Talk:Expanding bullet

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Movie reference

I have only seen the movie and have not read the novel, but I believe that in The Day of the Jackal they refer to mercury and glycerine as bywords for nitroglycerine and mercury fulminate, both explosive compounds, so I will take this piece out.

Should this page also not include the Dum Dum pop, or at least a link to its entry?

Dum Dum pops are a flavored candy put on a stick. they have been around since 1924. see here: http://www.dumdumpops.com/ for more information, including history.

go for it. vroman

Page moved

I have moved the page from Dum dum to Dum-dum. This makes the title consistent with the text. Axl 10:39, 18 Jan 2005 (UTC)

illegal combatants subject to summary execution?

The article states:

Illegally modified bullets found on a soldier would be evidence that the soldier was not following the conventions of land warfare, and he could be treated as an illegal combatant (subject to summary execution).

I do not believe that prisoners ever are subject to summary execution. Prisoners are supposed to be treated according to the Geneva Conventions by their captors. If doubt exists that they are entitled to being classified as a POW, then a "competent tribunal" is supposed to convene to make a determination about their status. I believe that, until that time, an execution, or even brutal treatment, constitutes a war crime.

I removed the reference to execution, and placed a link to unlawful combatant. 3mta3 06:19, 27 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You do not understand why an illegal combatant is not, by definintion, a POW. An illegal combatant forfeits all of the privledges accorded a prisoner of war. The intent of this was to limit, if not outright stop, warring parties from dressing their troops in enemy uniforms to gain an advantage on the battlefield. Most armies do cheat from time to time (Germans in U.S. uniforms during the Battle of the Bulge), but the idea is to strongly discourage this behaviour.

The presence of illegal combatants masquerading as civilians, hiding in mosques or churches, dressing as friendly troops, makes a mockery of the Geneva Convention, the law of land warfare, and make it all but impossible to correctly distinguish lawful combatants from innocent bystanders. It much more likely that civillians will be mis-identified and killed or wounded as a result. There is an exception in that militia or military units that do not have uniforms, but otherwise fight as military units and otherwise obey the law of armed conflict are lawful combatants (think of Confederates soldiers fighting without uniforms, but in ranks and under the Confederate flag).

If caught, long standing tradition holds that spies, sabatours, soldiers wearing the other sides uniforms etc. are illegal combatants and can be subject to summary justice, including execution. Looters commiting mayhem in an area under martial law can likewise be executed.Sorry, but if you are dressed in civilian attire, hide on the roof of a civilian home, take a few pot shots at soldiers, ditch your weapon in a gutter; you are an illegal combatant and have no reasonable expectation of POW status.

References

this article needs some serious work on referencing. Check out WP:CITE and then find a free bibliography maker of the net. Enjoy. --CyclePat 21:41, 19 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Marc Bossuyt and Jan Wouters (2005): Grondlijnen van internationaal recht, Intersentia, Antwerpen enz., p. 539 (in Dutch) says dum-dum bullets were first produced in 1867. In 1868, a Saint Petersburg declaration (written bij 26 states) said that this type of bullet was "be contrary to the laws of humanity"; so the 26 states forbade the use of these bullets. NL-Ninane 20:00, 25 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

On a related note, the article states “These were not the first expanding bullets, however, and the term ‘Dum-dum’ is considered a slang term.” Source referenced is source #1. The link says: “1. An expanding bullet design originally developed by the British military units stationed at the Dum Dum Arsenal in India. In order to compensate for the issuance of smaller caliber, jacketed ammunition, the soldiers began cutting the jackets off at the nose in order to assist in terminal expansion; 2. A slang term used to refer to any type of soft-nose or hollow point bullet.” It does NOT say anything about any previous or later “expanding” (or otherwise) round. Keep your stories straight, it might help your credibility.