Talk:Delirium tremens

possible error

i think theres an error with this in the article. "Unlike the withdrawal syndrome associated with opiate dependence, delirium tremens (and alcohol withdrawal in general) can be fatal." opiate withdrawal can in fact be fatal. i know a few people who work at rehab facilities. opiate and alcohol addicts, if severe enough, constantly have their hearts monitored because there have been cases of heart failure due to withdrawal. i think its more common in older or unhealthy people. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.188.195.13 (talk) 20:05, 28 July 2008 (UTC) heres a source. http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/Heroin_-_Withdrawal/id/1323298 i'm sure their are many others from google if this one isnt good enough —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.188.195.13 (talk) 20:11, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

The majority of heroin addicts also misuse and are often physically dependent on other "downers" as part of their poly drug using behaviour including alcohol, benzodiazepines and sometimes barbiturates. Cardiovascular problems can occur from during alcohol withdrawal and benzodiazepine or barbiturate withdrawal. Withdrawal from CNS GABAergic depressants such as alcohol, benzodiazepines and barbiturates are well known for having fatal complications during withdrawal (most notably seizures). Pure opiate withdrawal is not regarded as being a life threatening withdrawal syndrome. The common cold or even sex can kill the elderly or severely debilitated.--Literaturegeek | T@1k? 22:36, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

drawings

"drawings on wallpaper that the patient would perceive as giant spiders ready to attack her or him)"

That is an illusion, not a hallucination!

An illusion is defined ad a "deformed perception of reality", that is, perceiving something while the real object is something completely different; a hallucination is a "perception without object", that is, perceiving something while there is nothing that could generate that perception.

So, mistaking wallpaper drawings for spiders is an illusion; seeing spiders on the walls of a room where there are no spiders and nothing that could be mistaken for a spider (no drawings on the wallpaper) is a hallucination. Devil Master 13:45, 15 Apr 2005 (CET)

So, a person experiencing these symptoms is illusionating rather than hallucinating? I'm sorry, but this seems like meaningless semantics to me. I think, at least as far as popular usage is concerned, any person seeing things that do not exist, due to a medical condition or intoxication which warps the perception, can be said to be experiencing a hallucination. Of course, when you are able to see the sailboat in the Magic Eye picture, this is an illusion, but when the wallpaper becomes alive and begins attacking you, I think this can be properly characterized as a hallucination regardless of whether the vision is precipitated by some existing object or not.67.46.0.13 06:53, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

It is not a matter of semantics but is important diagnostically. Illusion-related psychoses have a different psychiatric differential than hallucination-related ones especially when considering drug intoxication. If you want to use the terms in a non-specific manner then you should be writing for the simple English domain of wikipedia.

Police contents???

Schitzos have hallucinations with police contents??? Im not a psychiatrist but even I think this is wrong??--Light current 21:39, 23 September 2005 (UTC)

Fact missing in intro: WHAT IS DT???

The article's introduction is only talking about the causes of delirium tremens, but it doesn't say what it actually is!! What kind of condition is it? If I asked you "what is delirium tremens?", would the right answer be "It's associated with alcohol, and it's fatal!"? As most other Wikipedia articles of this type would 'agree', that's not correct. Kreachure 16:22, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Confusing

"Despite notions to the contrary, because of delirium tremens, alcohol withdrawal is the most dangerous because it has the possibility of being fatal." What does this mean? What notions? When it says "most dangerous", does it mean among kinds of withdrawal or does it mean that it's DT that makes alcohol withdrawal dangerous? NickelShoe 06:43, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

Thank you, anonymous user, for clearing that up. NickelShoe 19:24, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Disambiguation?

the article List of commercial brands of beer links here instead of an article on the beer of the same (or similar) name.

The correct article exists at Delirium Tremens (beer). I'm going to take the liberty of linking to that article at the top of this one. NickelShoe 20:34, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Spambot ruined article!!!

Seems like a spambot ruined this article. Can someone put it back?

Number One on Google

[1] ranks #1 on Google for "Delium tremens"NumberOneGoogle 18:57, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

It would be nice if someone re-wrote or added a subsection to "Causes", the current text is too technical for a general audience.

Edited Causes

I added a few lines to the causes, hope it helps

Cultural references section

I think this section contains a lot of material that may be peripheral to the main topic. It's just a very long list of fictional references, and highbrow as many of them might be, it's not explained why depictions of delerium tremens might have a special cultural significance. Alcohol use and addiction certainly are important themes in fiction, but I'm not convinced that delerium tremens itself is significant in the same way, except as an illustration of those themes. For an example of addressing the significance of fictional alcoholism, see Alcoholism#Societal_impact. Notice it mentions a few specific examples instead of just listing off a whole ton of stuff. I also think it might be good to have an article on Alcohol use in fiction or the Cultural impact of alcohol use for this type of material.--Eloil 11:01, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Hello. My name is Scott Seguin. This may not seem important. But the "cultural reference" to The Brothers Karamazov is simply not true. I read the book last year. And Ivan Karamazov is not an alcoholic in this novel. As a matter of fact, he is not even portrayed in the novel as drinking at all. It is claimed that Ivan hallucinates the devil in the midst of a delirium tremens, when in fact Dostoyevsky makes it clear that he is going insane due to a deep emotional conflict. This irritates me. If someone wants to write an article and claim knowledge of all these disparate facts, in my opinion you better damn well know them as facts, and not just put them up there and think to oneself, "well that sounds good." So, in short, if I can gain access to this article, I am going to delete the misformation. If it is no longer there, my work is done. --Scott Seguin, the information Nazi.

