Talk:Glans penis

Introduction

Why on earth does the article about the glans penis begin with a definition of the "glans penis covered by foreskin and uncovered."(in bold) It sounds quite awkward and unneccesary to make this clarification which seems self-evident anyway as the very first phrase of the article. Of course the glans is the glans, covered or uncovered by foreskin.71.224.118.11 12:36, 2 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Circumcision status

The statement about men who have been circumcised is technically inaccurate. A restored foreskin can indeed cover the glans penis. DanP 00:55, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Inappropriate Reverts

Jakew: your reverts are inappropriate. You have not provided a reason for reverting the additional of relevant factual material about the glans penis.

Robert Blair 00:34, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Meatal problems

The "longitudinal study" which is the (1988) New Zealand study by Fergusson et al., is silent about meatitis, meatal ulceration, and meatal stenosis. It may not be used to support a claim of a higher incidence of meatitis, meatal ulceration, and meatal stenosis in intact boys. See:

http://www.cirp.org/library/complications/fergusson/

Robert Blair 13:14, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

"Penile inflammation included balanitis, meatitis, inflammation of the prepuce, and conditions in which the penis was described as sore or inflammed without any further diagnostic elaboration; (2) the number of episodes of phimosis experienced by the child." ... Penile inflammation by 8 yrs: circumcised = 7.6 (11), uncircumcised=14.4 (62) http://www.circs.org/library/fergusson/ - Jakew 17:56, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

To be more precise, one cannot tell from the article whether the reported inflammation was balanitis, posthitis, balanoposthitis, meatitis, or some other condition. One cannot say with certainty that the uncircumcised boys had any meatitis at all.

The use of the Fergusson article to support such a claim will not stand up.

Robert Blair 01:28, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

This is an inappropriate forum in which to promote circumcision. The foreskin does affect the glans penis, so a discussion of the effect of the foreskin on the glans penis is appropriate.

Robert Blair 04:34, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I agree that this is not an appropriate forum for advocating - or opposing - circumcision. It is also an inappropriate forum for a medical analysis of circumcision, but you obviously insist upon it, so I have added some more information. - Jakew 12:17, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

It should be obvious that without the protection of the foreskin that circumcised boys have a high risk of meatal stenosis (narrowing of the urethra). This is why doctors tell parents to change the diapers of their infants every hour to prevent the meatal area from coming into contact with urea.

POV pushing

Robert Blair, why do you insist on pushing your POV in this article?

As I have mentioned previously, it is really not appropriate to turn this article into a miniature version of medical analysis of circumcision, but you seem to insist upon including discussion of the proposed effects of circumcision on meatal problems. I eventually decided, to the detriment of Wikipedia I confess, to let you have it your own way.

I felt that it was inappropriate to include only one "thing that can go wrong with the glans, as related to circumcision", so I included a discussion of the protective effect of circumcision against balanitis. You then felt the need to censor this information, and downplay the risks posed by balanitis. I correct your downplaying (it is often, but not always easily treatable), and add an equivalent (and supported) comment about meatal problems. You censor this. You continue to pretend that Fergusson did not study meatitis (which they demonstrably did).

Don't you understand NPOV? I'm trying to compromise with you here, but you can't have every study opposing circ and none in favour! If you want to include anti-circ stuff about meatitis, then - ok, if you insist - but you can't then turn around and say it's inappropriate to talk about balanitis. It's called balance. - Jakew 23:12, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

POV treats all viewpoints equally and allows all to be presented. Balanitis is discussed elsewhere and there is a link to that place. In any event. It is far from certain that the foreskin causes balanitis. Many believe that the oils and moisturizing agents in the subpreputial moisture help to protect against balanitis.

Meatitis does affect the glans penis and in the absence of a discussion elsewhere it is appropriate to mention it here. It really occurs exclusively in circumcised boys who have lost the protection of the foreskin while they are still in nappies. There really isn't an alternative view on this, because there is no evidence to support that view. Fergusson does not provide the support you would like to have. To use Fergusson is like a drowning man clutching at straw.

This is not an appropriate place to push your circumcision agenda.

207.69.136.199 01:30, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)

You say that balanitis is discussed elsewhere, and that's true, but so are meatal problems (in medical analysis), so that's a lousy argument. It makes absolutely no difference what some people believe, the facts speak for themselves: balanitis is 2 to 5 times as common in males with a foreskin. It is possible, I suppose, that the ingredients in smegma (there are no oils, by the way: Taylor reported that the foreskin contains no sebaceuous glands, so we're really just talking about stale urine, sweat, and dead cells) have a mild protective role that help to reduce the negative influence of the dramatically increased levels of pathogenic bacteria.

