User talk:Subversive element

User:Alasdair22

Thanks for your message. I hadn't looked at the user's contribs. I don't think it qualifies as vandalism, but his contributions have certainly been contrary to policy. A.B. left the user a lengthy message on User talk:Alasdair22. Hopefully, the user will read up on policy and make suitable changes. Best wishes, Jakew 09:11, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

I hope that wasn't sarcasm. Mitsos 14:02, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

It wasn't sarcasm. Maybe a tiny bit ironic. Let me explain: One of my best friends I have come to know during my medical studies comes from Crete. When I came to your user page (don't remember over which article precisely) and read your userboxes, I just had to laugh, because many of them would apply to him as well (including fav movies, playing chess, being straight (and emphasizing it), contempt for hip hop (!), etc.). I just felt like dropping a line, because I have been in friendly discussions with that guy for a while now and he has got to be one of the most stubborn persons I know. But I also respect him a lot, especially because all that home-made-Raki-induced talks we had revealed that we do share a great lot of attitude, but first and foremost we recognized how we agree that it's the most important thing to have someone on a par to exchange yourself with (which he had been missing since coming to Germany and I have been missing most of the time here), although it doesn't necessarily include agreeing with each other in every single aspect. So he was glad he found a person in Germany who knows concepts like e.g. αγάπη while I enjoy his diehard Marxist views. You see, to me he is surely a unique character, and when I read your user page, I couldn't help but notice all the similarities and drop a line. -- Now I do have to ask you, though, about that White Nationalist thing (including the David Lane section). You may understand that being German brings with it a certain burden of the past. Maybe a Greek person is a whole lot freer in articulating thoughts like these, but I actually do believe in things like mixing of gene pools. After all, traditional (sic!) mass rapes during wartimes always produced bastard children who could draw on a far greater (and healthier) diversity of genes. On the other hand, cultures where inbreeding is common (such as parts of the Muslim world, in fact), tend to produce a degenerate gene pool. That same degeneration will most definitely apply in every sufficiently small inbreeding biological system, including the Caucasian race. So my question is to whether yours is more of a (totally valid, I might add) cultural attitude or in fact a genetic racial attitude (which I could not approve of esp. from a strictly Medical perspective). I'd be happy for a reply, because, as my friend taught me: Diverse discussion is always fruitful if you just make that into a fact by believing it. Subversive element 11:17, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

As David Lane said, noone can be 100% White. Mine attitude is a more a cultural one, but also a genetic racial one. I mean, someone who is black cannot be considered Greek. I cannot understand why to you, I look similar to that cretan guy (btw all the cretans are crazy), since he has got "diehard Marxist views" while I 'm a fascist. About that other thing you said, ("You may understand that being German brings with it a certain burden of the past.") remember what Udo Voigt said:Germany must honorably take her place among the world's nations as an equal partner and must no longer tolerate the blackmail methods used by her enemies because of 'the past'. You must not feel guilty anymore. Always happy to discuss with you.Mitsos 13:02, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply! I'm going to put some structure into my answer:

• A white Greek person who denounces Greece, according to David Lane, cannot be regarded Greek, either. And I'm almost sure that Orthodox Jews would have a hard time accepting a black converted person as an equally genuine Jew. Ethnicity always carries with it a kind of systemic fascism: You feel as part of a group, and you want to promote and further construct that group and its perceived properties (whiteness, non-blackness, etc). Everything Greek was created by the white, or let's say genuine Greek people. But that applies to the past more than to the future, that's for certain. Just like gender-(stereo)typical behaviour is not locked with the biological sex of a person like it used to be. Which does not at all say that I welcome these developments, I just think that it's important to account for undeniable facts like those for the sake of effective communication. In other words: Everything's a compromise, but there are better and worse compromises. Denial motivated by disapproval won't help either way, that's why I could never be part of any religious group and in fact find it at times difficult to be German/Caucasian European and a male, because it puts me into a perspective I did not choose myself.
• Well, I don't feel guilty and the shape of public opinion forming in Germany annoys me and many other people as well because it lacks in humor and therefore, pseudo-paradoxically, reminds me of the Third Reich.
• You look similar to me because of everything except your respective political attitudes. Maybe Greeks tend to have more radical political views than do people in Germany nowadays. And that, in turn, marks a similarity between the two of you. Carrying a big bright flag is a quality of a higher order than the color of the flag (red in his case, white in yours). I, for my part, do not like carrying big bright flags at all, though from time to time I catch myself at it, usually carrying the anti-colored flag (black, in your case) so as to neutralize the whole thing as far as possible.

