edits with sources should not be removed without a good reason. I know people take music personally, so don't be offended when I say your opinion is not a good enough reason. Please don't remove it again, Strictmachineaddict, unless you can find a fault with the sources or another source disputing the claim. If we were going to remove artists, the three in contention should really be the only three to stay, seeing as they are the only sourced ones. 68.185.182.12 04:33, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

MUUUUU —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.126.198.110 (talk) 20:36, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

How is Lady Gaga and Hillary Duff Electropop. I mean there lyrics arent even Scifi....There even under Synth Pop they can never live along side Duran Duran, Depeche Mode, Human League. Lady Gaga album is too...modern day Hip Hop influenced...She is more Dance Pop out of anything. For female ElectroPop The KNife ok, Goldfrapp ok...but Lady Gaga? Besides most of the mainstream crowd doesnt even know what Electropop is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.119.131.29 (talk) 23:34, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

You may be right but in Lady Gaga's case (do not know about Hillary Duff) she is being linked to a new female electropop movement by several reliable sources. Genre descriptions sometimes undergo change as do words in general. We have the right not to like it but it still must go into articles. As for the two more modern groups you mentioned if you find reliable source cites that describe them as electropop feel free to put them in the article Edkollin (talk) 05:24, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

User 715.119 is absolutely right. The only people daft enough to lump Lady Gaga, Hilary Duff or any Top 40 pop diva under the electro or synthpop banner, are those so absolutely clueless about the genres that they lump together all music with any remote shred of electronic/synthesized influence. I've seen Britney Spears cited in the Synthpop article as an example of a modern "synthpop revivalist", FFS. What the hell? Now Gaga would, of course, like to fancy herself some cutting edge electro artist inspired by 70s Glam rock, yet you clearly get the impression hearing her music of nothing more than cheesy dance-pop, in a slightly 90s Eurodance vein...and way too heavily influenced by hip-hop. It's just typical mainstream pop bullshit. I swear, NOBODY has any sense of what a genre is anymore. The article gives no serious impression of what an Electropop style consists of. It discusses/lists artists from all over the spectrum of Synth, post-punk, dance AND modern bubblegum pop, with very few examples of distinguishable Electropop given.

--And holy shit, it's Edkollin again! Wow. I KNEW that there was something annoyingly disagreeable about the post above mine. 74.69.64.52 (talk) 23:43, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Robyn

I think Robyn should be in the list —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.31.222.50 (talk) 22:36, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

Lily Allen

I think Lily Allen should be mentioned in the "rise of female eletropop" area. Unlike artists like Hillary Duff, Allen has modified her image to fit the electropop sound from her sophomore album, and has implied that her newer electropop sound will be permanent. In addition, there needs to be a citation for "record labels are trying to give male electropop a 'geeky' image." 68.43.83.93 (talk) 23:13, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

I favor putting a separate sentence for her and the Yeah Yeah Yeah's as acts known for other styles adding electro pop elements Edkollin (talk) 06:19, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Nothing but a name..

Seriously guys, think about it. Electropop is nothing but a name.. but to call it a genre? Well we have electronica, synthpop, new wave, dance-pop or even club/dance, but why do we need another fake genre that mixes electronica with dance-pop? JaymanJohn (talk) 07:03, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Could say this about any Genre. It was tehno pop then Synthpop and now electropop. Blur would fit fine as a New Wave Band, but since they came out in the 1990's they are Britpop. Radiohead, Coldplay are really progressive rock but since they came out in the 1990's they are alternative. etc etc. But Wikipedia rules do not care about this. The "Electropop" trend has been the subject of or mentioned in numerous articles in reliable sourced publications (BBC, The Times,NY Times) on both sides of the Atlantic. It easily meets the notability clause so I have to vote to reject the deletion proposal.Edkollin (talk) 07:14, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

I have to agree that deletion would go against notability, but I would probably be in favour of a merger with synthpop, especially since the articles do not distinguish these two "sub-genres". Much the same bands and history are used.--Sabrebd (talk) 08:21, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Maybe it's just me but 'electropop' is nothing more than a name..to sell magazines, to attract readers. Eventhough 'electropop' is mentioned to the mass audience, it doesn't really stand out strong enough in the music industry. People gets confused with it. I mean what is 'Electropop'? Lady GaGa's The Fame? La Roux's La Roux? Blur's Parklife? Don't get confused with Dance-Pop and Club/Dance's style.. GaGa is Dance-Pop + Urban. La Roux is Dance-Pop + Pop music. Blur's Parklife is Britpop/Indie Pop fused with Club/Dance, Alternative Dance and Dance Rock style of music. If you can make it more specific.. maybe you can keep this page.. but for me, I see nothing. Sorry if this didn't explain things correctly. It's my pov about electropop.JaymanJohn (talk) 19:49, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

