Talk:Fullmetal Alchemist/Archive 1

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Envy is Male?

{{spoiler}} When is that said? --Karmafist 06:47, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) {{spoiler}}

Envy turns out to be the brother of Edward Elric (big spoiler thingy). Yes, he does look like a girl at the beginning of the anime. Ambush Commander 18:24, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

{{spoiler}}

To be more specific, he's the homunculus of Dante's and Hohenheim's son. I'm sure his common form is meant to be male, too; no large chest and all. Apostrophe 19:38, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Oh c'mon guys, I totally didn't see that spoiler coming.--Sean WI 04:17, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Did you miss the spoiler warning at the top of the page? Apostrophe 01:10, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I guess having spoiler tags a full page length above where it is done kind of does that. Besides, most talk pages don't even have spoiler warnings on the top of the page like that. Sean WI 04:45, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

Ok, gotcha. --Karmafist 05:25, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Story Edits

Why was the information about Dante taking the Homonculus from Ed and Al's failed Human Transmutation removed? There are already spoiler tags, so I don't see any harm in putting it in there even though it's not discovered until later in the plot. (Darien Shields 03:51, 6 August 2005 (UTC))

Actually, I was going to suggest removing even 'more'. I know there's a tag and all but those spoilers are HUGE. pabter 02:02, September 6, 2005 (UTC)

There are no degrees of Spoiler Tags, not "spoilers for people who have only seen half the series" or "spoilers for people in America". Spoilers are Spoilers, if you haven't seen the whole thing then you can expect spoilers. If there were "degrees of spoiler tags" or something like that I'd gladly use them. (Darien Shields 12:11, 6 September 2005 (UTC))

Character names

Like it or not, my speelings are on the official Sony website, as seen in http://www.sonymusic.co.jp/Animation/hagaren/chara/nash01.jpg, http://www.sonymusic.co.jp/Animation/hagaren/chara/mugear01.jpg, http://www.sonymusic.co.jp/Animation/hagaren/chara/dol01.jpg, and http://www.sonymusic.co.jp/Animation/hagaren/chara/roa01.jpg . I see no reason to take other spellings as official unless a equally official source is provided. Fan translations don't count. 65.29.167.251 03:09, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

There are four sources higher in priority (for lack of a better word) than Sony's Aniplex website: the manga creator Hiromu Arakawa herself, the animation studio BONES, Arakawa's original manga, and the actual anime DVDs that Sony's Aniplex has released in Japan. -Egan Loo 07:39, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Fortunately, Aniplex's anime DVDs and website differ on character name spellings on only a few instances: Aniplex's anime DVDs lists Russell Tringum instead of "Tlingum" and Mugwar instead of "Mugear." Tringum with a "l" is a classic Japanese/Romaji r/l issue, and Mugwar's Japanese pronunciation is "Maguwaaru." (If you're wondering how Mugwar got mispelled as "Mugear," look at the layout of a QWERTY keyboard.) -Egan Loo 07:39, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I can accept that. Good edits, by the way. 65.29.167.251 02:27, 15 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Thanks, and I'm glad to help out. The good news for us is that Hiromu Arakawa, BONES, and Aniplex actively consulted each other not only on the names and terms, but the specific way that they should be written in Roman characters. That's why there is remarkable consistency between the name spellings of the manga, the anime, and related merchandising and websites (aside from the two exceptions above). -Egan Loo 04:41, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

It makes sense that they would consult each other on the topics of romanji and pronunciation. Did you notice that in episode 26, Roy pronounces General Hakuro's name as "Ha/koo/ro" and not "Ha(stress on the "Ha")/ku/ro". Maybe I'm the onnly one who noticed that, but, That might be something that the English voice actors could work on. I mean, I understand that everyone is represented as German (or they all have some correlation to Germany), but Hakuro is one of the only Japanese names in the anime and manga. Another question, isn't "Hagane" also liscensed by FUNimation Studios as well?

