Talk:Eurovision Song Contest 2012

Controversial win, keep an eye on vandalism

As the Azerbaijani win tonight was quite controversial with all going on with Armenia etc etc. I think it would be good if we all together keep on the look out for vandalism on this Eurovision 2012 article from now on. Already after an hour there is quite heavy IP vandalism. Thanks.--BabbaQ (talk) 00:23, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

You can see evidence already beneath this comment of the troubles ahead of pro-armenia and pro-azerbaijan.--BabbaQ (talk) 00:48, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Armenia–Azerbaijan relations in the Eurovision Song Contest

This headline is one-sided propaganda. If you actually visit the main article here , you will see there is controversy from both sides. Yet this headline only targets Azerbaijan. Also some of the sources are not neutral. This headline simply is not Wikipedia material and must be adjusted accordingly.Neftchi (talk) 00:34, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

We have had this discussion already on the other articles talk page and it was established as a good source. BUT if you can find a better source and provide a better sentence then please do. But just dont delete it,. thanks--BabbaQ (talk) 00:35, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

What other talk page, please show us the link. Neftchi (talk) 00:36, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Also this source does not mention that "Armenians are not allowed entrance to Azerbaijan". In fact Armenian journalists and diplomats have entered Azerbaijan on many occasions.Neftchi (talk) 00:38, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

I have now removed the areas concerning these claims of yours. Im not having another senseless argument with someone. Cheers.--BabbaQ (talk) 00:40, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Also journalists and diplomats are not the same as an average Armenian citizen.--BabbaQ (talk) 00:41, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

If people want they can read about the problems between Azerbaijan and Armenian in Eurovision in the main article. A link is provided for the readers. This dispute between the countries should not be further expanded as it is already more than the actual subject of the article. Neftchi (talk) 00:42, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Armenian diplomats and journalists are citizens of Armenia too. Please dont be discriminating. Neftchi (talk) 00:43, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

As I said im not getting into a senseless discussion over pro-armenia or pro-azerbaijan. sorry.--BabbaQ (talk) 00:45, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

However the summary of the issues ahead are enough and should not be expand further for now I agree. It is a good summary of the events so far. But it is a true issue with Armenia in the Eurovision next year no one can deny that. Cheers.--BabbaQ (talk) 00:46, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

This section must be removed as it is very biased and creates problem for the contest.--NovaSkola (talk) 01:20, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Stop immediatly to remove information from this article. Yes it is controversial but cjust because it is controversial doesnt mean it should be removed. It can be discussed further. But per fact it is a problem ahead which mean even security risk for the Armenian delegation next year. I see you have an interest in Azerbaijani articles. You might be from Azerbaijan I dont know, but its not OK to remove information just because you dont agree with it on a nationlistic pointview. Thanks.--BabbaQ (talk) 10:11, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Past controversies involving Azerbaijan shouldn't be brought up again in this article unless there are clear sources making them an issue for 2012. The overall premise of the section that the controversies "may affect" Azerbaijan's ability to host the contest, and while that may be true, it is still original research without sources explicitly giving that view. So removal was probably right for the time being. CT Cooper · talk 10:09, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

OK. Remove it for now. When it becomes a problem then we return it. Good to get a second non-bias opinion. Thanks.--BabbaQ (talk) 10:11, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

The "See also" mention is good enough for now I guess to.--BabbaQ (talk) 10:13, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

I've actually removed that link too, for essentially the same reasons CT Cooper summed up quite well. Fut.Perf. ☼ 14:10, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Austria not yet confirmed

Austria's participation in 2012 is not yet confirmed. The cited newspaper article does not tell anything about next year. It's all about this year's exitement (or lack thereof). --62.167.137.3 (talk) 08:28, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Actually, it seems like a confirmation of participation: "Deswegen wird auch nächstes Jahr wieder ein heimischer Künstler antreten. " --Christian140 (talk) 14:37, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

Czech Republic didn't confirm return

There will be discussion in Czech Republic, but nobody confirmed their return. (78.136.162.196 (talk) 20:25, 16 May 2011 (UTC))

I agree. Source linked says that it's from some "direct source", but can't say who is that source. Therefore I find this information unreliable. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.173.20.32 (talk) 22:39, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

norway will paricipate but might drop their selection

according to what i have read their song have already been selected internally. the norwegian selection have also been corrupted to the point where the participant is always selected from the third semi final. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.208.86.142 (talk) 13:03, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

I've also heard that from next year broadcasters must use a national selection. But both of these statements are as of now are a mystery. -- [[ axg ◉ talk ]] 21:47, 18 May 2011 (UTC) norway will at least participate. people are however still discussing how the national final will be.

interwiki

please add georgian interwiki ka:ევროვიზიის სიმღერის კონკურსი 2012--David1010 (talk) 11:13, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Poland

Poland may retire next year due to poor performance and financial problems of the public broadcaster. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.125.217.140 (talk) 16:08, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

