Talk:Jiraiya (Naruto)

Death and Part in the story

Was terrible, inconsistent and was not written encyclopedia like, so I deleted it. And we shouldn't call him dead yet, so I deleted it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Idon'twannahaveausername (talk • contribs) 02:24, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

There is no evidence to prove Jiraiya's death. It's unfortunate of course. Unless Kishimoto shows a funeral in the next Naruto's chapter. We cant call him death yet. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ryan darknight (talk • contribs) 11:25, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

There was no funeral for Obito's death, yet anyone who has remained neutral in that whole conspiracy theory knows he's dead. Its sad, but its true, Jiraiya said it, and Pein confirmed it, Jiraiya is dead.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 12:54, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

About Obito. His name shown in the tomb stone, that's an evidence he is death. But, I changed my mind, maybe Jiraiya's is death. I wonder how the plot move on from then? Ryan_Aldren 06:25, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Still hasn't beem shown actualy dead ... 82.117.201.10 (talk) 23:06, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

Well in manga and comics its hard to imagine anyone dead yet, and in Obito's case he could be alive. Wait two more issues, and if he's dead than list him dead. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Idon'twannahaveausername (talk • contribs) 23:50, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

Whats this whole thing about Jiraiya putting down his pen after titiling a book. Was this whole thing just a book he was writing or is this vandalism to the page? I really need to know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.131.6.124 (talk) 20:35, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

It is the way the manga told us that Jiraya has finally finished all that he had to do in life (ie he is dead). Please remember that this is all from the Manga. Outside sources are unnecessary. It is clearly stated in chapter 383 by Pain that Jiraya is dead. No further information is needed. If it later comes to light that he was revived by some some means or other, the deceased label will be removed, but until then we must convey what the manga does to us.Hash2o (talk) 12:49, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

True, however it looked as if Jiraiya first thought he was putting his pen down yet and then thought he can't yet since the book's unfinshed and it needs a title. He's last seen coming up with the title, "The Story of Naruto Uzumaki." Also, we can't confirm his death for at least a few more chapters and we can't go by Pain's statement since he has not seen Jiraiya's dead body (nor have we). 216.196.213.141 (talk) 04:21, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Archived

Page is archived. Get over the strength complaining. — Someguy0830 (T | C) 21:41, 17 October 2007 (UTC) there is some vandalism. it is that it says that konan is on his team and that he is dead. someone do something! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.35.20.80 (talk) 00:20, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Sennin as "hermit" or "sage"

Within the article, we twice refer to 仙人 (sennin). Once we say that Jiraiya is known as the "Toad Sage", and later that he has a power called "Hermit Mode". I understand that "Hermit Mode" seems to be the phrase bandied about by scanlaters and the popular discussion forums, but I'm uncomfortable seeing 仙人 translated in two different ways ("sage" or "hermit") in the same article, when the context is fairly similar. Should we change "Hermit Mode" to "Sage Mode"? I'll do so for now, but by all means undo the change if you disagree. Please post here explaining why if you do so. Elyssaen 12:34, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

"Sage" isn't a "translation" as much as a "localization". A sennin is a mountain man; a hermit. There is a sort of supernatural sense to the word, but it does not suggest wisdom nearly as much as the word "sage" does.

Anyway, when multiple terms are available, this is Wikipedia's order of preference:

1. Use the official trade name if available in English/Latin alphabet;
2. Use the form found in a dictionary entry from a generally-accepted English dictionary;

1. Use the form publicly used on behalf of the [subject] in the English-speaking world;
2. Use the form publicly used on behalf of the [subject] in any other popular Latin-alphabet-using language; or
3. If none of the above is available, use the macronned form.

This is discussed under WP:MOS-JA#Names of modern figures but the order can apply to other terms as well, not just names. –Gunslinger47 23:25, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

So in short (as I am WAY to burned out from today) we use Sage instead of Hermit here?--TheUltimate3 00:10, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I think so, until contradicted by future Viz manga or dubs. –Gunslinger47 07:11, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Chronological correctness?