Egan Loo... About Mugwar and Tringum... Any time they spell it as "Tlingum" in English versions is probably a mistake, because words beginning with TL can't really be pronounced, and they clearly pronounce it with an R in the English version, even if the two letters are the same in Japanese. And in the English anime DVDs, they spell it Mugwar, but pronounce it Mugear... I think the "W" is a mistake, not the "E". --Wikivader 04:09, August 28, 2005 (UTC)

That's right — that was my point about Tringum--"Tlingum" is the accidental spelling used on Sony's Aniplex website, but Tringum is the spelling used on Sony's actual Aniplex DVDs. The Japanese pronunciation of Mugwar is "Maguwaaru." It's the "e" that's the mistake, not the original "w." Egan Loo 23:37, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

Anime vs. Manga

I am of the opinion that this article should primarily represent the anime version of the series, as that is the more commonly known, and make a second article for the manga version, in which we can outline the differences between the two. --ACDragonMaster 03:26, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

If the manga is the original source, then shouldn't the primary article be on the original source than the spin-offs? By putting the spin-off as the primary article, it definitely misleads casual readers into forming an erroneous opinion.

Good point. I'm just thinking of the fact that the anime seems to be better-known than the manga (at least in the US), and will probably stay that way, unless a lot of kids start actually reading and not just watching tv... --ACDragonMaster 03:55, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

If they start reading (I presume you mean they prefer watching TV than to go reading on information), is it wise to possibly give them misconceptions on which was the original source? It would be wiser to avoid such circumstances. Wikipedia is here to serve an objective and factual account of its entries.

Or do you mean the anime will be more popular than the manga? If the kids surfed to the Wiki article in which the history of the franchise is properly chronicled, they might buy into the other products and change the popularity balance. In any event, popularity shouldn't decide which is the original source.

Why don't you go take a look at "characters of fullmetal alchemist" where what your talking about has already been done. The differences beteween the Anime and Manga are so slight for the purposes of this page that doing another page for the Manga makes no sense.

Actually, there are some major plot deviations between the two. Not just in the nature of the characters, but the existance of entire regions, such as Xing and Xerxes. --ACDragonMaster 02:11, 24 October 2005 (UTC)

{{spoiler}}

The character section

• The characters section of the article looks like it was based originally on this. Do we have the permission of the owner of that webpage to use that material?

• The character section of this article is so big, it makes the rest of the article hard too navigate. You should probably make a separate page entitled Characters of Fullmetal Alchemist and only put a short summary of the most important characters on the central article. This seems to be standard procedure for character sections that get too long. --Aknorals 09:36, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)

• • It's been done, though I'm shorting them as best as I can. Information on the Chimeras and Other Charatcers can be found on Characters of Fullmetal Alchemist.

• • • I've deleted large sections of the character section. It is my opinion that the section should serve as a introduction to newcomers, with the article going into the spoilers. Apostrophe 02:07, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Shouldn't Ed be listed as military, or at least not as non-military? That logic doesn't seem to follow as he does work for the military and it is stated in the character description.

68.200.81.62

It'd be nice if somebody would just talk to the guy to stop using ampersands and spreading false or unconfirmed information. 65.29.167.251 05:18, 5 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Miscellaneous

Ed's auto-mail

Doesn't Winry maintain Ed's arm _and_ leg?

---

Yes, she does.

---

• About Automail: (I might as well put this right here)... The article currently says that it is not known how automail is powered. However, the text booklet that comes with the first DVD suggests that automail is actually powered by alchemy... or that alchemy is used to create it. Not much is said about it, but if anyone can verify this information, it would be a good thing to add.
  • The exact quote from the text is: "The various characters in Fullmetal Alchemist practice several different types of alchemy, and it has also been used to give birth to both grotesque living creatures known as chimeras, and animated armor called 'Automail.'"
    Doesn't really say how it's powered.

I'd be incline to say that alchemy may not be the sole source of power for automail. Winry's dog has an automail leg and the dog most likely knows nothing of alchemy.