Just before his confrontation with the Devil, Ivan is described as being on the verge of белая горячка- literally "white fever". This is usually translated as delirium tremens, but it can also be used to refer to any state of fevered hallucination. Given that this article deals with DT as it relates to substance withdrawal and not as a general state of hallucination, the white fever suffered by Ivan does not fit in this article as it is brought on by emotional and spiritual conflict. Therefore I have removed the reference. Edwarddecker 22:23, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I am the one who orginally added the Brothers Karamazov reference -- in the translation I read (by David McDuff), Ivan was described as specifically suffering from delirium tremens. A footnote by the author (McDuff, not Dostoyevsky) reads "In Dostoyevsky's Russian text, Ivan's illness is defined as belaya goryachka or delirium tremens (DTs). There seems little doubt that Dostoyevsky wishes to stress Ivan's family nature - Ivan is a Karamazov, too, with the Karamazov vices. Although we see little or nothing of Ivan's drinking, hints of it are scattered throughout the novel (...in particular, for example, ...Ivan's constant references to 'dashing the cup to the floor'). Dostoyevsky never managed to write the 'explanation' of Ivan's illness that was to form the subject of an article in A Writer's Diary, but from his letters it is clear that he consulted several doctors on the subject of delirium tremens, the symptoms of which Ivan unquestionably displays." I do, however, understand the reasons for deletion, but I think it ought to be known that it wasn't just my own personal opinion that prompted me to make the edit in the first place. --Tim B.

I added it again for the same reason that Tim B. did. Then I discovered that I wasn't the first. I'll leave it there since I'm not sure Scott Seguin's credentials ("I read the book last year") are greater than David McDuff's. I guess it boils down to the translation from Russian. Maybe a Russian should comment. Regarding Eloil's comment, it might make sense to do away with the cultural references altogether. Such references will probably be included in their "home" articles anyway and will be easily searchable. -- Kirk D. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.212.141.200 (talk) 01:25, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Dissapointed, re: Benzodiazepine (or in rare cases barbiturate) withdrawal

This article is written as if it's exclusively for alcohol withdrawal. Benzodiazepine withdrawal causes DTs and sympotoms just as bad if not worse depending on the dosage and duration of use. Instead of one small note regarding benzos/barbiturates (causing withdrawal), this article should encompass both scenarios. Benzodiazepine is a far larger problem than acknowledged, it's just one that is treated with...more benzodiazepines! As such, it is a grossly underreported problem (well, it isn't a problem at face value if you have a consistent supply.) It should also mention the use of alcohol to combat benzodiazepine withdrawal (not as a suggestion, just stating the facts of life.)

A small tidbit I feel I should share, there is some debate amongst the scientific community, and this is *TOTALLY* anecdotal, but having been on high-dose clonazepam, alprazolam was unable to fully cure the DTs. Klonopin, in my experience, is superior in combatting DTs. This would be long-term - it doesn't have a fast duration of action for emergencies. The fact that clonazepam is used as a very likely choice for seizure disorders backs this up a bit. It DOES, however, have a long duration of action, allowing for once a day dosing and a stable treatment regime, the key reason diazepam is used typically (because it's metabolites are extremely long-acting.) I will say I do think however that alprazolam is not 2mg to 20mg diazepam as commonly believed and this is getting around to the scientific and medical community finally.

Let me hear your feedback before I try any editing. I will look to see if I can back up my anecdotal notes (which of course I wouldn't add without a proper reference.)

Malnutrition and infection are "psychological"??

I am no expert on this topic, but the following sentence seems confusing or possibly inaccurate:

"It is possible that psychological (i.e., non-physical) factors also play a role, especially those of infections, malnutrition, or other underlying medical disorders - often related to alcoholism."

Malnutrition and infection are not psychological disorders. Did you mean that psychological factors lead to malnutrition and infection? And if so, that these (malnutrition and infection) exacerbate DT?

GreenRegsAndHam (talk) 23:37, 14 January 2008 (UTC)GreenRegsAndHam

I agree that this needs clarification. Maybe the author meant psychological conditions arising from infection, malnutrition, or other underlying medical disorders. If this is not clarified, I think it should be removed, as it is extremely confusing.

Mahasanti (talk) 15:38, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

seeing is believing

Today I visited my father in hospital who was admitted 3 days ago for a bladder problem. He was diagnosed today to also be suffering the DTs. I know he likes a drink of whiskey but I didnt know to what extent he was consuming the stuff. His state of mind today was terrifing to witness to the point that he didnt appear to be the father I have known for 51 years. He was talking to imaginary people, he was convinced my mother was alivre, every second question he asked was related to whisky, he was seeing spiders in the ward and thought I was married to someone called Jean when my wifes name is Elena. He asked about my white teeth on the advertisement I am involved with and how do I get my eeth so white. I am a retail project manager and have never been involved in advertising. He thought my sisters skirt was a galss of whiskey and that the doctor glued a whisky bottle by his bed at night to taunt him. 3 days ago he was lucid and what I would consider normal. He is meticulous about his clothes and how clean his house is. He is not the typical alchoholic who is seen dirty and staggering around the streets and sleeping in a gutter. My eyes are open now and I am in shock, I dont know if he will recover from this r if he is sent home how will we control his alchohol intake. Maybe we should as a family noticed and took action sooner but we have thought that he is almost 80 years old and enjoys a little drink so what is the harm. Today I saw first hand the harm and would hate to think that one day my daughter would or could witness the same. Big lesson, moderation or none what so ever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.193.186.29 (talk) 19:58, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Error

"High doses may be necessary to prevent mortality."

Are you sure you don't mean "to prevent death"? Mortality is even less preventable.