I'd like to know about the chronological correctness in the following sentences:

"As a child, Jiraiya and his former teammates, Orochimaru and Tsunade, were students of the Third Hokage. After leaving the Third's tutelage, he traveled the world and discovered the residence of the toads, a species he proved to have a natural affinity for."

Reason: The toad sage predicted Jiraya to become "a pervert without equal" and "a shinobi of incredible talent", when Jiraiya hears this he gets a little sceptical/dissapointed at the "pervert" part, however, while he was in the 3rd's tutelage he had already picked up a perverted habit (he gets a flashback about it (A. in the manga: somewhere around the 3rd's funeral. (B. in the anime: early in Naruto's rasengan training)... Furthermore, the red lines under Jiraiya's eyes appear to grow longer the older he gets, and I believe they appear longer when he's training with Sarutobi. Opinions? Thoughts? 81.228.148.16 21:26, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

It's just an assumption that he met the toads after leaving and not while he was still a pupil under Sandaime. So I guess the page needs a fix. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.107.131.129 (talk) 23:43, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Jiraiya's "tears of blood" are painted on, so they are as long as Jiraiya wants them to be. As for the prediction, it was his becoming a pervert "without equal". –Gunslinger47 01:53, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Jiraiya had just become a Genin at the time of the flashback with the Third (he was 6 years of age according to the data books). He is considerably older than that at the time that he mingles with the toads. ~SnapperTo 03:16, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Error in the background section

It says: "Once becoming a Jonin capable of leading a squad, Jiraiya became the sensei of Arashi Uzumaki and two other unknown Genin." And when you click on Arashi Uzumaki it redirects you to the Fourth Hokage profile (or whatever you want to call it..) in list of konoha ninja, and that says his name is Minato Namikaze and that he is Fourth Hokage / Yondaime Hokage.. ~NekoRobin

You should log into your account before signing. Your identity cannot be verified as it is.

As for the Arashi nonsense, this was just the most recent edit.[1] I've reverted it. –Gunslinger47 19:15, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

"During his battle against Pein Jiraiya loses his left arm but still combats the six bodies of Pein by eliminating three bodies with the use of his toad genjutsu; only to find that Pein can revive them." Shouldn't that be edited to read that he's losst an arm after defeating three of them? As it is, it sounds like he lost his arm, then managed to beat them, but the Raw shows him beating the three then losing said arm... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.131.168.119 (talk) 18:40, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

The previous poster is correct: The three bodies were defeated prior to Jiraiya losing his arm. The chain of events went: Taking out the two, then trapping and killing the third. Being duped by a fourth body, not only losing his arm but being kicked into the outdoors. The next frame we saw in that particular manga was the last page: Pein's six bodies, in a diorama outlining the 6 forms of Pain. Off hand, I think the manga is 379, but it's within the last month or so for sure. My question is: Didja fix it, guy above me? 74.12.7.106 (talk) 17:17, 10 December 2007 (UTC) Joe

Jiraiya's Abilities

I think it's about time we remove the line "a full demonstration of Jiraiya's abilities have not yet been seen", because he's been fighting at maximum capacity for the last few chapters with Pein, so I'd say we have seen a full demonstration. Granted, he might have a few other jutsu we haven't yet seen, but I doubt they're any stronger or more effective then what he's used thusfar. 214.13.209.200 (talk) 13:08, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Jiraiya isn't dead yet

Guys, jiraiya isnt dead yet. Well it seems like it, but we're not sure, it could be a clone or illusion, etc —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.201.135.3 (talk) 01:32, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing this - I thought it off when I came here directly after reading the manga. Clearly, the manga had made no distinction as to whether he was dead or not. Frankly, one more manga would be needed. Again, good job on the fixing as that could have spawned a myriad of destruction on this talk page. 74.12.7.106 (talk) 17:14, 10 December 2007 (UTC) Joe