TomStar81 17:43, 25 May 2005 (UTC)

• Well, theoretically and logically if alchemy is powered using alchemic energy which stems from each person's inner gate then that same alchemic energy can be used to power the automail. In today's everyday prostetics, limbs are powered by amplifying the existing energy in the body left over by the nerves. The same is true with automail as it is also derived from the small current emitted by the nerves. Through the use of integrated circuits and motors, prostetics are made a bit bulky and less powerfull because of the materials used. So in anyway, to achieve such automail performance, the automail's basic components must logically be derived from alchemy for better effeciency.

I believe this, in effect is used to amplify the signals of the connective tissue to the automail much like ed's pocket watch amplifies his alchemic energy (although he really doesn't need it). Anything that has a soul has an inner gate as seen when the priest forges the revival of Roze's boyfriend in the second episode of the anime by using the souls of birds.

so in theory, the same principle may be used to amplify the voltage of a person's nerves into the automail much like a strong magnetic field can amplify voltage in an electrical circuit. (motors rely mostly on voltage rather than amperage anyway) Whether or not the user of the automail is aware that alchemy is the source of their mobility is not important. What is important is that it uses the power of the person's or animal's soul (later realized to be the inner gate).

all in all... don't take it too seriously. It's a show, and doesn't al move on his own regardless of automail and motors and such? just pure alchemic power.

It kind amakes you think if that was the real reason winry wanted to take apart Ed's state alchemist watch. (probably not)

--Automail 18:41, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Rumors

I believe whoever added the majority of information to the Fullmetal Alchemist article is probably acting on his or her rumors or theories. First of all, since when did Lust ever turn back to being human? She was last sealed by Wrath when I watched FMA. Second, Dante-Lyla really considered wanting Rose for a new vessel, and Ed as a lover? Those seem like theories to me. Can somebody check into this, and make some edits that are based on something factual?

No these are specifically mentioned in the anime, or at least most of them are. 1)No, Lust does not actually turn into a human, but she seems to see the truth of what's going on and sort of helps Ed out in her final moments. 2)Yes, Dante did want to transfer to Rose's body from Lyla's once the philosopher's stone was complete. And although I got no hint of this in the earlier episodes of the anime, Dante-Lyla does mention that Edward and Al "fell in love with Rose." WindWaker68 08:27, Feb 26, 2005 (UTC)

Actually, I was pretty confused when the subtitles mentioned that. I've never understood exactly why Dante referred to them that way. Ambush Commander 18:43, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

Perhaps she actually meant they would fall in love with her eventually, because she knew how both brothers were and could forsee it. Mistranslation, maybe?

Full Metal vs. Fullmetal

As things currently stand, Fullmetal Alchemist is a redirect to Full Metal Alchemist rather than the other way around. Both the article text and the official sources state the English translation as "Fullmetal" (one word). I'm going to swap them. - Korpios 02:27, 6 Jul 2004 (UTC)

but the show says the words as 2 seperate words, Full then Metal, i think in the title screen it is so as well. if im wrong then its cool.

Technically, the actual japanese title is "Hagane no Renkinjutsushi" and those words were made up specifically for the anime and manga. Translated, we get "Alchemist of Steel*", which could be used as "Fullmetal Alchemist." I agree that "Fullmetal" is one word and not two, but all of the English representations so far that I have seen are "Full Metal".

• The reason that it is "Alchemist" and not "Alchemy" is beacuse of the "-tsushi" at the end of "Rekinjutsushi". Please note that I am not completely fluent in Japanese, and this may just be my mistake, but I believe that this is true.--AmerinKanta 14:27, 12 May 2005 (UTC)

• • Close. "Hagane" (鋼) means steel, obviously. "Renkin" (錬金) is made-up of "ren" (錬), to forge or temper, and "kin" (金), gold. "Jutsu" (術) is an on-yomi suffix used in "the art" or "technique" of something. Thus, "renkinjutsu" is the native (kanji, non-katakana) Japanese translation of the European notion of "alchemy". The "shi" (師) denotes a practitioner of said alchemy, giving "alchemist". The "no" (の) in Japanese grammar modifies in pre-fix fashion, so the full translation of "Hagane no Renkinjutsushi" (鋼の錬金術師) is "Alchemist of Steel". Sorry for the geek-out. -Teapot 14:50 23 May 2005

