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Did you know nomination

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Schwede66 talk 02:53, 24 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Created by RodRabelo7 (talk). Self-nominated at 20:01, 21 December 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Grandfather Indian; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.[reply]

  • Comment: As Kerouac and many others professed, "first thought, best thought". Your first hook is your best so far, but too long. Add an ALT3 that trims it, perhaps something like "... that Grandpa Indian, a version of Santa Claus in Brazil, brought gifts to children in a suit of colorful bird feathers?" (119 characters) Maybe play around with different, shorter permutations until you find one you like. Viriditas (talk) 21:51, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • From the end of World War I and the Week of Modern Art in 1922, Brazil witnessed the emergence of various nationalist cultural movements with diverse trends This sentence is unclear. Do you mean to just say "From late 1918 to early 1922"? Reading the article, it looks like you really mean just from around 1922. Viriditas (talk) 23:33, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • He stated that the belief in Santa Claus awakened, from a very young age, "the spirit of subservience and imitation". On 11 February 1933, in the O Malho magazine, the art of Euclides da Fonseca was featured as the winning poster. It's clear that you know what these things mean, but I don't think it's clear for readers. Can you prompt readers as to what "the spirit of subservience and imitation" refers to, very briefly, and tell us why the art of da Fonseca is important here? Viriditas (talk) 23:48, 21 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
New enough, long enough, sourced, no plagiarism detected. Hooks do not exceed 200 characters, cited in the article, interesting. Sources are in Portuguese so I am AGF'ing them. QPQ not needed because nominator has less than 5 noms. This is approved, I recommend (in order of preference) ALT0, ALT3, or ALT4. Recommend that this runs on Christmas Day. Z1720 (talk) 14:32, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Move

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Article's name should be moved to "Grandpa Indian" or "Indian Grandpa". If the intention is to translate "Vovô Índio" into English this is a better translation than "Grandfather Indian". Perhaps the word "Indian" itself should give way to a different one, as not to confuse readers for the people of India the country. Torimem (talk) 13:45, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Good points, but I don’t think there is any confusion, as the archaic form of "Indian" (I know, it’s unfortunate) is well known to English speakers. While I sympathize with your concerns, I think the current title is good. Of course, if you have English-language sources showing otherwise for this specific topic, please show them. I’m open to new titles, I just don’t want to see constant page moves so perhaps propose a requested move? Viriditas (talk) 19:10, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The word "vovô" means grandpa. Grandfather would be "avô". Hence my proposal. But since I'm not sure about the word order ("Grandpa Indian" or "Indian Grandpa"), I thought it would be better to discuss it here first. Torimem (talk) 19:37, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
 Comment: The only source I have found with an English translation gives us exactly Grandfather Indian (see third paragraph). You can find it on Library Genesis. Particularly, as a native Portuguese speaker, I do not object moving the article to Grandpa Indian. RodRabelo7 (talk) 19:46, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Torimem and @Viriditas, this source uses Grandpa Indian, but I am unsure about its reliability. RodRabelo7 (talk) 19:54, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
If the both of you prefer Grandpa Indian, I have no objection to a move. Viriditas (talk) 20:01, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
There is also a likely reliable source that uses Indian Grandpa. Using índio as an adjective in Portuguese seems a little bit dated, that is why I prefer Grandpa Indian instead of Indian Grandpa… RodRabelo7 (talk) 20:16, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Grandpa Indian then. Does this word order sound natural in English? If so, then I'm fine with it. Torimem (talk) 20:18, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, it sounds natural to me. It also has more of a comforting, informal sound when it is ordered this way, resembling in some respects the familiar sound of "Santa Claus". On the other hand, "Indian Grandpa" doesn't do it in English, and makes it sound too formal and distant. Viriditas (talk) 20:22, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that it sounds dated, which is why Grandpa Indian sounds good. Viriditas (talk) 20:18, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
 Done. Should I also move the DYK nomination page? I’m afraid I don’t feel 100% confident to do it. RodRabelo7 (talk) 21:02, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Glad you asked. I was wondering the same thing. Viriditas (talk) 21:19, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]