In fact he becomes one of the body's of Pain, replacing the body Jiraiya had sent to Tsunade. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.170.247.146 (talk) 05:50, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Where are people getting this from? The chapter hasnt even come out yet... Wait for the chapter, then add that if it turns out to be true... --GhostStalker(Got a present for ya! | Mission Log) 18:05, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Somebody was flashing around a photoshopped picture of Jiraiya with Pain's eyes and piercings saying "ok, let's go get Nartuo" in the days before the last chapter's release. It didn't show up in the chapter, so it was determined to be fake. Hewinsj (talk) 22:52, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Were did u get that idea???--naruto beierNaruto Beier (talk) 16:26, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Jiraiya is dead. Chapter 382 clearly says so in the last page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.244.213.251 (talk) 22:46, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but he is still speaking at the end of the chapter. Technically speaking, he is not 'dead' yet but 'dying'. Therefore, I'm removing the deceased label. 12.210.215.90 (talk) 01:15, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 20:49, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

dont say he is dead...just yet

it has not been officially confirmed, Wikipedia is all about verifiability, and since it has not been confirmed that he is dead we cant add it.--Blue-EyesGold Dragon 05:12, 22 December 2007 (UTC) ${\displaystyle }$

it has been verified--Velanthis (talk) 06:19, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

how and when?--Blue-EyesGold Dragon 15:02, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Pages 6-8 in chapter 383, confirmed by Pein on page 13 also in Chapter 383. With that, he's dead until proven otherwise.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 15:08, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

I could say the same thing, but i dont want an edit war.--Blue-EyesGold Dragon 15:13, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

HE SANK into the water. If he tries to breathe, GHACKKKKK. If he doesn't, GHACKKKKK. So there. He's dead. Hananoshi 02:03, 23 December 2007 (UTC)Hananoshi

Interesting theories 216.99.53.158 (talk) 03:38, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Very interesting. Although It looks like he is dead, Sasuke looked like he was dead in the land of waves arc, yes? Sasuke9031 (talk) 07:13, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Then at the time, he would have been considered dead if people started saying "Yo, Sauske's dead." Pein said Jiraiya was dead, and even Jiraiya said "This is a good ending", "Time to put down my pen" "yada yada yada". So as of now, he's dead until proven otherwise.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 12:26, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Haku PURPOSELY didn't kill Sasuke. He has a good heart, he made it look that way. But Pein is PURE EVIL, so he wouldn't spare jiraiya. Hananoshi 14:00, 23 December 2007 (UTC)Hananoshi

Pain may be pure evil, but so are the Sith, and they sometimes spare lives. The point hovever, is not about Star Wars, it's whether or not Jiraiya is really dead. I certainly believe that he is not because that would make about as much sense as every other injury in Naruto. Sasuke9031 (talk) 06:10, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

yes remember in Haku battle, "is this the first time you have seen a friend die in battle?" OMFG sasuke is dead, quick change the article! -_- --Blue-EyesGold Dragon 07:37, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

That's what I am saying. Don't jump to conclusions. Until Kishimoto explicitly says that Jiraiya is dead... well, don't say it. We don't want this article to start becoming a "Dumbledore is dead/not dead" edit war, so let's wait for his death to become verifiable. Sasuke9031 (talk) 18:01, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

We're not jumping to conclusions, as of the most recent chapter, Jiraiya is dead. Pein said so himself on page 13. Until his body shows up out of the water later on, he is dead until proven otherwise. The whole Dumbledore is dead/not dead edit war was done primarily due to a bunch of people who couldn't handle or accept the fact that the old man was dead, something that has to be avoided here. We go by the facts, not assumptions.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 20:36, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

I find it to be quite the contrary. Pain assumes Jiraiya is dead prior to Jiraiya falling into the water. Of course, once Jiraiya falls into the water it becomes apparent he still has some life left in him, as dead people can't think. Until we see his lifeless corpse, or Jiraiya does not make a reappearance in the next few chapters, there are conflicting statements about his status. ~SnapperTo 21:07, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

I find those final thoughts to be the last thing on his mind before the end, a typical thing in TV/comic/anime/manga/movies. I still hold strong to my "Jiraiya is dead". --TheUltimate3 (talk) 21:49, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

