Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Russian inventions

List of Russian inventions

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Declining PROD by User:RAF910 because one was already contested last year, bringing it to AfD. Concern was: "1...This article appears to be full of cold-war era Russian propaganda. 2...The factual accuracy is already in question. 3...The referenced sources also appear to be Soviet era propaganda and are also in question. 4...This article has been up for deletion in the past for the same issues. And, no attempt appears to have been made to correct the issues in question. 5...This article has received less than one click a day for the last 90 days. It is therefore not worth the time and energy to fix." I'll comment separately. Ansh6 6 6 23:22, 9 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect or possibly selective merge: There's been questions about the veracity of much of the article; I can't tell because the majority of the sources are either in Russian or paper sources and many entries are unsourced (I'm not going to look through hundreds of articles to see whether they individually have sources for being put on here). User:Northamerica1000 mentioned the possibility of a merge to Timeline of Russian inventions and technology records when declining the previous PROD on the talk page, but I'm not convinced that much verifiable info can be merged in. Ansh6 6 6 23:29, 9 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. for the reasons stated above...
1...This article appears to be full of cold-war era Russian propaganda. 2...The factual accuracy is already in question. 3...The referenced sources also appear to be Soviet era propaganda and are also in question. 4...This article has been up for deletion in the past for the same issues. And, no attempt appears to have been made to correct the issues in question. 5...This article has received less than one click a day for the last 90 days. It is therefore not worth the time and energy to fix.--RAF910 (talk) 23:37, 9 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Duplicate vote, so struck. This one is the same as the nomination/PROD statement, and the one below is a lot more detailed, so I'll leave that and get rid of this one. Ansh6 6 6 22:19, 13 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. per nominator. selective merge: I have looked at an article's sources. I have also looked at the edit history of an article's creator. While the topic of this article might be useful for someone's research the information in the article itself is not due to many questionable claims with non-reliable (or permanently dead) supporting references... Which is not surprising considering that this article was created by a person with a very specific agenda here on English Wiki (but that should be discussed elsewhere). Plus there are very similar articles that already exist here, for example Timeline of Russian inventions and technology records - the information from both of these can be merged into one article, after discarding any questionable parts from both of these. Not to mention the fact that this article was given plenty of time to improve since latest deletion proposal discussions but noone bothered to do any coherent improvements except adding in more propaganda fluff with more unusable references. 173.68.110.16 (talk) 00:44, 10 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I have decided to go over it again and have deleted most of the dubious claims/propaganda, as well as irrelevant "penis measurement" sections like "records". Some of the information there is unquestionably useful, just needs more clean-up and a merge with more detailed Timeline of Russian inventions and technology records which already contains similar info as well as constant monitoring (and reversal) of future attempts of padding these articles with more propaganda fluff with useless Russian wiki links and highly questionable references. 173.68.110.16 (talk) 01:13, 12 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Russia-related deletion discussions. Northamerica1000^(talk) 01:24, 10 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Technology-related deletion discussions. Northamerica1000^(talk) 01:24, 10 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Northamerica1000^(talk) 01:25, 10 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science-related deletion discussions. Northamerica1000^(talk) 02:05, 10 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with Timeline of Russian inventions and technology records. Similar topics, both marginally useful, Timeline of Russian inventions and technology records seems to be better Alex Bakharev (talk) 04:19, 12 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I have no problem with this list, but the trend or consensus has been to merge such lists. Bearian (talk) 17:32, 13 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comment This article has been much improved (and by that I mean a lot of random stuff was cut out) by the IP above. When it was nominated it was ridiculous. That said, much of what remains here is a duplicate of the timeline article. Ansh6 6 6 17:43, 13 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Unfortunately, this article was not created as an honest source of information listing the true accomplishments of Russian Inventors. But, as propaganda trying desperately to prove the superiority of the Soviet/Russian State. Even though it has been cleaned up. There is still a tremendous amount of questionable information. Much of it based on Soviet and Russian patents which are not worth the paper they are written on. Throughout the Cold War and even today, whenever anyone invents anything of note, the Russians are quick to produce a patent claiming that they invented it years if not decades earlier. Today, no country in the world accepts Russian patents, not even their friends and allies. In fact, the Russians can't even get their friends to make royalty payments for the AK-47 rifles that they make (which is clearly a Russian invention). Also, every single publisher in USSR/Russia was/is considered and instrument of the State and was/is part of the Russian Propaganda Machine with orders to prove the superiority of the Soviet/Russian State. As such, they write and rewrite history accordingly. They even airbrush people out of historical photographs or add them in as they see fit. As a result, every Russian book, newspaper and magazine is by definition a bias/questionable source. Even Cook Books are not immune and filled with propaganda touting the superiority of the Russian state farmer. So, if someone wants to claim that the Russians/USSR invented something we need and absolutely irrefutable English Language source.--RAF910 (talk) 21:01, 13 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Sound English sources are more preferable, but Russian sources could also be used.
- There are many nations and cultures (e.g. Chinese, Muslim etc) claiming a lot of technical achievements, with many such published invention claims being questionable, especially in the eyes of a typical educated Western reader. The issue is complicated by the difficulties in defining of what constitutes an invention and what constitutes a priority in inventing something (e.g. can we call an early prototype invention? should we list an invention that was forgotten and later re-invented by another nation? etc). The topic is complex to handle, and we should on one hand try to use some strict criteria
- Also, every single publisher in USSR/Russia was/is considered and instrument of the State and was/is part of the Russian Propaganda Machine with orders to prove the superiority of the Soviet/Russian State. In relation to the technical history there was indeed a brief post-WWII period of the "struggle for domestic priorities in science and technology" when Soviet authors propagandised a lot of priorities in science and technology. The period however ended long ago, though it introduced some recurring invention myths into circulation.
- Me too is unhappy with the present state of the article. I agree that it should be improved via better sorting of information, better formatting, better sourcing, and application of stricter criteria of what constitutes an invention. But there is absolutely no reason to delete the article. GreyHood ^Talk 21:27, 15 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Keep not merge The list and the timeline better stay two different articles. These are two different formats, and it is better to have both a collection of inventions sorted by field and a chronological perspective of invention history related to Russia. The list needs more work to become a decent article, but what we have now is a good start. GreyHood ^Talk 21:21, 15 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]