Meatitis is not exclusive to circumcised males. It is possible that it may be more common, and I agree that some evidence does indicate that. On the other hand, the fact that it cannot be diagnosed in uncircumcised males makes it difficult to be sure, or to make meaningful comparisons. How many problems go unnoticed in uncircumcised children? How often does a child complain of pain urinating, has a circumcision for suspected phimosis or posthitis, and then the true meatal problem becomes apparent? I'm quite familiar with diagnosing and fixing bugs hiding other bugs in computer software, and physician friends confirm that similar things occur in medicine.

I don't understand how you can dare to accuse me of pushing an agenda here. After all, I'm not the person trying to censor information... - Jakew 12:20, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Image used

Why does the image have to be of a sexually charged erect penis? Wouldn't it be more neutral or appropriate to show the glans penis in its natural un-erect state?--Sonjaaa 04:01, 12 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The lans in its natural, un-erect state wouldn't look very good on a detail photograph. Rather shapeless and wrinkly it would be... --Imator 08:13, 23 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it should show it's wrinkly normal state. Erect is too sexualized and inappropriate.--Sonjaaa 22:38, 6 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Both erect and flacid states should be shown. Add information to wikipedia, not remove. Christopher 03:23, 7 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That is an interesting remark. My gut feeling was "what additional information would that give", but I started thinking about how the glans grows noticeably in the erect state. It would maybe be useful to have both states for this reason. Other than that, I felt a bit confused that the diagram showed an intact foreskin, while the current penis is circumsized. Being an adult man, I of course know the difference in looks, but for underage girls going here, it's maybe a bit weird. I would think an intact penis would be more logical in this case, as the point of the article is not to show the visual effects of circumsition. -- Northgrove 22:38, 3 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe underaged girls shouldn't be looking at penises?.. -unsigned

I find that the image currently being used is not appropriate for the purpose, the purpose of course is to show what the glans penis looks like, yet it has other body parts (leg testicles) in the picture, so I am replacing that picture with a more suitable one. Nikon307 16:53, 28 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that Nikon307's version is probably better... Simply put, a circumcised version can cause confusion with regards to the fact that the glans penis is a mucous membrane and that circumcision, while common, is a cultural rather than natural in nature. 24.173.220.30 03:41, 30 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Wait, if my version was better? why was it replaced with the lower quality photo, which doesn't even have a copyright tag? I'm not going to add it back (in fear of getting in trouble or something) but if someone agrees, please replace it with this one which is in high quality, is uncircumcised (like 90% of the world population), and has a copyright tag. image:Penisfrenulum.jpg Thanks. Nikon307 23:28, 30 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Because no one responded, I'm going to place image:Penisfrenulum.jpg in place of the other image. Respond to this statement if you wish to revert it to the other image, thanks. Nikon307 23:33, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I just don't get: why replace an image when you can simply ADD another one to the article...? Wouldn't it make the article more resourcefull and complete? And FYI, estimates of the proportion of males that are circumcised worldwide vary from one sixth (12.5%) to one third (33.3%). Thank you.lopiadx 05:52, 01 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

While I know what you're trying to say, the reason I removed it was because it lacked a copyright tag, so it had to be put up as a candidate for deletion, and to do so it has to be removed from the article. Same goes for the picture which was just posted, if it doesn't get a tag, it will be deleted in 7 days, so the uploader should probably fix that. I'm not out to remove content from wikipedia, but to contribute to wikipedia. So, if the uploader doesn't fix the problem I'll replace it before the image is deleted and the article is without a picture. Nikon307 05:45, 1 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Very well. Changes made.lopiadx 08:23, 01 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Image:Uncircglans.jpg

I recently removed this image from the page. It showed an erect penis posted by a Wikipedian. My reason for doing so is not that I have an objection to such things being published on the internet as I am not in favour of censorship. However, I think that the image was not instructional or encyclopedic and I would query the motive of people who wish to publish images of their own erect penis on Wikipedia. This is an encyclopedia, not a site for exhibitionism, and should contain information that all people can access freely. I would not want to see a situation where parents feel unable to allow their children access to Wikipedia because they may encounter an inappropriate image. --Vince 20:01, 29 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Diagram

Imator has once removed this diagram and once reduced its size to the point of illegibility, both times saying that it was "off-topic". I don't agree -- the diagram clearly labels the glans penis at the bottom right, and shows it in context. But rather than continuing to argue through edit summaries, I recommend that we discuss the issue here on the talk page. --Arcadian 12:16, 23 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I don't really think that this particular diagram is especially helpful because it has the entire end of the penis labeled as the glans, however a diagram that puts the glans in perspective is most important. Until a better diagram is supplied, the current one needs to stay as it is now. Christopher 02:40, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Scoop/plunger Function

Should it also be noted that the evolutional purpous of the glans penis is theorized to serve as a plunger to remove any others mans semen that may have been there from an earlier sexual encounter the woman may have had as referenced in this article[1]?