Ok, 'nuff for now. Looking forward to your reply, Subversive element 13:49, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Althought I cannot see about what you are asking me to reply, I 'll say something because I like discussing with you. You said:"find it at times difficult to be German/Caucasian European and a male, because it puts me into a perspective I did not choose myself." Well, if you weren't German/Caucasian European and a male, it wouldn't have been you, simply because you wouldn't have the same DNA. I agree with everything else you said. Also, an article that you might be interested in is Allied war crimes during World War II. Some users are removing the parts that talk about the atomic bombings and the bombings of German cities, because as they say these weren't war crimes!! Mitsos 14:49, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I saw Allied warcrimes on your contrib list and read through part of the talk page. On Talk:Anti-German_sentiment#Is_this_a_Joke.3F, I am already engaged in a little discussion with that White Guard guy, so I'm going to keep out of the Allied warcrimes article talk for now (but between the two of us: I think you're right all along).

About the other thing: Yes, it wouldn't have been me. Big But: Any fact in itself is not a compelling reason for embracing it. Just because something is as it is does not necessarily mean I have to like it. Quite to the contrary, I think: Being a male (or white, or German, or straight, or 190 cm tall), for example, makes me wonder (from time to time, that is) how it affects my character. How would I be different if I were a woman (or less tall, or gay, or black, etc.)? You see, just because I have male genitals and I am a straight guy does not forbid me to conduct thought experiments in which I empathize with other people by deconstructing my own predefined set of circumstances. I try to overcome (as far as possible) the effects my sociocultural and genetical frame has on my character/ideology in order to better understand it and to make more conscious decisions, less instinctive ones. The attitudes or moments that are still left after this deconstruction, I consider to be somewhat more genuine. For example, when I look into a beautful womans face, I feel much closer to myself than I could ever do in trying to identify myself as German. So I *am* in fact more heterosexual than I am a Caucasian German, as I can imagine having black skin / coming from, say, Greece with far greater ease than I can imagine being homosexual, for example. Therefore, the "German flag", as well as the "Caucasian flag" is obviously not as close to me as many other things (among those, the "Hetero flag"). I can, for example, relate a lot more to a black person than to a white person if that black person is, let's say, funny and intelligent while that white guy is a violent humorless Neonazi (and we do have those guys in Germany). Subversive element 15:41, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

We hane got "Neonazis" in Greece too (like me) some are violent, but I cannot say I 've met someone completely humorless. If you want to be satisfied with your life, you must feel OK about being a German (in fact you must be proud of it). Even if you come from the worst place on earth, you must be proud of it. Even I have non-white friends (well, in fact not non-white, I 've got Albanian friends, you know you 've got a problem with Albanian immigrants in Greece). Mitsos 18:45, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, Neonazi is clearly the wrong term for what I meant, as I understand it primarily signifies a political attitude. In Germany, for PC reasons people with such an attitude are deliberately (and maliciously) being mixed up with people who just like to destroy things or beat other people up, although latter ones do not all claim themselves to be Neonazis - many of them claim to be leftists (both of which claims are audacious, because those people are simply vandals). So strike the word Neonazi, insert "violent person". btw: unfortunately, speaking from my personal experience, Germany has a near total lack of intelligent Neonazis who are open to discussion. Then again, many Germans have a serious problem with humor. I remember working on a dead body in med school with others, *trying* to tell a joke that is positively non-political and not condescending on black people, but the second word is "Neger" and that's as far as I came. But the joke is quite good. I also remember riding on a train with a German named Carsten Lorenz (somehow I still know that name), who was standing 2 meters tall, blond, blue-eyed and wearing a Thor's Hammer on a chain around his neck. He told me he was a Neonazi, and working for the Federal Police. I tried to get him into a talk and all went well, until I became bored (he said stupid things, like "I would never talk to a nigger" and "They are all the same") and sprung the trap, lying to him how glad I was that obviously, friendly and peaceful conversation was possible between him and a "gay Jewish leftist like me". I was proud of myself in that moment. Gay Jewish leftist for lol - he actually bought it and was clearly uncomfortable from that moment on.

