User talk:Cool Hand Luke/Archive1

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Archive1–through Nov 11, 2004
Archive2–Jan 5, 2005
Archive3–Dec 1, 2006
Archive 4–Apr 13, 2007
Archive 5–Sep 19, 2007
Archive 6–Jan 27, 2008
Archive 7–May 22, 2008
Archive 8–Dec 15, 2008
Archive 9–Mar 30, 2009
Archive 10–Oct 7, 2009
Archive 11–Oct 4, 2010
Archive 12–Sep 18, 2014

Hello! Welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your fine work in Dead Milkmen, Music of Utah, and September Six. Judging from the work you've done, it seems that your fortes are in American history and music; you can find plenty of articles in need of help in these fields or others at Wikipedia:Pages needing attention.

You might find these links helpful in starting new articles or helping with existing ones: How to edit a page, How to write a great article, Naming conventions, Manual of Style. You should read our policies at some point too.

If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump, or ask me on my talk page.

  • You can sign your name on talk pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. If you use four, you can add a datestamp too.
  • If you ever think a page or image should be deleted, please list it at the votes for deletion page. There is also a votes for undeletion page if you want to retrieve something that you think should not have been deleted.

Thank you for your contributions; I hope you continue to help us.

Also, I notice that you've been here for a while, about a week; apologies for the second salutation if another greeter's already gotten to you.

-- Djinn112 02:06, Feb 12, 2004 (UTC)

9/11 Rumors[edit]

Thanks for the great copyediting! Quadell 20:35, 20 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Canadian Candidate[edit]

Luke, i also think you did a pretty good edit, and i hope i did a pretty good job of polishing it. And i just hope my polishing is good enough for part of it to survive the next polishing. I'd describe the changes i made (which seem to have left you "sorry" for part of your good work) as bold, and hopefully well-informed, guesswork. We'll have a better & better evaluation of our individual and collaborative attempts, later. Much later.

BTW, i can already hear you beating yourself up about saying he graduated before going pro; don't, i don't know if i'd have been cautious enuf to avoid the same conclusion before poking around w/ Google: IMO, the campaign bio was designed to invite the false confusion. (If only bcz it's so confusing to talk about: even if he's proud of the way he managed to interleave those two big undertakings, he doesn't want to waste campaigning time on helping voters understand a small and confusing detail.) In fact, i almost just gave up on putting down a BS date, thinking at first it was probably just a typo. I seldom jump into Google in editing, and it's kind of dumb luck to come up with such an amusing factoid, instead of my getting suckered too.

Oh, you also mentioned the first-name refs. Look, you never met the professional proofreader that i met, who had to go show the publisher that she'd left a headline about a wedding or anniversary reading "The Tit that Binds"! Proofreading is an impossible job; WP does a tremendous job at it, by flooding the work with eyeballs. Get used to editing boldly, and almost *planning* on your colleagues cleaning up after you, without being embarrassed that they have the opportunity.

Keep up the good work.
--Jerzy(t) 06:01, 2004 Apr 24 (UTC)


A belated welcome. My wife and I both went to the U. My father's side of the family (Edgar & Paisley, know any?) is from around the Blackwell-Ponca City-Stillwater-Bartlesville grandfather worked for Conoco and was one of the first church branch presidents there a long long time ago. Do you have more of a continental or analytic philosophy bent? B 18:56, Apr 24, 2004 (UTC)

That's amazing. I lived in Bartlesville for one grade of High School. At the time I and hated it. I never once set foot in the Price Tower even though it's weird design caught my eye. My dad worked for an old missionary companion called Hanks pulling wells, but he wasn't a native Okie either. I don't remember many other people.
I do in fact favor continental philosophy, or at least dislike more empiracist/positivist traditions. Actually, I'm fond of the early moderns, especially rationalists. However, I also find the philosophy of George Berkeley very interesting. Attempts to reconcile idealism with QED intrigue me. My love is Ethics--especially applied ethics (as opposed to ethical theory)--even though it sometimes seems to be marginalized by many philosophers.
I graduate in December and plan on law school. CHL
Thanks for sharing. Continental?! I'm sooo, just kidding. who can't appreciate Descartes? I went into law after philosophy too...wish I had a better undergrad science background though. Good luck on the LSAT. B

