|
Change it to singular. Due to Royal Households in the UK not being a real thing. Ⓩⓟⓟⓘⓧ (talk) 19:02, 23 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- 1. I don't know if there were actually any merged previous pages, either extant and still available for view and to read, or at all, but I am quite convinced that there are no such thing as "[the] Royal Households (in the plural) of the United Kingdom", so-called, as such, but only "[the] Royal Household (in the singular) of the United Kingdom". "[The] Royal Household (in the singular) of the United Kingdom" would probably be, only, the private and personal Household of [HM] Queen Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom, in right of the United Kingdom, [and] in the United Kingdom, informally (but usually) simply called "Buckingham Palace", after the Palace of the same name. [1]
- 2. As long as the Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, is and remains married to [HM] Queen Elizabeth II, there is and can be of course NO separate "Household of [The] Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh", so-called, as such, I don't think! I don't think that, that it is actually possible to have two separate households for man and wife married to each other, do you, User:Miesianiacal, do you think?!
- 3. Anyway, the Private Secretary to the Duke of Edinburgh, and the Treasurer to the Duke of Edinburgh (position vacant), do not by themselves constitute a separate Household for the Duke of Edinburgh as such, I don't think! The Equerries are of course never actually part of any Household but those of their spouses (and usually their own wives), I would think!
- 4. There are definitely no distinct, separate "Duchy of Edinburgh", as such, so-called, for the Duke and Dukedom of Edinburgh.
- 6. There are not in fact a "Household of the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall", as such, so-called. There however exists "The Office of [HRH] The Prince of Wales and [HRH] The Duchess of Cornwall", which are actually an unofficial, informal name used by Prince Charles, or, Charles, Prince of Wales (HRH The Prince of Wales) (informally called "Clarence House", after the Palace of the same name), as a individual natural person, or as some sort of an unincorporated corporation sole. [3]
- 8. There are no "Household of Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge and His Royal Highness Prince Henry of Wales", as such, so-called, conjoined, distinct from Clarence House. [6][7]
- 9. There are no "Household of [HRH] The Duke of York, KG", as such, so-called, distinct from the Royal Household (Buckingham Palace). [8]
- 10. I would also think that the other so-called "Households", for other members of the immediate and extended British Royal Family, are also more likely either all part of some sort of a single hoax, or of a multitude of different hoaxes one on top of the other; or, at the very least, some very gross misunderstanding indeed. I think that, really, only the Queen calls her own "retinue" a "Household", possibly because only the Queen is allowed (or at least is supposed) to do that, to do so, either by custom and tradition, or by law. -- Urquhartnite (talk) 16:12, 13 November 2015 (UTC) -- Urquhartnite (talk) 02:35, 14 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment I found that very long and difficult to read, so I am not sure how much of a response you are going to get from other editors through the RFC process. There is no previous discussion about any of these issues (or anything as this is the first comment on the talk page) so it seems a bit premature to jump to a RFC. It was a merge done by DBD in 2008[9]. Probably from these which are currently redirects. BTW I would strongly suggest removing point 11 as that is a clear personal attack and a bunch of inappropriate speculation that will in no way improve this article. AIRcorn (talk) 23:56, 13 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- Or so it was claimed 7 years ago. But where are the old pre-merger originals? And can we see them? And if not, why not?! Well, anyway, the problem is, pretty much everyone in England or England and Wales, if not the entire United Kingdom, British Islands (The UK and Islands (The Isle of Man, Jersey and Guernsey, and the other Islands of the Bailiwick of Guernsey)) and "British" Isles (The UK and Ireland), would have only heard of "the Royal Household", in one, or, in the singular; and that most of them (at least the British ones in England, Wales and Scotland) would probably also (probably because mainly of Duchy Originals, The Prince's Trust and the Duke of Edinburgh's Awards) realise, that the "Royal" prefix is (usually) specifically and specially reserved for things and matters specifically and specially connected directly and personally with [HM] Queen Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom, in right of the United Kingdom, or some other former reigning and sovereign English, Scottish or British King