Talk:World War II reenactment: Difference between revisions
SMcCandlish (talk | contribs) |
→Requested move 28 October 2017: further comments |
||
Line 26: | Line 26: | ||
:This appears to be a coatrack POV article and I would question whether it has any place in WP at all in its present form. Regards. [[User:Cinderella157|Cinderella157]] ([[User talk:Cinderella157|talk]]) 01:32, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
:This appears to be a coatrack POV article and I would question whether it has any place in WP at all in its present form. Regards. [[User:Cinderella157|Cinderella157]] ([[User talk:Cinderella157|talk]]) 01:32, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
||
::I believe that the POV issues can be more effectively addressed if the scope of the article is redefined to focus on the Waffen-SS reenactment. If the POV challenges are insurmountable, then the article can be nominated for deletion. [[User:K.e.coffman|K.e.coffman]] ([[User talk:K.e.coffman|talk]]) 02:09, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
::I believe that the POV issues can be more effectively addressed if the scope of the article is redefined to focus on the Waffen-SS reenactment. If the POV challenges are insurmountable, then the article can be nominated for deletion. [[User:K.e.coffman|K.e.coffman]] ([[User talk:K.e.coffman|talk]]) 02:09, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
||
:::I would believe that there is a place for an article of this present title - one which has a balanced coverage of re-enactment groups of various countries, events ect. In other words, an article which is representative of the title. Even retitled, the present contents would have significant issues of POV weight and coverage that would need to be addressed. At present, there is an implied syllogism that all members Waffen-SS re-enactment groups are racist neo-Nazis. This may be the case but it must be verified - not to mention the validity of such an hypothesis per [[Karl Popper]]. The POV and coatracking issues are not addressed by simply changing the title. There are weight and scope issues too. This is a case of [[WP:ISNOT]]. IMHO. Create a stub of this should be. Take that as an '''oppose'''. [[User:Cinderella157|Cinderella157]] ([[User talk:Cinderella157|talk]]) 07:02, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
|||
I '''oppose''' a move to Waffen-SS reenactment as it will essentially be a de facto "criticism of" article, creating another neglected content fork to drop sensationalist 300 word news articles and tangential axing grinding. The article simply needs (and has needed) the brief attention of a competent editor to create a brief summary. [[User:LargelyRecyclable|LargelyRecyclable]] ([[User talk:LargelyRecyclable|talk]]) 03:45, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
I '''oppose''' a move to Waffen-SS reenactment as it will essentially be a de facto "criticism of" article, creating another neglected content fork to drop sensationalist 300 word news articles and tangential axing grinding. The article simply needs (and has needed) the brief attention of a competent editor to create a brief summary. [[User:LargelyRecyclable|LargelyRecyclable]] ([[User talk:LargelyRecyclable|talk]]) 03:45, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
||
*'''Oppose''' If there are sufficient sources for a Waffen-SS re-enactment article, it should stand alone as a child of the WWII re-enactment article. [[User:Peacemaker67|Peacemaker67]] ([[User_talk:Peacemaker67|click to talk to me]]) 04:16, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
*'''Oppose''' If there are sufficient sources for a Waffen-SS re-enactment article, it should stand alone as a child of the WWII re-enactment article. [[User:Peacemaker67|Peacemaker67]] ([[User_talk:Peacemaker67|click to talk to me]]) 04:16, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
||
*'''Comment''' I'd suggest reducing this to a stub, and splitting the content on Waffen SS reenactment (which is a significant topic in its own right) into a separate article. [[User:Nick-D|Nick-D]] ([[User talk:Nick-D|talk]]) 04:27, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
*'''Comment''' I'd suggest reducing this to a stub, and splitting the content on Waffen SS reenactment (which is a significant topic in its own right) into a separate article. [[User:Nick-D|Nick-D]] ([[User talk:Nick-D|talk]]) 04:27, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
||
*'''Oppose'''. The general community intent does not appear to be for this page to have such a narrow scope; the fact that non-Waffen-SS material was removed for lack of sourcing does not mean at all that sourced material on broader WWII re-enactment won't be soon enough added, which would just necessitate naming it back again. Someone could probably add something of this sort in less than 5 minutes of online source research. (I take George Carlin's view when it comes to battle re-enactors ("Give 'em live ammo!"), so it won't be me.<p>Instead, '''move to [[World War II re-enactment]]''' to match the spelling of that word preferred by most dictionaries.<br /><span style="white-space:nowrap;font-family:'Trebuchet MS'"> — [[User:SMcCandlish|'''SMcCandlish''']] [[User talk:SMcCandlish|☏]] [[Special:Contributions/SMcCandlish|¢]] ><sup>ʌ</sup>ⱷ҅<sub>ᴥ</sub>ⱷ<sup>ʌ</sup>< </span> 04:34, 28 October 2017 (UTC)</p> |
*'''Oppose'''. The general community intent does not appear to be for this page to have such a narrow scope; the fact that non-Waffen-SS material was removed for lack of sourcing does not mean at all that sourced material on broader WWII re-enactment won't be soon enough added, which would just necessitate naming it back again. Someone could probably add something of this sort in less than 5 minutes of online source research. (I take George Carlin's view when it comes to battle re-enactors ("Give 'em live ammo!"), so it won't be me.<p>Instead, '''move to [[World War II re-enactment]]''' to match the spelling of that word preferred by most dictionaries.<br /><span style="white-space:nowrap;font-family:'Trebuchet MS'"> — [[User:SMcCandlish|'''SMcCandlish''']] [[User talk:SMcCandlish|☏]] [[Special:Contributions/SMcCandlish|¢]] ><sup>ʌ</sup>ⱷ҅<sub>ᴥ</sub>ⱷ<sup>ʌ</sup>< </span> 04:34, 28 October 2017 (UTC)</p> |
||
::Support SMcC [[User:Cinderella157|Cinderella157]] ([[User talk:Cinderella157|talk]]) 07:02, 28 October 2017 (UTC) |
Revision as of 07:02, 28 October 2017
Reenactment (inactive) | ||||
|
Military history Unassessed | |||||||||||||||||||
|
Possible sources
- What are the people who reenact 20th Century wars up to?