About being proud: Maybe that's something we can just not agree on, for IMO "pride" is not applicable to anything given like race or nationality. I am proud when I feel I have tried harder than before, when I have the feeling (or feedback) I improved myself. But I think even that kind of pride needs to be taken carefully; radical constructivist Ernst von Glasersfeld at one point employs a good metaphor for this, which goes roughly like "whenever someone thinks he has achieved a sort of final wisdom, he is committing the same mistake as a car driver who mistakes the place where he ran out of gas for the end of the road". So I am being proud sometimes of some things, but I try not to exaggerate it, either. Other than that I feel totally satisfied (apart from all the war and hunger and injustice in the world :-) and perfectly fine with regard to being German. In fact I'm very proud of it! I feel that life's a game, you sometimes win or lose / And though I may be down right now, at least I don't work for Jews. Which reminds me of another joke, a Jewish friend's dad once told me, commenting on PC-fanatism on post-WWII Germany, and I want to conclude with that (my god, I'm writing way too much): What is the high point of anti-fascism? -- Try to figure it out until next time. Subversive element 21:28, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

He he, that was a good one. What do you mean by "PC" (like "PC-fanatism")? "Then again, many Germans have a serious problem with humor." I do believe that. Greek people view Nordic people as completely humorless. About something else you said, ("Just because something is as it is does not necessarily mean I have to like it. Quite to the contrary, I think: Being a male (or white, or German, or straight, or 190 cm tall), for example, makes me wonder (from time to time, that is) how it affects my character. How would I be different if I were a woman (or less tall, or gay, or black, etc.)? You see, just because I have male genitals and I am a straight guy does not forbid me to conduct thought experiments in which I empathize with other people by deconstructing my own predefined set of circumstances. I try to overcome (as far as possible) the effects my sociocultural and genetical frame has on my character/ideology in order to better understand it and to make more conscious decisions, less instinctive ones.") well I don't think you are right. According to the nazi theory, we must accept everything as it is. The world isn't a paradise. The world is unfair, and we must face up to it and try to live a better life in this world, by doing the best for our nation. A small description of National Socialism could be the enforcement of the laws of nature in the human society. Please write something in the talk of Allied war crimes, there are 4 of them against me there. Mitsos 09:27, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

The second punch line of that joke goes: "That's when Jews are made out of soap." This being told to me by a Jew who had lost his family in the Holocaust. If all people were open minded like him, this world would be a lot better off. / War crimes: I don't really know what to say there. It's one of that hazardous topics where anyone can ward off facts by claiming wrong use or lack of sources, or OR by interpretation. Again: I think you are right, but I've seen those conflicts, and people like those who stand against you there, hardly ever let themselves be persuaded/proved wrong. But I'm following the debate, and as soon as I see a new and valid point I can provide, I'm going in, promise. Subversive element 12:40, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

PC=political correctness, which dictates, in its German extreme, e.g. that mentally handicapped people have to be called differently gifted (andersbegabt). Fun stuff, if you are a relaxed person... Subversive element 18:55, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

You are talking about social Darwinism, selfishness of races and nations and so on. Hmmm, I recommend you to read about Tit for tat and/or Richard Dawkins' The Selfish Gene (one of the most ill-interpreted book titles in history). There is diverse proof for symbiotic, non-exploitative relationships and survival strategies in nature. Human society is in itself, I believe, proof for this. If we hadn't risen above that raw competitive state of flora and fauna, we would never have had language and economy and the whole thing. On the other hand, Western civilization (of which I am a tragically hip part, of course), have been exploiting the third world for centuries now, and it can't get much more extreme than this. For my part, I am waiting for peak oil, when the entire idea of capitalism starts to collapse all around us. Maybe that will finally afford the chance of some true change. Subversive element 19:53, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

I hate political correctness. As we say it is something Invented by Jews, believed by Whites, ignored by muds. Mitsos 08:49, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

