Talk:Jehovah in the New Testament

That which is asserted by some to be "Fraudulent""

The article is inaccurate. For example, the English version of a Italian article published on the catholic magazine, edited from Dehonian friars, "Rivista Biblica", year XLV, n. 2, April-June 1997, p. 183-186. Bologna, Italy says: "... recent discoveries have shown that the practice of substituted in the LXX YHWH with KYRIOS started in a much later period in comparison with the beginning of that version.[date? context?] As a matter of fact, the older copies of the LXX keep the Tetragrammaton written in Hebrew characters in the Greek text. Girolamo, the translator of the Latin Vulgate confirms this fact. In the prologue of the books of Samuel and Kings he wrote: "In certain Greek volumes we still find the Tetragrammaton of God's name expressed in ancient characters". And in a letter written in Rome in the year 384 it says: "God's name is made up of four letters; it was thought ineffable, and it is written with these letters: iod, he, vau, he (YHWH). But some have not been able to decipher it because of the resemblance of the Greek letters and when they found it in Greek books they usually read it PIPI (pipi)". S. Girolamo, Le Lettere, Rome, 1961, vol.1, pp.237, 238; compare J.P.Migne, Patrologia Latina, vol.22, coll.429, 430."

We can conclude that the article is biased, which also the writer's nick suggests. (Anonymous 2005-10-12 07:01:59)

Anonymous: The above quotation, whatever its provenance, discusses the Old Testament. This article is about the New Testament.  - C. dentata 18:45, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

The quote above, referencing the LXX, is relevant in that it refers to the nominal source for the quotations from the OT. It is manifestly the basic issue here - what did the writers of the NT quote when citing references from the OT? If the Masoretic / Hebrew text, then the quote contained the Tetragram. If the Septuagint, then, as the article asserts, they would also have quoted from a reference bearing the Tetragram and, reasonably, it would have been in the NT. (Amanuensis03 2006-02-18 18:26:07 )

Even the fragmentary reference to the LXX says that it read Kyrios not "YHWH." This contradicts your point.

Worse, you are assuming "what would have been!!" That is a belief and not substantiated. We have the Greek text of both the NT and LXX, so it is irrelevant what one thinks "what would have been" which is moreover wholly contradicted by what is. The article as written by the consensus is quite explicit and accurate on this point (no I did not write that part.)

To change the Greek text to what one imagines "would have been" is fraud!  - C. dentata 20:54, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Long list of Bible versions in article

A visit to http://www.e-sword.net will furnish one with the opportunity to verify the accuracy of quotations shown from translations numbered as 4 & 5 above; one will have to download e-sword, download the bibles and then install all files, including fonts unique to the bible.

Those listed as #1, 2, 9 & 11 have urls attached to the citation and can be easily verified.

The Hutter referred to is a well-respected translation and somewhat of a unique bible; copies are called 'Hutters' reasonbly enough and are prized. Hutter himself founded the movement that is still in existence today and bears his name. For information about him from a modern day perspective, visit this site: http://www.hutterites.org/hutter.htm (Amanuensis03 2006-02-18 01:46:09 )

The list is irrelevant.

To be fair, if there is a list of obscure modern versions in which Jehovah were added, then there would have to be the 10,000s of translations in which Jehovah was not added. The original language — Greek — did not use Jehovah or anything similar in the New Testament and it is a major factual error to equivocate!

The list does not belong here.  - C. dentata 17:50, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

NOTE: Amanuensis03 deleted my reply (which I have restored).[1] This shows bad faith and is dishonest.  - C. dentata 21:04, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

NOTE:Castanea dentata has deleted numerous entries posted here, including the list he asserts is irrelevant - it has been deleted half a dozen times, perhaps because it demonstrates that which is not in agreement with the agenda being advanced here. That about a dozen other translators have opted to to include the name of god in their rendering of the NT demonstrates that not only is this position reasonable, it has been demonstrated. In point of fact it started with Shem Tob's version of 1385 - some 620 years ago.

Worse, personally attacking another is a formal error in logic - demonstrating the weakness of the arguments advanced.

Dead Sea Scrolls information

With respect to the Dead Sea scrolls, referred to in the main article, please go to the following site and note the image therein of a portion of the Psalms wherein the tetragrammaton is shown in older phoenician letters: http://www.ibiblio.org/expo/deadsea.scrolls.exhibit/full-images/psalm-b.gif

Tetragrammaton in reference to Jesus

Here's one page talking about all three mentioned scriptures, and some others: http://www.catholic-forum.com/members/popestleo/hiding.html. It took me about two seconds to find this. Surely I'm not the only one that knows how to use search engines here. You can find enough to read until the cows come home.Tommstein 08:46, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

Very good! Perhaps this should be incorporated into the article?  - C. dentata 18:46, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

The box

What do this box in this article? This article is not about any particular god, it is an essay about the use of a name in the Bible. I think this box do not belong to this article. Summer Song 18:21, 9 February 2006 (UTC)