"Maybe it's just me but 'electropop' is nothing more than a name..to sell magazines, to attract readers. Eventhough 'electropop' is mentioned to the mass audience, it doesn't really stand out strong enough in the music industry." Not just you. Like I started to say above most genre naming is about marketing. Sometimes there is substance behind it sometimes there is not but substance is always a secondary concern. But just because it is marketing based or has a non definitive mass appeal does not make it article unworthy. In my view compared to Alternative Rock or New Wave where acts that are diametrically opposed to each other in every way are classified togeather electropop is relatively specific. Edkollin (talk) 00:44, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Okay I see what what JaymanJohn is saying. Many people actually refuse to put Electropop as a genre in some artist articles because its just another form of synth pop. Many Synth Pop artist only do Sci fi lyrics once in a while for exception of A FLock of Seagulls. Duran Duran travels in and out with the sci fi lyrics. But please Lady Gaga is not electropop whatsoevr. Come on there is nothing sci fi about her lyrics. SHe might have a sci fi look but you need the lyrics. People are ven labelling Britney Spears and Cascada as Electropop. NO! there Dance-pop and Cascada is also Eurodance. La Roux I would say is Electropop. But Lady Gaga is definatly not. Electropop isnt even popular in mainstream music in america...in fact most americas dont even know what it is. Paparazzi is the closest song with sci fi lyrics with the "purple tears" lyric but even thats pushing it cause purple tears could be reference when a girl that wears eye liner begins to cry she gets purple tears. Lets leave Lady Gaga off this article please. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.119.131.253 (talk) 18:35, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

As I said the I have a number of reliable sources call Lady Gaga electro pop and she has a nickname "electropop princess" also sourced. You or I might disagree but we can't write the article based on our feelings. Genre names over the years do become "catch all" to the annoyance of the originators. I think I dealt with the lack of knowledge in America by using writing that this is primarily a British thing (Although La Ruox and Little Boots are making some headway on the dance club charts). As for people disagreeing with the whole concept, find some cites it would be great for the article. Edkollin (talk) 22:01, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Than this article is contradicting itself. The lyrics must be scifi lyrics for it to be Electropop according to this article. I have the LAdy Gaga cd there is nothing scifi about her lyrics. Plus mainstream artist dont even know what it is. Lets leave in the artist that we are 100% sure that they are Electropop. Like HUman League, Depeche Mode, Soft Cell. Ect....there is too much doubt about lady gaga. I might give you Synth pop but she is not electropop whatsoever. People are calling electropop techno music combined with dance pop or Dance pop that has alot of electronic vibe in it. Thats not true electropop music. Also please show proof of these "sources" If theses sources are american than its not saying much because alot of americans dont know what Electropop and maybe even synth pop is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.119.131.253 (talk) 14:49, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Ah, but you shouldn't consider conceding a case for Synthpop either, because she's not. Gaga is dance-pop, and is only labeled differently due to the (pretentious) way that she markets herself combined with the way she dresses. If people merely heard her music without knowing anything about her in a personal/image sense, they would easily come way with the impression of typical radio pop music. Unfortunately, audiences are easy to fool (including "reliable" critics) these days. Good luck with getting Eldkollin to provide proof of those sources of his, though, lol. 74.69.64.52 (talk) 00:22, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Read the article. The "reliable" sources fooled or not saying she is electropop are right there. That is all the proof I need. Why don't you find a reliable source(s) that says she is not electropop. There has to be some somewhere. Then write in the article this is not a universally held view and by name list the reliable sources that dispute that she is electropop.

