User talk:Kautilya3

A radical COVID thought

For talk page stalkers, here is a radical thought. It is becoming clear that recovery from COVID for under-65s can be essentially taken for granted (unless they have other risk factors), whereas for over-65s it can be deadly. So the thing to do seems to be isolate the over-65s from under-65s. The under-65s need to mingle so that they develop herd immunity and become able to break the chains of transmission, while the over-65s need to stay away from them until a vaccine becomes available. Viewed from this angle, the lockdowns in Italy and India seem to be headed in the wrong direction. When the lockdowns are lifted, the same situation will recur. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 11:14, 24 March 2020 (UTC)

You are not invincible... WHO said something like that to youngsters. And this line you wrote "The under-65s need to mingle so that they develop herd immunity and become able to break the chains of transmission, while the over-65s need to stay away from them until a vaccine becomes available." The Wikipedia page for Herd immunity is interesting - it has a "Cost–benefit analysis" and lines like "Since the adoption of mass and ring vaccination, complexities and challenges to herd immunity have arisen." (Please don't think I know what I am talking about) Cost benefit analysis for humans always sounds dystopian no matter which way you look at it. DTM (talk) 14:32, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Although you meant it from a health perspective, the Bajaj MD said the something similar yesterday "We should have kept only the vulnerable at home, closed all public spaces, and allowed the young and healthy to keep turning wheels of the economy". (ET) DTM (talk) 08:20, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Yeah, it seems to be common knowledge among the educated middle classes now, and they are taking precautions. The poor won't know, and they also won't have the means to isolate the older people. But, at the same time, Indians accept the march of fate a lot more readily. Losing the older people to the mahamaari seems like just what the fate orders. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 08:42, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

• The WHO's talk of "eradicating COVID" seems dangerously misguided. We have seen how fast the COVID virus can jump and spread. It is nothing like "small pox" and "polio". -- Kautilya3 (talk) 11:32, 24 March 2020 (UTC)

Sad to see people being ostracised for exposure to COVID.[1] Even worse to see COVID being regarded as a 'dirty' disease.[2]

The fact is that COVID is a form of cold/flu with an added complication of attack on the respiratory system. The mortality rate is somewhere between 0.5–1.0%, but it is a lot higher for the people around 65 year old or higher. While we don't have detailed statistics, I would venture to say that the mortality rate might be something like 10% for people over 65, and something like 0.01% 0.1% for people under 65. Plenty of younger people that get COVID don't even know that they got it. Here is a very informative tutorial:

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOJqHPfG7pA

If you get COVID and recover (with or without knowing), you can be proud of it. You will be part of the the valuable 'COVID fighting force' that will block the chains of transmission. Next time you get the virus, you will kill it without passing it on. Be proud. Be proud. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:07, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Technically then, we are already in the list of quite a few fighting forces. DTM (talk) 14:33, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Indeed, we are. (It has been a bit of learning curve for me to understand all these diseases over the last week or two.) Even normal flu has a mortality rate, which is not particularly different from the mortality rate of COVID for under-65s. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 17:13, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

A sobering read here. Has great links to other information too:

• Jacob Puliyel, Coronavirus Pandemic: Is It Time to Wind Down the Rhetoric?, The Wire, 26 March 2020.

-- Kautilya3 (talk) 10:15, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

Yes, talk of this is spreading. The cure being worse than the disease. Reminds me of the term "Pyrrhic victory":

Pyrrhic victory is a victory that inflicts such a devastating toll on the victor that it is tantamount to defeat. Someone who wins a Pyrrhic victory has also taken a heavy toll that negates any true sense of achievement or damages long-term progress.

DTM (talk) 05:23, 29 March 2020 (UTC)

Finally. Some sense circulating again. John Oliver back with his third covid video. And to even think that the economists were swaying us. WP:Signpost has come out with some really good articles on covid.DTM (talk) 17:11, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

What you are ignoring is that about 20% get very sick. If the disease is allowed to go unchecked, hospitals will be overwhelmed (as they already are) and a lot of people who could have survived will die. Your 0.1% for under-60s assumes that the very sick under 60s will get adequate medical care and that won't happen if they are all getting sick at the same time. Without testing and without managing the cases, the effects are devastating and you cannot have functioning economies where 6% of the work force (20% of very sick cases assuming that 30% of the population is infected) is either very sick or dying. With testing and judicious quarantining of infected people, the 6% can be spread out over time without serious economic damage and without overwhelming the health care system. Shock therapy to get herd immunity is nice in theory, and would have worked in medieval times, but it is not an appropriate strategy in our more modern world. --regentspark (comment) 17:24, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