If I go by your theory, then Sasuke is just a waking talking corpse on the verge of becoming a Hollow. I don't believe that at all, so no =, jiraiya's not dead until proven otherwise. Sasuke9031 (talk) 22:07, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Did you really need to post the same points here and on my Talk Page? Well anywho, Snap out ranks me and at the moment I will remain silent here. However as I've said over and over again, I go by what I see, and look at it from a consumer and a an "artistic" standpoint. Jiraiya going on about this being a fitting end leads to Common Sense telling me he's dead. Pein saying Jiraiya was dead, gives me (currently) proof that Jiraiya is dead. I say until proven otherwise, like his body washing up on a beach somewhere and him complaining that this time he could have actually died, he is dead.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 22:41, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm sure I'm being simply being stubborn about this, but if Jiraiya's thoughts in 383 are indicative of lingering life, then that doesn't fit with Kishimoto's habit of killing off protagonists (and even most antagonists) at the end of a chapter. If Pa resurfaces without Jiraiya or someone close to Jiraiya (Tsunade perhaps) says he's dead, I'll let it go. ~SnapperTo 03:09, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

What's the saying, "bottomless pits are a notoriously unreliable means of death"? The same goes for seemingly bottomless swamps... especially when the one sinking is a toad sage. Celestial allies are a great form of Deus Ex Machina. That said, if the toads say he's dead, I'd say it's verified. They ought to know better than anyone. –Gunslinger47 19:59, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

Only pain says he is dead. Jiraiya is thinking he is about to die, and he might still live. Remember when haku almost killed Sauske. And sauske had a kind of gay moment with Naruto saying how he needed to stay alive so he could kill Itachi? And Naruto when fox and kicked haku's ass. Sauske himself thought that he was about to be dead, but he came out alive. I am juut himst thinking that Kishimoto wouldn't kill Jiraiya without us know much about him. It is just a thought.--Naruto Beier (talk) 03:11, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Three things. 1) Sasuke was peppered with needles that may or may not have hit vital areas. It was more or less a given that he was at least going to pass out. Death? Maybe, maybe not.

2) Jiraiya is in no way similar to Sasuke in this respect and here's why: His throat has collapsed, he is impaled in five different places with swords, two or three of which I'm pretty sure are through the lungs. And Sasuke wasn't sinking to the bottom of Davy Jones' Locker.

3) Kishimoto did tell us all about him. Remember all the flashbacks? Lastbetrayal (talk) 20:59, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

jiraiya is dead get used to it

i know everyone is a huge fan on the toad mountain sage, but guess what Pain killed him...no doubt about it...it would be very gay if the writer guy showed all of that drama just to have him still living —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.35.58.130 (talk) 01:16, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Being a fan has nothing to do with Wikipedia policy. See Wikipedia:Verifiability. Right now there's still a good chance that Kishimoto will bring Jiraiya back. Lame or not. :( –Gunslinger47 02:01, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

There's that new interview with Kishimoto floating around the internet from Jump Festa 2008, where Kishimoto says that Jiraiya is all but dead... Of course, I dont have a reliable source for that and all I'm going off of is hearsay, but if that can be verified, I think we can finally put this matter to rest. --GhostStalker(Got a present for ya! | Mission Log) 22:01, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Pain stated that he was dead. Unless Naruto does a DBZ and brings him back to life with a couple of balls it is safe to say he is dead.Hash2o (talk) 12:32, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

First, there's Chiyo's brother, so it would be safe to say that he could revive Jiraiya, but for now, let's not go with speculation. He's dead, Jim. Sasuke9031 (talk) 18:33, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes, Kishimoto always uses the "apparently dead" plot device...Zabusa getting killed by needles impaled in the neck, Choji taking a suicide pill, Neiji getting supposedly shot to death, Gaira dying and getting revived, Deidara self-destructing and then saying it was only his bunshin 5 min later...do people ever die in Naruto? But jokes aside, Jiraiya is stated to be dead, so his status should just be stated as deceased. Won't surprise me if he IS actually still alive, but for the time being there is absolutely no evidence of such.121.210.92.56 (talk) 06:51, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Makes about as much sense as any other injury in this story (thanks for that quote Vegeta3986). Sasuke9031 (talk) 07:04, 31 December 2007 (UTC)