"If we hadn't risen above that raw competitive state of flora and fauna, we would never have had language and economy and the whole thing." That's completely wrong. The reason for the advancement of civilization is the competition between the nations. The fact that the Western civilization was exploiting the third world for centuries, is a proof of social Darwinism and White Supremacy. As Whites, we must be proud of that. Mitsos 12:34, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Probably true, but again, although I am obviously profiting from this, being one of the happy few, I just can't help but feel for all the victims. Children are starving and killing each other with AK-47s as we do this conversation. It just happened the way it did and I am lucky (rather than proud) to be born into this privileged position. I remember a joke postcard, that had painted on it two boxes full of biddies (young chickens). The price tag on the first said "Cute cuddly biddies, 1 Euro/piece", the other one said "Shark fodder, 1 Euro/piece". The tagline beneath read "It only mattered to sit in the right box." This sums up my attitude quite well. -- But despite the obvious difference in our positions I assure you once again that I can relate to your view as well, after all both our positions are quite typical and negotiable within the Western (or white) spectrum. Subversive element 21:22, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Something new, for a change: How comes that a self-proclaimed Neonazi can enjoy a movie made by Jews? Isn't that self-contradictory? Subversive 10:34, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

The Big Lebowski has nothing to do with politics. It's just funny. Again, if you were born in Africa, it wouldn't have been you, you wouldn't have the same DNA. About the children who are starving, yes it's sad, but that's how it will always be. A friend from South Africa (there are many Greeks in S. Africa), was telling me that, black people never think that if they plant their field, they are going to have plenty of food to eat the next season. Instead, they think like that: "I 'm gonna take the gun and steal money and buy some food". Another Greek from South Africa once told me that the country was better under Apartheid, and that now they are afraid to walk in the streets alone. Mitsos 11:07, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Mitsos, I need to hear a second opinion. Do you think anyone could reasonably identify me as a white supremacist from what I wrote above? Or on Talk:Allied_war_crimes_during_World_War_II#POV_tag? Or on your talk page? -- What's with this guy? - He's Knox Harrington, the video artist. Subversive 08:39, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

No, of course not. Mitsos 08:46, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

I agree. You see, I'm really trying to put myself into his perspective but I fail in seeing any hint as to me being WS. Actually, I gave strong opposition on your every opinion and I am positively surprised you went with it. Thanks for your opinion. You may want to read his talk page, if you're interested in this. I told you so, didn't I? Subversive 08:52, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Sub, I have read your exchange with Haber on the accusation of 'White Supremacist', a suggestion which has obviously wounded you deeply, for quite understandable reasons. I personally have no reason to suppose that you are anything but a reasonable and intelligent human being, judging by the quality of our exchanges on the Anti-German sentiment page. However, I think it is only fair to tell you that you have become suspect by association, if that is the right expression. Look again at some of the things being put forward in the above, all of which you have allowed to pass without serious challenge. I personally would have no interest in engaging in any way with this Greek Nazi, but it's obviously up to you make your own friendships and associations. However, can you not see just how disgusting some of his contentions are? This is not a question of political correctness. Nazism is not a set of ideas: it's an obscenity. I do not for a moment think you are a Nazi-but you have in a sense been morally and intellectually compromised. You say you are not a White Supremacist? The Greek thrust this suggestion at you and you seem to have entered into a tacit consensus with him on this very point. White Guard 22:56, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

First off, thank you for commenting, I really appreciate it. As you have read, I didn't withhold my own opinion and therefore I don't feel compromised. When I stopped by his user page and started this conversation, I became curious, as I wrote, because from the opinions (hiphop) and favourites (Big Lebowski etc), he reminded me in several ways of a dear friend, who is also Greek (and surely has a likewise strong political attitude, albeit to the "other side"). With that crazy Cretan (not Mitsos) I have had long and good talks, trying to ignore (at best being amused by) his recurring political rants. I just like "those Greeks" (both of them), they have (considering their political flag-bearing) something refreshingly dedicated and maybe a bit naive to them. Other than that, neither of them ever attacked me or told me to "go to hell". And talking never hurt anyone. At least, that's the way I like to see it. -- Anyway, thanks again for giving your opinion, you're always welcome here. Subversive 23:22, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

To White Guard: Subversive element is much more open-minded than you. You are too politically correct to engage in any way with a "Greek Nazi". Mitsos 08:39, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