Hi RP, the percent that get very sick is not 20%. It is being estimated at around 3-4%[3], but I believe it is an overestimate. For example, in the US, the recovery rate is only 50-60%, i.e., roughly half of the seriously sick are dying, despite the world-class medical treatment they get there. So, I think the percent that get very sick could be no more than 2%. See this summary for scientific statistics, rather than the off-the-cuff statistics made up by journalists.

You make the valid point that even 0.1% under-60s getting very sick will overwhelm the health care system. At the moment, that is still going to happen in India according to CDDEP predictions (a peak of 1 million hospitalisations) [4]. But, isolating over-65s will reduce the burden. At the moment, that is not on anybody's consciousness. The general feeling in India is that everybody that gets COVID is going to die. Even if you tell them that the fatality rate is 0.1%, which is the same as that of seasonal flu, they still have no comprehension of what that means. So, strategies are being made based on misinformation and paranoia.

Poor Laxminarayan who tried to give them scientific information was hounded out, getting branded as a scare-mongerer. Indians are not going through a 21-day lockdown in order to reduce the burden on the health care system. They are going through it in the belief that they are going to "eradicate" COVID from India. They have solid confidence that Modi is going to "defeat the Coronavirus". When they realise that it wouldn't happen, they are not going to be happy campers. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 20:17, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

I wonder if Ramanan Laxminarayan could have his own Wikipedia article rather than the redirect it is just now. DTM (talk) 09:32, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Possibly. It all depends on what sources there are and what they say about him. But I think we better wait. He is still a very young researcher. If his predictions for India come out right, of course he will be a star. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 15:23, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Even a smallest star can absorb the largest black hole if it has patience and courage to remain in isolation within the core of black hole. Gradually absorbing all dark energies and emitting the bright or positive energies from the core of same black hole helps the star to emit more bright energies which further increases the radius of the star nucleus. Ultimately the star increases its current speed to travel in space. This can also be referred from the epic of Neelkanth Mahadev--182.182.27.53 (talk) 17:16, 2 April 2020 (UTC)

Can't figure out what this is about

Undocumented Vedic or Pre-Vedic Science? People busy with: 1) Law of conservation of energy i.e. "Energy can neither be created nor destroyed; rather, it can only be transformed or transferred from one form to another." 2) E = mc2 Why not documented? 1) Cause and Effect (required updates in Megh Malhar) 2) Cause and Effect (required updates in Satish Acharya) April Fools Day? --182.182.123.180 (talk) 04:22, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Hotspot

This article may be of interest to you: 2020 Tablighi Jamaat coronavirus hotspot in Pakistan.VR _talk 05:16, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

There are bigger problems in the world than the reputation of Tablighi Jamaat. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 11:43, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Name Change of the article "Persecution of Chinese Indians"

Hello Mr Kautilya,

I believe the article Persecution of Chinese Indians completely violates WP:NOPV. I'm writing this to you after seeing some of your Indian History related edits. Can you please provide your view on the discussion Talk:Persecution of Chinese Indians? I think the name should be Internment of Chinese-Indians, similar to what mentioned in Internment of Japanese Americans, an incident happened during WWII. Also, I'll really appreciate, if you can help me find people working on Indian history to clean-up many such articles.--Methu1 (talk) 14:24, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Hi Methu1, thanks for telling me about this page. I have watch-listed it and will be happy to participate in any discussions there. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 15:24, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Kautilya.--Methu1 (talk) 01:26, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Your message on my previous moving ip's Talk-page

Hello. I am posting here as my IP has changed since last time (when it was 117.194.239.82 where you left a message regarding "muslim conquests in....".

I would like to know if you have personally confirmed that the reference provided does indeed support the exact statement that was put up there (deviousness is a quality amply given unto those we are dealing with here and I am sure you are aware too).