That article is bulls*it. The glans is like that because nature made it like that, not because "evolution made it like that to remove other mans semen, and evolution tought it was good". People use "evolution" and "evolded" just like "god" and "god made it like that" Cuzandor 01:17, 5 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Because, you see, the clitoris looks just like a d*ck. Why did "evolution" "evolved" it to that shape for one reason and "evolution" also "evolved" the penis to the very same shape "to remove other man's semen" ? I know why: because it didn't. Cuzandor 01:19, 5 June 2006 (UTC)\[reply]

You may want to look at the article Evolution if that is your basis of argument. Your may find it insightfull. If you dont believe in evolution at all period you may be incorrect. It happens around us all the time[2],[3], scientists are having problems with bacteria, right on key with darwinian selection, evolving and slipping through the cracks of modern antibiotics [4],[5]by becoming resistant to the medicine. What makes you think that complex organisms like us that onced used crude tools, exibited primative instinct as shown in the way we lived, and those of us best suited to live in the unrefined world of the past weren't more geneticaly adept to live in those conditions, and those who where not as adept simply died from failure adapt alowing a situation where those adapted perpertuated only genome charecteristics to live in a given inviroment. Look at the new diseases and problems that arise from living in the modern world. Do you think that people dont die from modern technology that dident exist in the past? Seems to me people that are elvolved to be better drivers, better office workers, less proned to cancer, smarter, more tolerant to the harsh new chemicals of the modern world, and with better mental traits could be more successfull based on the architecture of thier mind would be more likely to succede and survive or perpetuate thier genes and genetic traits to the next generation! Nowdays sexual success is more than crude mechanical sex and more mind based. Some people even go to the extremes to fight against nature for a beliefe which is fine. It wasen't always this way. Just something to think about...M jurrens 21:33, 8 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

You didn't say anything meanful. Cuzandor 04:05, 5 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I mean, anything that is worth the effort of thinking about it. Cuzandor 04:08, 5 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink", especially if his mind is to closed to drink. M jurrens 14:37, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:NOT#Wikipedia_is_not_a_crystal_ball Cuzandor 23:00, 22 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maby I worded this wrong, "Glans Penis as a semen displacement device"

Notable References follow (In the PDF files seach semen displacement)
- [6]
- [7]
- [8]

As you can see I have provided more than enough materials directly relating to the funtion of the glans as a semen displacement device. I knew it was true, I just needed respectable sources, from say Doctors, major universities, ect.M jurrens 21:42, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Systematic reverts from User:CB001

Why do User:CB001 prefer old ugly pictures ? You don't like newer one ? (by Béatrice)

The old photo is better, your photo is ugly. Same thing for the article "Foreskin". CB001 15:13, 9 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Je remarque que le consensus dont vous semblez être le porte-parole (!!!) préfère conserver 4 photographies microscopiques absolument hideuses au lieu d'accepter les photographies du site français.

En plus vous mentez :

L'illustration de "prépuce" (photo que vous contestez) a été introduite le 3 mai 2006 sur le wiki français sans aucune discussion postérieure, en remplacement d'une photo hideuse et sombre :

http://fr.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Pr%C3%A9puce&oldid=7067182

Vous pouvez le constater ici : http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discuter:Pr%C3%A9puce

L'illustration de "gland" (photo que vous contestez) a été introduite le 10 mai 2006 sur le wiki français.

http://fr.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gland_%28anatomie%29&oldid=7192426

Avec aucune discussion :

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discuter:Gland_%28anatomie%29

Les photographies qui ont été acceptées après discussions - certe à couteau tiré - avec une restriction : un bandeau déroulant datent de plus longtemps et portaient sur "pénis" et "érection".

Vous serez aimable de quitter ce ton méprisant et condescendant et par exemple mettre aux voix comme il a été fait sur le wiki français (pour "pénis" et "érection" et non pas pour les photos que vous incriminez) la conservation des photos antérieures ou l'introduction des nouvelles photos. Merci.