Armstrong

q: Why is Armstong called "Colonel Clean" when he's a Major?

a: alliteration

Q: According to this wiki article, Armstrong's supposed to look like some mascot for a cleaning company, although I have never seen this in the anime. Can someone verify this? WindWaker68

A: He does kind of look like "Mr. Clean" though... --Nate3000 05:43, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Gluttony's Past

When was it established that Gluttony was created by Dante? Greyweather 12:17, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)

A: Actually we never really know for sure, it is just assumed. We really never learn anything about Gluttony's past throughout the entire show. WindWaker68

Technically, however, none of the homunculus (except for one, I'm not sure which, but I'm pretty sure at one point Dante attempted a human transmutation) where "Created" by Dante. Sloth was "Created" by Ed and Al, but Dante took her in and fed her the red stones. So the question really is irrelevant. Ambush Commander 16:17, Jan 2, 2005 (UTC)

That's incorrect. We know that she created Greed, and although no one knows how Pride was created, it is assumed to be her. WindWaker68

Then let me rephrase my argument. Certain homunculus can be certainly traced to certain creators. Greed was created by Dante, I stand corrected, and I also remember that Dante refers to Pride as one of her finest creations. However, my main point is that not all of the Homunculus were necessarily created by Dante. Therefore, we can't really make the generalization that Gluttony was created by Dante. Really, it doesn't make any sense that gluttony exists at all, since the situations that led up to his creation would be pretty bizarre O.o. When does it say in the series that Dante created him? Partly we have a deviation from the manga and anime arcs (and I'm only familiar with the anime arc), but the article seems pretty straightforward about it. You said that it was assumed to be her. Then shouldn't we rephrase that statement? Ambush Commander 03:43, Jan 4, 2005 (UTC)

Yes, you're absolutely right about Pride, I just remembered her saying that about her "finest creation." I never read any manga, just the anime is all I know about. When it all boils down, we really know absolutely nothing about Gluttony's past. But then again, Dante does know much about the homunculi, because she knew how to "dumbify" Gluttony in the last episodes. So out of all the alchemists in the show that we know about, Dante or Hohenheim are the two most likely to be Gluttony's creator. WindWaker68

But that's the entire point: Wikipedia is here to state what is pretty much indisputable in an NPOV manner. If we also allow speculation, even if it is pretty obvious, we shouldn't simply state it: we should make note that the creator of the series never really said anything about it. By the way, you should timestamp your posts. Four tildes ~~~~ should do the trick. Ambush Commander 21:52, Jan 12, 2005 (UTC)

It is apparent Gluttony's creator is unknown, but the show had revealed that Gluttony was created for the purpose of the refinement of the Philsopher's Stone, as he asborbs the BloodStones created from those he consumes until a perfected Stone is made. March 18, 2005

When?65.29.167.251 03:18, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC)

As I had seen in an spoilers summary, Dante was explaining this to Al{As her way of telling Al how he'll die} before she made Gluttony more ravenous & mindless so he can eat Al & fullfill his purpose as a living incubator for the refined Philosopher's Stone. 21 Mar 2005

A spoilers summary? It'd be preferable if you actually watched at least the subs.

Dante never said that Gluttony had the original purpose of being a incubator for the Philosopher's Stone. The show simply states that eating Al would have that effect. Having a effect does not mean it was the point of creating him. (And it was Envy who said this to Gluttony, not Dante to Al, before Gluttony has his mind removed.)65.29.167.251 03:20, 22 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Actually, it was said by Dante to Envy. Someone fluent in Japanese would be helpful, but as I'm not I'll quote Spoon's translation in episode 50 at about 10:20. Dante says, "After all, I did create him for the purpose of manufacturing the Red Stone." As fansubs shouldn't necessarily be taken as fact, I hope someone can translate that line themselves and clarify what is really said—verifying or disproving Spoon's translation. --Kamasutra 21:27, Jun 21, 2005 (UTC)