This map on WIKI itself - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalji_dynasty#/media/File:Delhi_Sultanate_under_Khalji_dynasty_-_based_on_A_Historical_Atlas_of_South_Asia.svg - very clearly illustrates that khilji/kafur took a one-time tribute (as in a one-time raid) in some places in South India. Those parts are in light-green and shown as "tributaries" (that too one-time). They never controlled (dark-green) ANY of South India or Northeast India or also Orissa and its adjoining parts. Though its obvious this map is on this page - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalji_dynasty.

As an aside....and I hope this does not more you....This "we ruled India for XX years" grunt - which is an utterly puke-inducing repugnant lie - is getting too far. FACT is the Far-South (Kerala/Tamilnadu/Tulunadu/Coorg and adjoining parts further North) and Northeast India were NEVER under muslim rule. Yes there were minor disruptions or scares like in the early-1300s and mid-1300s or the mid-1700s and late-1700s but they barely lasted a generation and even in that period those were raids rather than controlled rule like Ashoka the Great ruled most of South Asia from the Iran border to Myanmar or Akbar's rule over North India. Its this lie and the following propaganda that should not be allowed on WIKI that brought me to make that edit which however I believe to be correct. They may take pride in breaking centuries/millenia old temples in North India while conveniently eschewing that the Hindu Kings (who seamlessly moved between Hinduism and Jainism and Buddhism for millennia) of the Far-South built mosques and dargahs for their muslim subjects. Whether it was the Kodungalloor Mosque in Thrissur District in Kerala built by the then Hindu Cheras in 600s ACE or the Nagore Dargah in Nagapattinam District in Tamilnadu built by a local king there in the 1600s ACE. Several other lesser-known places of worship were consecrated by the non-muslim lords for their muslim subjects over centuries. In fact that there is far greater communal amity, far fewer terrorists, and far lesser fanaticism in these two regions (The Far-South and the NE) has to do with the fact that throughout benevolent and charitable people ruled there. Unlike as in post-1000 ACE Delhi and large swathes of North India/pak/bangladesh where bar a few like Akbar or Sher Shah we know what ilk many of them were of. Not meaning to demean anybody on the basis of region or "group". Just saying it the way it is (or at least I read the facts that way). Regardless of whether you agree or not (and allow my edit to stay or otherwise I shall not make any more edits on this page.```` — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.194.239.230 (talk) 15:58, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

You are presumably talking about your edits to the Muslim conquests in the Indian subcontinent page. Most of the content on that page is reliably sourced. If you disagree with anything there, you need to raise an issue on the article's talk page and achieve WP:CONSENSUS before you make edits.

Please note that WP:Wikipedia is not a reliable source. You cannot use it as citation for edits. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 17:16, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

List of Hospital Beds by country

Hi, I reverted your last edit that reverted my previous edit. I added a comment, and explained: According to reference document, Turkey had 38098 ICU beds in 2018, and a population of 80.8 million. This makes 47.1 beds/100K (not 29). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.70.132.196 (talk) 23:42, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Need a proper live citation

It seems that with your recent edit to Tablighi jamaat ,there is no such live citation so reverting,if I have made a mistake welcome you to discuss on my talk page Anatomycbmcb (talk) 00:44, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

Hi Anatomycbmcb, there was a technical error with the citation, which I have now fixed. Still, when it is long-standing content, the normal practice is to tag it with {{failed verification}} rather than to delete the content. You should delete it only if you are confident that no reliable sources for the claim exist. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 08:12, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

The citation that you have mentioned did not support the contents which is present there ,there is no mention of the given lines ,in the citation,so reverting Anatomycbmcb (talk) 13:48, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

i not understand

you msg on my talk page what do you mean I don't understand Royal711 (talk) 08:09, 11 April 2020 (UTC)

Replied on your talk page. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 08:18, 11 April 2020 (UTC)

The Wire (India)

For the edit I had made on The Wire, Tweet was a reliable source. What is the basis to discredit it? It was from the official account of Hoshiarpur Police.

I've posted a discussion topic on the Talk page of the article. Pls share your thoughts there

-- — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bmmanjesh (talk • contribs) 17:01, 13 April 2020 (UTC)

The first sentence of WP:RS, to which I have referred you multiple times, says that Wikipedia is based on reliable, published sources.