Off Topic: I hope I'm wrong but you probably won't do that though because you do not like the "reliable source" rules. That is nice but do you have a better idea?. I don't agree with your original meaning is the only meaning idea. There would lot of upset LGBT people if you applied that line of thinking to the Gay article. I don't agree that that if an artist is dance pop she can not be electropop also. By the way I personally do not think Ms. Gaga is electropop or dance pop but disco or post disco. Any my opinion like yours is completely useless to this article. Edkollin (talk) 19:55, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Split the article

I think maybe this article should be split into Electropop and Electropop (2000s genre), because this recent electro pop has very little to do with original electropop, and artists such as Lady Gaga, Britney Spears, Timbaland, Pitbull are loosely related to Kraftwerk and the type of music they pioneered in the late 70s. Also, I think there's a need for a separate description box for contemporary electro pop, as it has different roots from original electropop and when someone arrives to the artcile to read about contemporary electropop and reads that Techno developed from electropop, he'll get a bit confused. --217.21.43.222 (talk) 07:58, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

This sounds like a rewriting issue not a split article issue. You need to describe the different and/or additional roots of the contemporary version of the genre. There is a strong relation between LaRoux, Little Boots and 1980's synthpop (to add more confusion we called it technopop more often then synthpop way back when). Is it not the point of Wikipedia to inform readers coming to read about the current version that there was a original version?. Whatever is done, please completely document it from reliable sources; scholarly books, articles from music journalists in non tabloid and music publications etc. If these sources do not describe 1980's electropop as a different genre we can't. Another point; I do understand the Lady Gaga is reviled in many quarters and many people violently disagree with her being described as electropop. This opinion can't inform how this article is revised (Of course reliable sources disagreeing with Lady Gaga being described as an electropop is article worthy). Check New Wave Music to see how a music genre that has gone though multiple changes in definition, and changes in definition that are more radical then electropop is handled for tips on how and how not to proceed. 209.225.141.253 (talk) 18:49, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

You've got ratio, but aren't contemporary publications doing enough to differentiate electropop and contemporary electropop by claiming Lady Gaga and, for instance, Timbaland's "The Way I Are" are electropop? And the other point is, are there any explicit claims in any sources that the music being described as "electro pop" nowadays is the updated version of original electropop? I mean, if no statements of such kind can be found, then there's a right to make another article about newer electropop. I haven't heard neither LaRoux nor Little Boots, but I am sure connections between 80s new wave/synthpop/electro/electropop and contemporary electropop can be found. As one can find simillar connections between hip hop and funk, but they are still different styles. -- 217.21.43.222 (talk) 10:26, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

In the cites we do have in that section they say La Roux, Little Boots are influenced by the 80's sounds but they don't say its another genre. Wikipedia articles are written based what is verifiable not necessarily what is true. Another words if the legitimate sources do not do their jobs we can't do it for them. For this reason it would be against Wikipedia policy to create a 2000's electropop article if no legitimate sources make such a declaration. Edkollin (talk) 22:43, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Origins

Most genre based music articles have an origin based sub-section, which this article lacks. I suggest we have one here, or at least a paragraph, that can deal more fully and appropriately with the forerunners of the genre, such as "Krautrock" pioneers like Kraftwerk, which is rather lost in the beginning of the History section here.--SabreBD (talk) 09:53, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Synthpop and electropop

Are those two the same thing? Synthpop article explains that electropop is "more robotic" than synthpop itself, but doesn't list any sources for such a claim. I've come up with this idea as many synthpop artists are sometimes listed as electropop artists and vice versa. And I've found at least two [reliable] sources, that support my idea:

• "Techno-pop, also termed synth-pop or electro-pop, refers to a rock genre built around synthesizers, ie, computers" @ "Encyclopedia of recorded sound‎", p.1100
• "The role call of technologically enhanced British New Pop acts (classified variously as "Electro-Pop," "New Romantics," "Synth-Pop," and "Haircut Bands")..." @ "I hear America singing: an introduction to popular music‎", p.283

And you are free to look if there are more sources on the topic here: Google.Books search on: "electro pop" synth pop. -- 82.209.225.13 (talk) 17:36, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

It looks to me as if you have found grounds for a merger.--SabreBD (talk) 18:10, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

I guess it would be great to merge them, but I think that more detailed research on the subject is needed. -- 82.209.225.13 (talk) 18:15, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

Does anyone understand the difference between Electropop and Synthpop enough to better distinguish them in this article? Udibi (talk) 19:53, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I do. Synthpop is merely popular music which uses synthesizers, while electropop is a form of popular music which takes themes from electronic music. According to Dictionary.com, Synthpop is defined as: popular music played with synthesizers and having light upbeat melodies and lyrics. 68.40.174.101 (talk) 17:29, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

Electroclash

The way the article is written electroclash artists are assumed to be electropop. While they are obviously related in some way is this correct?. Edkollin (talk) 05:42, 6 December 2009 (UTC)