Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/BEMER therapy

BEMER therapy

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BEMER therapy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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I think this is blatant promotionalism bordering on WP:SPAM. Essentially nothing but a commercial advertisement for a junk medicine claim. jps (talk) 18:48, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

• Comment Are we reading the same article? I haven't investigated notability, but the prose seems fairly neutral, discussing lack of effectiveness and "claimed" effects. --{{u|Mark viking}} {Talk} 00:46, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Medicine-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 01:09, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

• Comment The company is a MLM outfit and the devices (which the MLM particpants sell) are apparently a scam based on fake science. All this apparently isn't covered in RS, but in odd corners of the web which it would be hard to use, even given WP:PARITY. So it's woo, but is it notable woo? I'll see if I can dig anything usable out ... Alexbrn (talk) 09:23, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

  Thanks for the background. It seems there are two topics here; BEMER therapy, which has some studies listed on PubMed, and the BEMER group, which I agree looks like an MLM scam operation. I suppose the therapy is possibly notable, but I'll defer to editors with more experience in fringe medical woo to determine that. --{{u|Mark viking}} {Talk} 12:08, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

I'm not convinced that BEMER therapy and the BEMER groups can be meaningfully disentangled. You get one, you get the other. As it is, however, essentially no sources are out there which carefully explore this. In other words, the entire thing is just a bit too obscure for a marginal health claim to be included in Wikipedia. jps (talk) 17:50, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

It's all here: the lone pioneer, the "institute", the fake theory, the scam. Unfortunately I can't find any material sufficiently RS for Wikipedia's purposes, which is a shame as it's classic and it would be good if Wikipedia carried some accurate knowledge about it. Alexbrn (talk) 09:39, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

I have to agree with Alexbrn. When people see it pop up in their communities [1], it would be nice if they had an accurate encyclopedia entry about it to refer to. - LuckyLouie (talk) 19:52, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

• Delete. Sadly there is no worthy RS for this fascinating little altmed backwater. Alexbrn (talk) 09:57, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
• Smerge maybe to Radionics? Otherwise delete: this is bollocks, but it's not notable bollocks. Guy (help!) 10:39, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
• melurge with Cranial electrotherapy stimulation or Low-level laser therapy or Scrambler therapy following a brief search of my watchlist. -Roxy, the PROD. . wooF 21:33, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
• Redirect to Radionics#EMT_devices where a sentence about BEMER (Bio-Electro-Magnetic-Energy-Regulation) device/therapy (yes there is a BEMER device) will fit nicely into the list of other dubious electromagnetic therapy devices. As for the MLM, I don't see evidence it's notable enough for inclusion anywhere on WP. - LuckyLouie (talk) 22:20, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
• Delete fails WP:GNG no significant, reliable, independent coverage. I'd say merge to Radionics#EMT devices and an entry there alongside other like pseudo-scientific devices will do just fine, the problem is aside from the name everything else would have to be rewritten to properly condense and so it would essentially be a do over anyway. 2604:2000:8FC0:4:617F:E9A7:AF1C:4546 (talk) 03:12, 14 December 2019 (UTC)