Tweets are not "published". And nothing says that the police are "reliable". -- Kautilya3 (talk) 10:52, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

Why are you deleting the tablighi page

Hey Surpalsingh (talk) 10:07, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

It was deleted under an WP:AfD. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 10:49, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

Section on Myths about Hinduism has been deleted

The edit on hinduism had several references to reliable sources from history books, journal, other wikipedia pages. I am not sure why the entire content has been deleted? -- — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jaykul72 (talk • contribs)

Even though you cite some reliable sources, there is not much correlation between what they say and your text. For example, you says "the four qualities are misinterpreted" and cite this BBC article. Where does the BBC say anything was "misinterpreted"?

You are essentially writing your own opinions on Wikipedia. But it is not Wikipedia's purpose to give you an opportunity to publish your personal views. Please read carefully the policies of Wikipedia given on your talk page. Cheers, Kautilya3 (talk) 08:10, 16 April 2020 (UTC)

Sino-Indian War 1962

Hi, I'm not sure why you have taken offence at my edits or insisted that they are an attempt to paraphrase a historians words.

As I stated on the other thread, the hunt for the Dalai Lama DID prompt increased Chinese military aggression in Tibet and the border regions of Ladakh. That is what is written in the book and is backed up by these three independent sources: https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2011/apr/01/archive-dalai-lama-flees-to-india-1959, , https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/60-years-ago-dalai-lama-escaped-china-ruled-tibet-all-you-need-to-know-2008670, http://content.time.com/time/subscriber/article/0,33009,864579-1,00.html. All I said was that China resumed military patrols in April 1962 after India refused to agree to their terms- that is a fact.

Furthermore, here is another source verifying that the Chinese signalled their intent to start forward patrols in Ladakh in April 1962 on p104: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=_bjADwAAQBAJ&pg=PA103&lpg=PA103&dq=chinese+army+patrols+ladakh+april+1962&source=bl&ots=bPra_eME2D&sig=ACfU3U2xT4FzI_tR1n3ozKt6mjMXjH7Y0g&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi3p-GG3PDoAhVmTRUIHVejA9UQ6AEwCnoECA4QKQ#v=onepage&q=chinese%20army%20patrols%20ladakh%20april%201962&f=false. Considering these extensive sources, what is your reasoning for your incomplete editing and assertions that I am attempting to include my own opinions, when I am clearly not? -- — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kip1234 (talk • contribs)

I haven't taken "offence", but I am certainly getting irritated that you are not getting the point. WP:SYNTHESIS tells you that you cannot draw conclusions of your own from the published sources. You cannot even hint at them. Period. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 09:03, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

I'm looking at it.

Hey there, I'm aware of what's happening at Andhra Pradesh Medtech Zone Limited and I find it very questionable, especially with that SPA that popped up to restore the content. I've asked Berean Hunter to look into matters as well, since I smell sock/meat editing. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 15:50, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

Hi Cyphoidbomb, I am not involved at that page. But I have watch-listed it now, and will see if I can help. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 15:54, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

Thank you kindly! Cyphoidbomb (talk) 16:40, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

Exodus of Kashmiri Pandits

Please reply on the talk page of that article. Looks like you are running away from the facts, so that's why you ain't replying.. Bhattakeel9 (talk) 08:40, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Responded. Let me reiterate that, if I see any further disruption from you on that page, I will be reporting you. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 09:29, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Urdu

Hello, The statements you made on Urdu article were reverted by Gotitbro, please return that edits, i don't made that statements. you and Anupam made that edits, Gotitbro says that edits are like sock.ok it would be like sock, but i only requested to correct it, i don't made edits. -- ImMuslimandimnotaterrorist (talk) 13:30, 21 April 2020 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
	Dear Kautilya3, For your tireless contribution to Nizamuddin Markaz Mosque and 2020 Tablighi Jamaat coronavirus hotspot in Delhi, you deserve this barnstar. Best. Aaqib Anjum Aafī (talk) 08:26, 22 April 2020 (UTC)

Thank you Aaqib Anjum. That is very kind of you. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 08:48, 22 April 2020 (UTC)

Kasim Razvi

Hi there I have made one change regarding calling the situation "police action" to military intervention as its widely regarded an annexation and Police action was just a cover for the military invasion is it okay? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7F:3662:DD00:B597:7C53:697B:B4EB (talk) 08:00, 23 April 2020 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
	Dear Kautilya3, For your tireless contribution to so many articles, you deserve this barnstar.Souniel Yadav (talk) 03:59, 25 April 2020 (UTC)