Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pat Zalewski (2nd nomination)

Pat Zalewski

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

My search doesn't show that the subject meets WP:AUTHOR, WP:MANOTE, or WP:GNG.Mdtemp (talk) 17:19, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. No real secondary sources describing his work as an author, no book reviews, nothing at all. Just a citation of someone else using his work as a reference. That doesn't add up to notability. Gamaliel (talk) 18:36, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of New Zealand-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Religion-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:48, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete The previous AFD was not helpful in shedding any light as to why it would have so many keeps despite the lack of reliable sources. Considering that WP:AUTHOR has become more rigid since then, and despite his large body of work, there has been no real substantiated assertion of notability. As such, I'm inclined side with delete unless someone is able to track down multiple reliable sources. Mkdw ^talk 20:04, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Lacks reliable independent secondary sources required to establish notability under WP:GNG. The best I was able to find were interviews on blog sites, which are WP:PRIMARY and lack the editorial oversight required to make them WP:RELIABLE. Msnicki (talk) 21:31, 4 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

weak delete not entirely comfortable with that...as I can verify that the book written by Robert Ellwood in 1993 and cited in article exists[1] AGF on content and that he was inducted into the NZ hall Martial Arts hall of Fame [2] in 2000, Hall of Fame does indicate notability within the Association and should be sufficient in establishing notability but WP:N SPORT doesnt make that leap for any sport. Given both of these sources add to it that he competed pre-internet makes it difficult. International_Traditional_Karate_Federation article does match the [letter=N#text the ITKF site] but neither show NZ as a member, which is troubling in that a non-member country is unlikely to be able to compete, though I do concede membership can wain over time. Gnan garra 00:09, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Book by Professor Robert Ellwood has no mention of Pat Zalewski within it.
Delete - No significant coverage in reliable sources to establish notability. — Joaquin008 ^(talk) 09:52, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Keep There needs to be more sourcing and the article needs to be pared down, but there should be enough secondary sources out there, as far as this particular niche goes. His work is cited in many books on the subject. Anyone familiar with this subject area knows Zalewski is notable in the field. ^^James^^ (talk) 08:45, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Self promotion by author.

Keep I agree with ^^James^^ that the article needs paring down, but here is a preliminary list of secondary sources. They should be added to the article as refs.

Tree of Life, (Regardie, ed. Cicero) - Citations to Secret Inner Rituals of the Golden Dawn, 2 endnotes.
Godwin's Cabalistic Encyclopedia (Godwin) - Bibliography/Reading List, Secret Inner Rituals of the Golden Dawn
Tarot and the Magus (Paul Huges-Barlow), five in-line references: 2 References to Z1- 0=0 Neophyte Ritual, 1 Reference to The Equinox Rituals of the Golden Dawn, Paragrpah quotation from Z1, Paragrpah quotation from Secret Inner Order Rituals of the Golden Dawn.
History of the Occult Tarot (Ronald Drecker, Michael A.E. Dummett), Reference, Z-5 Secret Teachings of the Golden Dawn

I believe this is enough to satisfy the requirement of WP:AUTHOR for 2nd party references in printed books by commercial publishing houses, in particular the first two. JMax555 (talk) 03:48, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Based on the author's body of work AND the secondary source citations offered by 'james', I vote for keeping the article. Kheph777 (talk) 05:04, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Based on the author's body of work AND the secondary source citations offered by 'james', I vote for keeping the article. Pat Zalewski is a noted researcher in this field and has a substantial body of work and lots of references can be found. For example he is also referenced in

King over the Water (Nick Farrell), Reference, Golden Dawn Rituals and Commentaries
King over the Water (Nick Farrell), Reference, Talismans and Evocations of the Golden Dawn
King over the Water (Nick Farrell), Reference, Inner Order Teachings of the Golden Dawn Magus007

Comment I would like to point out, with out going to SPI, that User:Kheph777, User:JMax555, and User:^^James^^ all came out of editing retirement since 2012 to singularly !vote keep on this AfD on the same day. Kheph777 and JMax555 both use triple repeating digits and despite Kheph777's very small number of edits, has contributed to two similar pages as JMax555. Mkdw ^talk 05:21, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Kheph777 and JMax555 are two different people and the reason that they contribute to similar pages might be because they are experts in this particular field, and discovered that the page was up for deletion. I monitor a couple of pages and if there are no changes on them I have nothing to say. Magus007