"My Homer is not a communist. He may be a liar, a pig, an idiot, a communist, but he is not a porn star!" -- Calm down, there's no need for accusations either way. What I think WhiteGuard meant, was that there is, in his opinion, an upper limit to open-mindedness. And I agree, although it's not a new point to me. You (both) see, in Germany, we are commonly treating confessing Nazis like leprous people. And I think that is also wrong, because I believe in divide et impera. I do not believe in symbols, and I hate hidden agenda, but talking open-minded (even if it includes proclaimation of a mind-set or principle) is not a symbol nor hidden, it's an act, an implicit axiom of sincerity. That's my own private thin red line of division. After all, WhiteGuard is open minded and shares his opinion and I categorically prefer that over hidden agenda. Simply put, I'm assuming good faith in both of you. Subversive 10:12, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Thank you, Sub, for that positive affirmation. I, too, hate-have always hated-'political correctness'. But this, for me at least, is a question that goes beyond such notions. My grandfather served with the British army in northern Germany in 1945, and was one of the first to enter the camp at Belsen. Till the day he died the one thing he could never put out of mind was the smell. I have left a message for 'the Greek' (I'm sorry; I can't even bring myself to use his 'name') on his talk page. The rest is silence. White Guard 01:53, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Oops. You do feel strongly about it. Suppose I have to accept that. Doesn't change the fact though that even Nazis are a diverse group and that prejudice is in fact one common trait of Nazis. You know, the real nasty humorless ones, not those fair weather Nazis who can enjoy an intelligent Jewish movie after long hours of minority-bashing. What else can I say? At one point, I had two good friends, one of them from Gabon (that's in Africa) (he's black), the other one a German Nazi who was engaged in so many Nazi organisations, they didn't let him into the Bundeswehr. Those two got along very well, because they are both nice and decent people. On the other hand, that Gabon-guy had kind of a twisted humor. He usually came in greeting with a raised arm. In retaliation for this symbol-theft (think of gay people calling each other gay), the other guy didn't refrain from using the N-word. Then the other one used the other N-word. And so on. Sometimes I almost mix them up, before remembering, one was black, one was white. It's so easy to see the difference! -- If I can offend any other advice, please let me know. -- Subversive 03:13, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

The German Antifa... These people make me sick. Mitsos 07:47, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

A video that shows the collaboration between the Antifa and the German police. 5 German comrades versus 100 antifas and the armed police. Mitsos 08:40, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Show this to your friend from crete. Mitsos 09:02, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Response

What do you want from me? Jayjg ^(talk) 01:05, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

What I explained on your talk page. See, I just hate that I am evading an existing ban with this account. My behaviour (and with it, the behaviour of user:Tit for tat) has improved a lot, I dare say: I am not editing as an IP anymore, and I sincerely apologized to Jakew and he accepted it. As I told Centrx, all this was a really untypical wikiepisode for me. I was an IP editor on en.WP for 2 and a half years, mostly just reading articles and correcting minor typos or grammar now and then. So, if you agree to lift that ban on my user:Tit_for_tat, I promise I won't ever use it again. If I do, esp in a malicious way, you can indef block it again anytime. Please understand that it means a lot to me not to edit as a block evader. Subversive element 06:50, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Tit for tat was a userid that was used solely for harassment, and was banned as such. You have a new userid, and it has not been banned. If you use it properly, there will be no reason to ban it. Accept this and move on please. Jayjg ^(talk) 15:01, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Have it your way. But you did permban me at once, without giving me so much as a single warning or a temporary block, which you never explained once. The only harassment I committed was tagging another user with the single purpose account tag, not knowing that this tag was meant for use in certain areas only (it isn't mentioned on its page). It is obviously not enough to say sorry for such a major wikicrime. This makes Wikipedia suck. Subversive element 19:43, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Why not take a closer look at WP:BITE for a change? Subversive element 20:10, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Swastika legal text

“ Absatz 1 gilt nicht, wenn das Propagandamittel oder die Handlung der staatsbürgerlichen Aufklärung, der Abwehr verfassungswidriger Bestrebungen, der Kunst oder der Wissenschaft, der Forschung oder der Lehre, der Berichterstattung über Vorgänge des Zeitgeschehens oder der Geschichte oder ähnlichen Zwecken dient. ”

Also, es geht hier um "das Propagandamittel oder die Handlung" und es dient "der staatsbürgerlichen Aufklärung, der Abwehr.. etc." Es geht _nicht_ um "die Handlung der staatsbürgerlichen Aufklärung".... Ist nicht so besonders klar, aber der Satz gibt sonst keinen Sinn. Grüsse-- ExpImp^talkcon 18:56, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Oh, jetzt hab ich's auch grad kapiert, gute Hervorhebung... naja, Jura is halt doch was ganz anderes. Subversive element 19:48, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

My RfA

Thanks for your comments. I appreciate that there seems to be some weirdness going on. Mainly, though, I just wanted to say thank you for trying to raise support for my campaign, and I'm touched by your confidence in me. Working against entrenched bureaucracy is hard, as you are obviously aware, and your actions are very much appreciated.