or Queen, and not (not usually) other members of the reigning sovereign's family. Or, in other words, this is an highly, extremely or exceedingly implausible (unlikely) mistake, a misunderstanding which might perhaps fool and deceive non-British foreigners, perhaps even for years and years, but not most educated or even half-educated Britons (Brits)—it would be the British equivalent of inserting a baseless, unproven if not a false middle name for one of the dead, or late former Presidents of the United States of America, and then being left undiscovered for the next 7 years. I am certainly not entirely convinced that some of the edits were in fact made in good faith, not at all; but I would nevertheless like to give a right to reply and hear an explanation or two, before I actually start accusing any editor of creating a hoax or hoaxes by name. -- Urquhartnite (talk) 02:35, 14 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- Charles' and William's offices are definitely called the Household of [10] If the complaint is that households other than Elizabeth's don't have the prefix 'Royal', then fine, move the page: Households of the British Royal Family. As for personal attacks, Urquhartnite you may wish to look up ad hominem — I happen to be a dedicated and experienced editor of more than ten years' standing. I would have thought that fellow-users might have been able to assume some level of detached-ness. (Anyway, as it happens, my republican convictions post-date 2008 by some time.) You are certainly correct that this article could be improved — there could be more prose, less list and many more citations, but some of your basic premises are flawed: for instance the notion that domain registrations being in The Household's name proves that the other Households don't exist. I propose that we ask some third parties to thoroughly review, source and edit the article. DBD 09:56, 14 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- The Duke of Edinburgh does have his own household; see for example entry Z6042941 on the Register of data controllers maintained by the Information Commissioner's Office. It is startlingly disrespectful to suggest that he has no need of a household or is barred from maintaining one, let alone that his household is a hoax. The Households of the members of the royal family are referred to collectively as the Royal Households, though the need to do so is rare; see for example DEFRA's Royal Households Secondments or the Herald's Press teams of royal households to merge as Prince steps up his duties. NebY (talk) 19:30, 15 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks, NebY. The Register of data controllers is certainly a very helpful resource. With only a little searching, we find the Households of:
DBD 10:03, 16 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- Also, you can look at the pre-merger page histories (I found them by looking in my contribs for the date this page was created in 2008): [11] [12] [13] [14] [15] [16] (Their originators were Craigy144 {QEQM} and Ncox {the rest}, and significant contributors have included Choess, Icairns, DrKay, Ila1519, Gareth E Kegg, Takvaal, Barabbas1312, Textorus, 71.30.210.143, 173.191.38.233) DBD 23:24, 16 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- "Royal Households support Members of the Royal Family in their official and private lives. Households primarily comprise Office and support functions, and where a Household is based is not necessarily where the Member of the Royal Family lives....The other Royal Households [in addition to The Household of His Royal Highness Prince William of Wales and His Royal Highness Prince Henry of Wales] currently are [in January 2009]: Household of The Queen; Household of The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh; Household of The Prince of Wales and The Duchess of Cornwall; Household of The Duke of York; Household of The Earl and Countess of Wessex; Household of The Princess Royal; Household of The Duke and Duchess of Gloucester; Household of The Duke of Kent; Household of Prince and Princess Michael of Kent; Household of Princess Alexandra, the Hon. Lady Ogilvy. In terms of precedence, the Household of Prince William and Prince Harry will fall between the Household of The Prince of Wales and The Duchess of Cornwall and the Household of The Duke of York." The website of the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall, who should know.[17]
- Does Urquhartnite or anyone else have anything else to say? Or shall we wrap this up? DBD 14:53, 19 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- Actually, I've just seen he's blocked, so won't be replying. Anyone else? DBD 14:55, 19 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
- There may be more households than one, but just one of them is "The" (remember what that definite article is about?) Royal one. Gerard von Hebel (talk) 03:44, 14 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]
|
.svg){kind=small}