My sub has Dante saying "After all, Homunculi are created like the red stone, they don't need a mind." Envy says to Gluttony at 9:20 that "Inside of you, he'll become a perfect stone!" Apostrophe 6 July 2005 04:08 (UTC)

Yes, that is also in episode 50. I hoped that this issue was resolved already. However, the creator of Gluttony is still in question. Are there no Japanese speakers willing to translate the part I quoted at ~10:20? --Kamasutra 07:43, July 11, 2005 (UTC)

I dont think any of the humonculi were created on purpose since they're just failed attempts at human transmutation 151.196.53.99 21:18, 25 October 2005 (UTC)

Ampersand

I have seen many edits of this page where users have used the ampersand in place of the word "and." Please note that although ampersands do mean "and," it is generally used in formal titles, not the body of the text. --WindWaker68 20:12, Feb 20, 2005 (UTC)

Characters

I do appreciate all the contributions to the characters pages, but I'm beginning to see many characters I've never heard of before. Could someone that knows more about the manga and movie distinguish these characters from those that just appear in the anime? It would help clear things up a good deal for people that only watch the anime. --WindWaker68 00:22, Feb 28, 2005 (UTC)

• Actually, most of the profiles start with "Exclusive to ??????".

Export Character Information rather than Delete it

I recognize that User:Apostrophe's are good natured and will help cut down the really huge Character section in this article, however, I am a bit of an anti-deletionist: I would rather see good (as in verifiable, well written, comprehensive) content moved to a more relevant article rather than being cut because it makes for an excessively long article. Perhaps a Fullmetal Alchemist characters page is in order (like the MegaTokyo characters page). Ambush Commander 03:28, Apr 5, 2005 (UTC)

• Already happened in Characters of Fullmetal Alchemist, before Apostrophe did an overhaul ion the characters section.

• • The problem is, there are so many well intentioned Anon edits that have already been hashed over in the characters page: we'll end up having loads and loads of redundancy. I propose we cut down the characters section down to one/two sentences per character, rename it to Main Characters, and make the link to the Character's page much more prominent. Ambush Commander 18:25, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

Super Trimming of Character's Section

I have begun trimming the character's section here even further. I will be listing total omissions here (and justifying why that character should not be in the main article). I will parallel this development to the character's section in Megatokyo, which also enforces a one/two sentence rule on the main page character descriptions. This will hopefully cut down on redundant information. Please cite any disputes here.Ambush Commander 18:41, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

I agree with that direction. I'll be also using the list to explain why some characters are removed, if that is fine with you.Apostrophe 20:00, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Oh, and I am going to make the character article have the same structure as the Megatokyo, this will be make it easier to link to specific characters.Apostrophe 20:11, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)

That's fine. Adding the comment is a good idea, and so is the reformatting of the Character page. I'll start linking to that page from here too. At this point, all we're doing is cutting down on the descriptions, but at some point maybe we should consider rewriting them to portray the most important aspects of each character. Ambush Commander 20:40, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

Ah, it looks like you've already done the linking. Good job. Ambush Commander 20:42, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)

-Hohenheim should be included. He is a very major charicter, without which most of the series would probably never have happened. It is because of him that the Elric's mother died, and if that didn't happen, Ed and Al be doing other things.--Nate3000 06:15, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Maybe you missed the train of thought. The character page is for details and spoilers. Anything about Hohenheim goes into too much detail for the causal reader. He didn't kill Trisha, either, unless you're talking about the manga, of which I have no knowledge of. Apostrophe 01:08, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Removed Characters

• Honhenheim of Light - He doesn't appear in the series until far later, and for a casual reader, the mention of his existence is not necessary. If we must have him in the main article, we should simply call him the "missing father of the Elric's"

See what I wrote above ;-) --Nate3000 22:48, 8 May 2005 (UTC)

Hohenheim, while not seen until later, has his name mentioned as early as episode 3. His existence and name therefore have no reason to be omitted. --ChronoNuriko 00:52, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I meant to see what I wrote, which is quite contrary to Hohenheim being omitted. Sorry for the confusion! --Nate3000 10:56, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Jean Havoc - Very minor character, even though he does have his moments, not notable enough to be included on the main page. The manga may have given him a higher role, however, so someone confirm please.