Best, -- Earle Martin [^t/_c] 09:18, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

White Supremacist?

Let's understand something here. Demanding "civilized" discourse, while at the same time gaming the system in order to get my account blocked (npa1, npa2), is very contradictory. That you do this on my own talk page, when all you have to do to avoid a personal attack is to unwatch it, is both aggressive and ridiculous.

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Example #1:

Mitsos: I hate political correctness. As we say it is something Invented by Jews, believed by Whites, ignored by muds. Mitsos 08:49, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

"If we hadn't risen above that raw competitive state of flora and fauna, we would never have had language and economy and the whole thing." That's completely wrong. The reason for the advancement of civilization is the competition between the nations. The fact that the Western civilization was exploiting the third world for centuries, is a proof of social Darwinism and White Supremacy. As Whites, we must be proud of that. Mitsos 12:34, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

SE: Probably true, but again, although I am obviously profiting from this, being one of the happy few, I just can't help but feel for all the victims. ...

But despite the obvious difference in our positions I assure you once again that I can relate to your view as well, after all both our positions are quite typical and negotiable within the Western (or white) spectrum.

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Example #2: To Mitsos: I'm posting on sensible people's talk pages all over" ... "There's an actual wikiwar going on and we must not lose sight of who the true enemy is...

---

Note that these examples are just a piece of a much larger pattern of edits and reverts, all with an obvious, but unstated agenda. How can anyone other than a white supremacist "relate" to a position in which most of humanity is dismissed as "Jews and muds". If social Darwinism and White Supremacy are "probably true" then what is there to discuss? Haber 02:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Haber

I have contacted Haber about his comment he made to you on his talk page, and wrote a few notes on the complaint page. In order for him to try and get him to apologise to you, I would appreciate it if you did not comment below the notice I put on his talk page. Hopefully, they will either contact you directly and apolgise. Let me know if you need anything else. Kilo•T 13:29, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Blocked again, permanently

I let you evade your permanent block on the grounds that you would use your time here more productively. Instead you've been campaigning for the adminship of an individual solely because you believe them to be against circumcision, admittedly recruiting even white supremacists for that purpose, on the grounds that "There's an actual wikiwar going on and we must not lose sight of who the true enemy is." Wikipedia is not the place for your political campaigns, and you should not be editing Wikipedia for the purpose of warring with any one. Please feel free to pursue your campaign elsewhere, on various bulletin boards, blogs, or personal websites more conducive to that kind of activity. Jayjg ^(talk) 13:52, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

I have no idea what circumcision has got to do with my RfA! (Referring to the edit you linked to.) Bewildering. -- Earle Martin [^t/_c] 07:59, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't know either, nor do I particularly care. I'm concerned with Subversive element's behavior here, nothing more. Jayjg ^(talk) 14:32, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you care a lot. It has everything to do with your block against me. Look above: the SOLE reason you are giving for your totally inappropriate action (NEVER warned me, NEVER temp.blocked me) is that I have been campaigning for the adminship of an individual solely because blahblah'. That war is going on, but I did not start it. Maybe you did, or one of your dear friends like Robert the Bruce, Nandesuka, Dasondas, Avraham or Jakew. I don't know and I don't care. However, the "means of war" we're talking about here are exclusively limited to taking part in an RfA, for heaven's sake!

Jayjg, in my opinion, your behaviour is not appropriate for an admin. Btw: Why don't you drop by user:Haber's talk page and remind him that, according to Jimbo's word, WP is about informing people, not (as Haber believes) "influencing" them. Really, do it. It's your duty as an admin.

(user:Subversive element) 87.78.158.224 17:36, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

You don't ever answer to anything in a really polite and honest fashion, do you? You only seem to reply when there's the slightest chance of being impolite and manipulative. Just FYI (I love that phrase, ever since I read it in Dasondas friendly post to your talk page): "ArbCom" does not mean "arbitrary and compulsive". 87.78.151.63 02:53, 22 October 2006 (UTC)