This claim has been repeatedly added to the article, and removed because of a lack of sourcing. Anyone is free to re-add it if they can give some reliable sources. CT Cooper · talk 16:47, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

In Swedish wikipedia page there are references, I think. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.125.217.140 (talk) 19:39, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

The Swedish version does not give a source, and is tagged: [källa behövs] = [citation needed]. -- [[ axg ◉ talk ]] 21:44, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

A spokesperson of TVP has confirmed in an e-mail sent to me that Poland will most definitely take part in ESC 2012. Unfortunately, this is no valid source and, therefore, I feel it should not be added to the article.--130.226.70.114 (talk) 08:05, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

If you remove your name from the email, and provide translation, you should post the email here to verify your claim doktorb _words^deeds 17:24, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

France and Belarus confirmed

You should add these two countries as confirmed.

Source for France: http://www.eurovision-fr.net/news/index.php?page=1&num=#1127. The paragraph: "Toujours sur toutelatele.com Pierre Sled (Directeur des programmes qui avait fait le déplacement à Düsseldorf) déclare que la France continuera de participer à l'Eurovision : bla bla bla". These sites are reliable. Source for Belarus: http://dziennik-eurowizyjny.blog.pl (in Polish). The article: Białoruś i Finlandia gotowe na ESC (Belarus and Finland confirms participation in ESC 2012). Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.163.71.78 (talk) 18:31, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

you can add norway as well. norway have only withdrawn once and that was together with other countries due to 4 countries winning. in 2002 they were relegated and wasnt allowed to participate otherwise they would. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.208.86.142 (talk)

Internal selections not allowed from 2012 onwards

From 2012 onwards, entirely internal selections will no longer be allowed. Sietse Bakker, Executive Supervisor of the Junior Eurovision Song Contest and Event Supervisor of the Eurovision Song Contest, confirmed this in an interview with Belgian fansite Eurosong.be. Performers may still be chosen internally, but the songs themselves must be chosen by means of a public vote. EBU bevestigt: ‘Volgend jaar publieke selectie verplicht --130.226.70.114 (talk) 10:25, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

Baku

I think saying it is in Baku, is a bit premature. The two sources given are newspapers (Russian newspapers, but if I'll trust they say Baku), but this is obviously based only on the assumption that in all likeliness this will be the venue. No reliable source has confirmed the venue (reliable in this case being only the host broadcaster or the EBU). While, given the Armenia issue, it could arise that it will not take place in Azerbaijan at all, given the recent rarity of another broadcaster hosting the event, I think assuming it will be Azerbaijan is an acceptably reliable statement. I agree, in all likeliness it will also be in Baku (especially since the venues under consideration are all there), but I don't think there is sufficient information to confirm this. - 46.7.141.61 (talk) 21:54, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

how you are such a source of authoritative and influential Russian newspaper - Rossijskoj Gazety [1]?--analitic114 (talk) 22:17, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

There is also this source cited as well, which appears to be a bit closer to home, though it appears to be behind some sort of pay wall. I do think Wikipedia was jumping the gun by treating a claim in a Russian newspaper, even it is reliable on Wikipedia's standards, as an absolute confirmation that the contest will be held in Baku. While I will not remove the content as it stands, a source from the EBU or the broadcaster would be more helpful. At the end of the day, it is not a race, and being cautious is not a problem. CT Cooper · talk 23:22, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

I agree, during first days after ESC 2010 some media reported that ESC 2011 would take placein Berlin, just because it's capital of Germany. Same as you, I'm not sure it's gonna be in Azerbaijan at all. Let's wait for EBU statement, we should have it in less than one month. Meanwhile, I would change it to "It's likely to be held in Baku, Azerbaijan, following Azerbaijan's win in the 2011 Contest with Eldar & Nigar's song "Running Scared""... Statements of Azebaijan authorities are irrelevant until EBU confirms it.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.173.20.32 (talk)

Turkey

The reference link doesn't provide any confirmation for Turkish entry. The link is all about a singer/song writer nominates himself for 2012. --85.98.189.130 (talk) 20:01, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Portugal

Due to international financial rescue, and because RTP should be privatised till the end of 2011, Portugal won't have a public Tv broadcaster and so there is a very high probability of definitive withdrawl — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.129.13.226 (talk) 00:11, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Armenia

Armenia is back in the possible withdrawal list and now has two citations, one is the Russian version of Eurasianet.org's article 'Armenia: Yerevan Grapples with Eurovision Dilemma', which is an article highlighting the political dilema of Armenia participating, but not mentioning anything about them withdrawing, and the other is Eurovisionary. This article, on a site which is essentially a fan site, makes two statements that say that officials have "mentioned" that they'll possibly withdraw and one of them is in the third person. There's no actual official statement quoted by any Armenian official on the subject. On this basis would anyone else agree that these sources be deemed inappropriate and the entry removed until a better source can be found? ~~ Peteb16 (talk) it doesnt exactly seem reliable so i say that it should be removed until a better source have been found.