Jean Havoc does indeed have a larger role in the manga. As do all of Mustang's men really (Though Havoc's is especially amplified). --ChronoNuriko 00:52, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Lieutenant Heymans Breda - Another minor character
• Greed - Doesn't appear until the 20th episode or so. Not needed for causal readers.
• Wrath - The identity of Wrath in both the anime and manga is a large spoiler. Does not appear until around 25th episode. Not needed for causal readers.
• Sloth - Again, massive spoiler. Same as above.
• Pride - Again, massive spoiler. Same as above.

Hence the existence of the spoiler tag. They're major characters in the series, I personally see no reason to omit them, wikipedia is for information afterall. --ChronoNuriko 00:52, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Yes, that's why we have a character page. Did you guys miss the memo or what? Apostrophe 01:08, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• • Rose is a main character in the anime and not in the manga. Explaining why is an unnecessary spoiler to anyone who has not seen the entire anime.

Models for Alphonse?

In Steamboy, there's the armored enemies. Are they the models for Alphonse in metal?

More to the point, how does this even matter? The answer is no, btw. Tjstrf

It'd be preferable if the anime/manga differences were more seperated...

Considering how drastically different the two are. The current layout is rather unorganized and heavily based on the anime -- and while there are a few 'In the manga...' points, they are greatly underdeveloped and overshadowed by the anime details. Furthermore, while manga and game details are stated as such, nearly all information of the anime is stated as a generalization -- so less informed readers would be lead to believe that such is an aspect of all three mediums, rather than just the anime.

Perhaps making two giant sections -- one for the anime and one for the manga -- would be preferable? Or at least seperate each section now (story, characters, etc) into two...granted the article already is long and needs plenty of trimming, not additional information.

Hrm, maybe it'd be best if Fullmetal Alchemist was disambiguated into (Manga), (Anime), and (Games)? It'd make things a lot more organized and cut down on the article size.

--

I agree, though the first suggestion (making 2 giant sections) seems more practical. It's less messy, and besides there are many characters in the anime which do not exist in the manga and vice versa. Even familiar characters are depicted differently, and the Homunculi (esp. the later ones) are different. For example, in the anime, King Bradley is Pride, while in the manga, he is Wrath.

• I also agree. The need to end the anime early led to an almost completely different story branching. Also, even if the anime is more complete (due to its main story having already ended) and more well known, isn't the manga considered the absolute canon? In that case, a combined article should reflect this, prioritizing the manga over tha anime. This is especially true of the homunculi, where the anime has a huge cluttered mess, but the manga is relatively clear. A seperate page for the game might be useful as well.

Written by Tjstrf

I agree with the top suggestions, except that I don't think that the manga should be emphasized over the manga, per se. I think there should bew a disambiguation page separating manga, anime, and games, as stated above, for the main article (Fullmetal Alchemist). In addition, since character pages are usually split from the main articles in Wikipedia, the anime and the manga should each have their own article pages. So, there'd be 5+ articles: disambiguation, manga, manga characters, anime, anime characters, and the games.

This is an interesting suggestion, but I don't think we have enough information on the Manga. If you wish, be bold, but be educated. — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 20:24, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

Well... Unless we're going to be posting lots of details and spoilers about the later storyline (which I am against), then I don't think we really need to have two huge sections/pages for the two versions of the storyline. Both the anime and the manga have the same basic storyline and concepts in the beginning. Simply saying how Ed lost his limbs, and why he's looking for the Philosopher's stone, should be enough for a short storyline summary, and covers the anime and the manga. If you want separate storyline pages to post all the spoilers on (like the suggested separate character pages where character-related spoilers are supposed to go), then we can separate anime storyline from the manga. --69.141.141.174 21:16, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Personally I would suggest that the main article under "Fullmetal Alchemist" cover primarily the anime and mention the games, and that a second article "Fullmetal Alchemist (manga)" should be made, considering 1) how drastically the plot has diverged and continued to diverge and 2) that the manga *is* licensed and being released in English now and therefore people are going to be curious about the differences. The games I don't think really warrent their own section as they're side stories, and thoguh the main article is also probably the best place for them for a casual reader, it should be noted that they generally are more based in manga canon than anime.