Béatrice

Please, don't speak french on this talk page. CB001 16:06, 10 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

comment on images

I have to saythis whole thing is pretty ridiculous. Image:Glans.jpg is not only very artificial-looking, but of much lesser quality (blurry, low-resolution) than Image:GlansPenis.jpg. And even if (and I insist on if) it actually is User:Béatrice's own member, I ask: what difference does that make? The image is better looking in any case. Circeus 14:28, 7 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think the 'anterior/posterior view' photo is better than both of them. Nandesuka 14:38, 7 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Just saw it, and I agree. If the caption is any indication, it was probably the original. Circeus 16:12, 7 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Circumcision controversy

Most of the edits to this article are people going back and forth trying to get the text to reflect "their" view of the topic of circumcision. I believe this is disruptive to the integrity of the article as a whole, and beyond the scope of the article. I believe that discussion of circumcision and which study supports what should be left to the Circumcision article or its offshoots. This article should be left to just a dicussion of the anatomical feature, what it's made of, what it does, etc.

I realize that you can't have a discussion of what it does or what it's for without acknowledging that it's different in circumcised males than in uncircumsised males. However, right now we have more text interpreting the findings of cirumcision studies than in the entire rest of the body of the article.

I propose pulling all circumcision debate out of the article. The only references to the topic should be the fact that the glans penis is uncovered by the foreskin in circumcised males, and covered by the foreskin in uncircumcised (or restored) males. Additionally, a short bit could be left in the anatomical details section pointing out that the characteristics of the glans is different in circumcised vs. uncircumcised males (dry vs. moist, etc.) and directing the reader to Circumcision for further info. That's it. Any further information in the article about "reduced disease this" and "reduced sensitivity that" is at best trying to present sides of a debate that's off topic here anyway, and at worst, a breeding ground for countless edit wars (like we've already seen here). Let's keep the edit war to as few locations as possible. --adavidw 23:42, 31 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Note about slang terminology

The term 'bell end' does not refer to the glans. 'Bell' refers to glans whilst 'bell end' refers to the gathering a skin at the tip which may or may not be present on an uncircumcised penis. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Robin.Anderson (talk • contribs).

I have to disagree with you there. I've never EVER heard anyone refer to the glans as a "bell" (until now). "Bell end" or "bellend" always refers to the glans. Look them up at urbandictionary.com — AnemoneProjectors (zomg!) 23:06, 16 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Pictures of Real Penises

The current layout of the page is very awkward, because the two images of real penises (penisfrenulum.jpg and erectpenis.jpg) are off-setting the main body of the text. Judging from the discussion above, it also seems that such images are deemed somewhat inappropriate by some wikipedians. For these reasons, I would recommend that we move these two images into the Additional Images section. The diagram that is currently at the top is more than enough for the article intro. Once the images are moved, not only would they be less "in-your-face", but the article would benefit from a much more clean-cut layout. What does everyone else think of my suggestion? Please voice your opinion.Homologeo 03:59, 14 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Well, Wikipedia is NOT censored for minors, but I agree that at least the second image should be moved, as it includes much more than it should. This article is about the glans, not about the penis or the testicles. So I do sympathize with you that minors and others might not want a picture of a glans "in there face" yet they should expect a picture of a glans if that's what they type in. Though the typist who is visiting this page should see what they're looking for, they shouldn't see things which are irrelevant because they would obviously have no relevance in the page.Nikon307 21:05, 14 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

My biggest concern was with the layout of the page. I would still recommend that the remaining photo of a real penis be moved to the Additional Images section. The rationale for this is provided above. As for the other image that is now missing, I guess someone decided that it was time for that image to go. I hope no one objects to the removal of that particular image. I, personally, have no qualms about its deletion. So, should the remaining image of a real penis be moved or should it stay in the intro? Please keep in mind, that a clean-cut layout is more conducive of attentive reading on the part of the reader. Homologeo 07:02, 15 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that the page layout requires attention and needs to be more balanced. I recommend that the images be moved to the Additional Images section. The second image shows the scale of the glans in relation to rest of the genitals and are more defined and anatomically more pronounced in this state. As for the picture showing other parts of the genital area, the picture is consistent with the sectioned diagram at the top of the article which shows the whole genital area. BigBoris 20:49, 16 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

DavidShankBone has made this statement on the history of the article about my picture "There really isn't a need for a "lateral view" and many of your 20 edits seem designed to get your penis on Wikipedia - it's also just not a particularly good photo, and huge nest of hair is irrelevan(t)". Sould the picture of my glans be reinstated? Please discuss.... BigBoris 10:58, 14 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I have added a close up side view of Penis Glans to demonstrate the structure in more detail BigBoris 06:31, 25 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Glans sensitivity

The glans is only pressure sensitive just like the homologous structure in females being the pressure sensitive clitoris. Direct rubbing of the pressure sensitive organs results in pain. Nature intended an erogenous sheath of skin that covers the pressure sensitive organ. This skin is the foreskin in males and the clitoral hood in females. During masturbation or intercourse the foreskin rubs across the glans in males and the clitoral hood rubs against the clitoris in females resulting in maximum pleasure. areseepee 9 Aug 2007