- [1] War Games: Inside the World of Twentieth-Century War Reenactors by Jenny Thompson (Smithsonian, 2004)
External links; OR
I removed the external links -- these are non official YT channels (pls see WP:Ext. I also found the videos objectionable. Pls lmk if we need to discuss. K.e.coffman (talk) 16:03, 26 March 2016 (UTC)
- I also tagged the article WP:OR as much of the content is uncited and appears to be original research. K.e.coffman (talk) 16:21, 26 March 2016 (UTC)
Weight and coatrack issues
This article in its previous state was an under-sourced overview of the topic with some coverage of critical responses to particular aspects. The current version is a coatrack for criticism lacking any overview or encyclopedic coverage of the nominal subject. Please expand the coverage of the topic with any sources available and attempt to rebalance the commentary. LargelyRecyclable (talk) 17:35, 6 October 2017 (UTC)
Requested move 28 October 2017
It has been proposed in this section that World War II reenactment be renamed and moved to Waffen-SS reenactment. A bot will list this discussion on the requested moves current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{subst:requested move}} . Do not use {{requested move/dated}} directly. |
World War II reenactment → Waffen-SS reenactment – The article used to be a mostly uncited / OR-based fan page: 2015 version; this material was subsequently removed. What's cited in the article is on the topic of Waffen-SS reenactment. Sufficient sources exist to establish notability for this topic in its own right; samples: Man of War: My Adventures in the World of Historical Reenactment, by Charlie Schroeder; Wargames: From Gladiators to Gigabytes, By Martin van Creveld, Bearing Witness: Perspectives on War and Peace from the Arts and Humanities, edited by Sherrill Grace et al; plus the material already cited in the article.
Waffen-SS reenactment is banned in several countries and remains controversial in the English-speaking world. Therefore, there's substantial coverage in RS of the topic, so a redirect may be appropriate. If anybody wishes to create a WW2 reenactment article, they would be able to turn the redirect into a stand-alone page. Another option is to split Waffen-SS reenactment from this article while leaving a stub behind for future development. There have been concerns about the scope of the article (see above), so I hope they can be addressed by either a move or a split. K.e.coffman (talk) 00:20, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- I'd be more inclined to split them, as there are plenty of reenactors playing Allied or Heer units.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 01:15, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- This appears to be a coatrack POV article and I would question whether it has any place in WP at all in its present form. Regards. Cinderella157 (talk) 01:32, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- I believe that the POV issues can be more effectively addressed if the scope of the article is redefined to focus on the Waffen-SS reenactment. If the POV challenges are insurmountable, then the article can be nominated for deletion. K.e.coffman (talk) 02:09, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- I would believe that there is a place for an article of this present title - one which has a balanced coverage of re-enactment groups of various countries, events ect. In other words, an article which is representative of the title. Even retitled, the present contents would have significant issues of POV weight and coverage that would need to be addressed. At present, there is an implied syllogism that all members Waffen-SS re-enactment groups are racist neo-Nazis. This may be the case but it must be verified - not to mention the validity of such an hypothesis per Karl Popper. The POV and coatracking issues are not addressed by simply changing the title. There are weight and scope issues too. This is a case of WP:ISNOT. IMHO. Create a stub of this should be. Take that as an oppose. Cinderella157 (talk) 07:02, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- I believe that the POV issues can be more effectively addressed if the scope of the article is redefined to focus on the Waffen-SS reenactment. If the POV challenges are insurmountable, then the article can be nominated for deletion. K.e.coffman (talk) 02:09, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
I oppose a move to Waffen-SS reenactment as it will essentially be a de facto "criticism of" article, creating another neglected content fork to drop sensationalist 300 word news articles and tangential axing grinding. The article simply needs (and has needed) the brief attention of a competent editor to create a brief summary. LargelyRecyclable (talk) 03:45, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- Oppose If there are sufficient sources for a Waffen-SS re-enactment article, it should stand alone as a child of the WWII re-enactment article. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:16, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment I'd suggest reducing this to a stub, and splitting the content on Waffen SS reenactment (which is a significant topic in its own right) into a separate article. Nick-D (talk) 04:27, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- Oppose. The general community intent does not appear to be for this page to have such a narrow scope; the fact that non-Waffen-SS material was removed for lack of sourcing does not mean at all that sourced material on broader WWII re-enactment won't be soon enough added, which would just necessitate naming it back again. Someone could probably add something of this sort in less than 5 minutes of online source research. (I take George Carlin's view when it comes to battle re-enactors ("Give 'em live ammo!"), so it won't be me.
Instead, move to World War II re-enactment to match the spelling of that word preferred by most dictionaries.
— SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ< 04:34, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
- Support SMcC Cinderella157 (talk) 07:02, 28 October 2017 (UTC)