I disagree. By putting the manga under a "FMA (manga)" title while letting the anime stand under "FMA", it will be giving the impression that the anime is the original source which is a lie. We are here to give the correct impression of facts. Either:-

• let the "Fullmetal Alchemist" entry be a general overview of the franchise ( with "FMA-anime", "FMA-manga", and such as sub-entries with their own pages), or
• let the "Fullmetal Alchemist" entry be about the manga and have the anime be classified under "FMA (anime)".

--165.21.154.114 23:32, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Ishbal, Locations

I've come in in the middle of the series, so I don't know what Ishbal is. From the context it sounds like a location. I think adding a locations section would be helpful. --Tydaj 04:40, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Ishbal (also called Ishvar in the manga) is to the right of Amestris. Technically, it is a desert that was formerly called Ishbal. My friend drew a map for me, but I can't remember all of the details. Here is what I do remember.

      Drachma 
        |
Creda--Amestris--Desert(formerly Ishbal)--Xing
        |
       Aerugo

This can be verified on http://www.fullmetal-alchemist.com/facts.php

Exact web page, if errors, go to home page and click on Factbook. --AmerinKanta 14:27, 12 May 2005 (UTC)

Fixed the chart so it works. — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 19:51, August 16, 2005 (UTC)

Mentioned only in the manga, there's also the ruins of Xerxes east of Amestris. --134.129.62.186 18:51, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Anime credits?

Err. Wouldn't this place need director/producer/etc credits for the anime? I know that the manga's Arakawa's, but nevertheless.... (I know GitS:SAC mentions Kamiyama in its opening paragraph.) Kawa 02:21, 18 July 2005 (UTC)

I say be bold. — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 20:25, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

Equivalent Exchange redlink?

I wish I knew more about this series - I'd love to see someone make that red linked article Equivalent Exchange into something amazing; things about its relationship to conservation of mass and other conservation laws, how it's used in FMA's alchemy and philosophy, human transmutation, the Philosopher's Stone...but as a matter of course, I don't know nearly enough to start the article. Help? Kawa 02:04, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

From based on what User:Freedman and User:Seishirou Sakurazuka wrote, I expanded Equivalent Exchange out a little further. It is still a stub, but I hope the article can be further critiqued, edited, and expanded upon. Hope that sparks a little bit of thought and ideas for it. --Xavier Valentine 23:49, 25 July 2005 (UTC)

Opening and Ending Themes

Before anyone else changes it, the fourth and final opening to Fullmetal Alchemist IS Rewrite. Haruka Kanata (Far Off Distance) was the second opening theme for Naruto. Both were done by the same band- Asian Kung-fu Generation. Michuru 17:45, August 1, 2005 (UTC)

Short Bio for Edward Elric.

Okay, here's what we want:

• Three sentences
• Concise and pithy
• No spoilers

We have to have these facts. (!) means definitely, (?) means questionable, and remember, this is all my opinion

• Fullmetal Alchemist (!)
• Automail (!)
  • Origins (?)
• State Alchemist
• Do alchemy without Transmutation Circle
• Shortness (!)
• Pocket Watch (?) (I really think we should get rid of this block)

Since it's going to be so short, we should decide on a good version and then keep it stable. I'll give a version and we can critique it.

Edward Elric - Fullmetal Alchemist's main protagonist: he is the Fullmetal Alchemist. Edward has a prosthetic automail arm and leg and is known for being the youngest State Alchemist. He is sensitive about his height, and flies into a rage when people call him "short" or "chibi".

If no one comments, I will be bold and replace the current description with this short one. In addition, after we finish doing this, I propose cutting down the section to:

Main article: Characters of Fullmetal Alchemist

And add the instructions to not add stuff to this section as "Comments" <!-- This is a comment --> for only editors to see. I'll do Al's entry later, lets take this one step at a time. — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 20:36, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

I'd put "shortness" as a (?) myself; it's closer to a running gag than a vital part of his personality. Nifboy 21:07, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Edward Elric - Fullmetal Alchemist's main protagonist: Edward Elric is the Fullmetal Alchemist. Edward has a prosthetic automail arm and leg, is short, and is known for being the youngest State Alchemist.

How about that? — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 01:14, August 16, 2005 (UTC)

Short Bio for Alphonse Elric

• Younger brother
• Soul trapped in large suit of armor
  • Can have body parts removed (?)
  • Mistaken as older and as the fullmetal alchemist. (?)
• Calm and rational, foil to Ed, who is often impulsive

Alphonse Elric - Alphonse, often nicknamed Al, is Fullmetal Alchemist's secondary protagonist; he is Edward's younger brother. For most of the series, his soul is trapped in a large suit of armor. Alphonse is the calmer of the two, and can be seen as a foil to Edward's character.

— Ambush Commander^(Talk) 01:14, August 16, 2005 (UTC)

Short Bio for Winry Rockbell

• Childhood friend of Edward and Al (?)
• "Gearhead" + highly skilled technician (probably reword it)
• Lives with grandmother (?)
• Helped grandmother build Edward's automail and helps maintain it
• Owns dog with automail leg (?)
• Also known as Winly

Winry Rockbell — Winry, also translated as Winly, is a mechanical expert who was a childhood friend of the Elrics. She, along with her grandmother, built Edward's automail, and she also helps maintain the automail when it gets broken.

— Ambush Commander^(Talk) 19:50, August 16, 2005 (UTC)

IP 24.2.15.107 suggested that we add a note about translation: "(But in Japanese the "l" sounds like an "r" when written out in English)". Let's see...

Winry Rockbell — Winry, also translated as Winly (both pronounced wɪnɹi), is a mechanical expert who was a childhood friend of the Elrics. She, along with her grandmother, built Edward's automail, and she also helps maintain the automail when it gets broken.

— Ambush Commander^(Talk) 02:10, August 26, 2005 (UTC)

Clean-Up

As much as I hate to admit it (and I can't believe I have to say this about my precious FMA), this page and its connecting pages are in need of some serious clean-up. Apparently the extremely high traffic this page receives is responsible for several nonsensical, poorly phrased, grammatically inaccurate, or just plain incorrect edits. Please assist us in trying to improve this page by removing edits that detract from the article and by adding additional edits to make this article one of the best ever. Thank you. Kakashi-sensei 05:02, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

-> the story description needs to be replaced. Its way too long and it often reads like a partial episode guide.

This is one of things about wikis and anonymous editing: the quality of writing tends to rot, while the amount of information goes up. We'll work on it, but refactoring text is very hard. — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 13:08, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

... Okay. This is ridiculous. The storyline description was once a short introduction to the series.. Now, it's a full, detailed summary, up to Episode 7. Why? I really think we should change it back. It's completely unnecessary, and unless we're going to have a summary of the whole series on this page, there's no reason to post spoilers up to the seventh episode.
(EDIT): Couldn't we just have a separate page for the full FMA storyline summary? I still don't think it's necessary anyway, but at least if we put it on a separate page, the main FMA page wouldn't be packed with major spoilers. That is the reason they made a separate page for characters, you know... --Wikivader 05:32, 16 October 2005 (UTC)

The main page gets filled up with spoilers because everyone who sees it wants to add some special they know to it. I dont think there is any way to stop that other than to keep editing them back out. The storyline summary is horrible, but its lots better (and less spoiler filled) than it used to be. I think if its removed (and a storyline page is added), it will just start growing back again. And if you add a storyline page, its probably going to turn into an episode guide. ---

Why not. They did it for Harry Potter. We'll have somewhere to direct people. — Ambush Commander^(Talk) 19:02, 18 October 2005 (UTC)