Mormon articles list[edit]

Salt Lake Assembly Hall is a nice addition. If you start or find a new article related to Mormonism, please be sure to add it to the List of articles about Mormonism. Thanks. B|Talk 13:45, 31 May 2004 (UTC)

Utah Pictures[edit]

Hi Cool Hand Luke, lemme know what other pictures of Utah you'd like to have. Just check out my photo album page at Ruben's album and tell me what you want and I will add it to wikipedia. Bye, BigBen212 19:25, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I uploaded more pictures, a few of the capitol and one from downtown. I don't have a good one of the tabernacle though. Maybe after the next time in Salt Lake. BigBen212 05:12, 17 Jun 2004 (UTC)

More Pictures: CHL, can you please contact me outside wikipedia at BigBen212 (at) I have a few more pictures I could add to Wikipedia but I am not sure if anybody will need them. So if you can email me back, I could email you a link you can use to have a look at them. BigBen212 14:36, 26 Jun 2004 (UTC)


Hi CHL, thanks for your articles on those two mansions. Good to know what I took pictures of :).

Does the Edward D. Woodruff of the Woodruff-Riter-Stewart Home (finished 1906) have anything to do with LDS President Wilford Woodruff (1807-1889)? Is Edward probably Wilford's son or grandson even? Or is the name Woodruff a lot more common than I thought :).

If there is a connection between the two, it might be a nice addition to both articles.

Bye for now, BigBen212 21:55, 20 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Edward D. Woodruff was not a general authority, but I would have to do additional research to discover if he was related to Wilford Woodruff. I would not be surprised. For example, many people named "Young" are descendants of Brigham Young in Utah.

Wilford Woodruff had 33 children, and I imagine some would be about the right age to be the man the mansion is named for. Incidentally, our article on Wilford Woodruff is shockingly brief. I doesn't even mention the 1890 manifesto by name. So much work to do... CHL 18:29, 21 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Should Wikipedia be included on the list of purported cults??[edit]

Hello CoolHandLuke, please read this. Don't you think it is convincing? User:Andries/Wikipedia:controversy Andries 13:00, 25 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Don't discuss an article on the article itself[edit]

Hi! I noticed you are discussing the content of Rose Park (Salt Lake City) right in the article itself. The proper place for that is in the talk page. That is a much better place to discuss the article's contents, so please consider moving the discussion there. --Doradus 03:19, 7 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I realize that, but Rose Park was such an unusable mess, I didn't see the harm. In the future I'll just blank these, but I thought that might be insulting to the writer. CHL 06:15, 7 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Hi CHL[edit]

Thought I'd stop bye and say "hi"...seems we haunt some of the same places on the Wiki. Thanks for all the good work...We should comiserate some time ;-) --JonMoore 06:06, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Mike Storm and Talk:The Carpetbaggers[edit]

I'm well aware of this vote (and of a previous nomination). Both times I was terribly torn as to whether to comment. I feel that as someone involved in a dispute with him I probably shouldn't be voting. About six times I've started to add a comment to the Requests for Adminship discussion and each time decided just to let things ride. It seemed to me that adding the sort of negative comment I would add would be almost the same as entering an opposing vote.

I was really astonished that he cited Talk:The Carpetbaggers as an example of his conduct in a dispute and am frankly glad that somebody else looked at it. Several times I started to put in comments suggesting that people look at this page and then hit the cancel link. I believe your summary of the situation was a good one and I thank you for mentioning it. It is much more appropriate coming from a neutral third party.

I was quite annoyed by his early unwillingness to clarify what he saw as the problem, and by his later behavior in removing the NPOV notice, then reinserting it, then citing a reason that didn't seem to apply. I've wondered whether he was looking at an old browser cache of the page or something.

I was also annoyed that after I listed it on Request for Comment, he never engaged in the resulting discussion. Someone else removed the NPOV notice and a couple of people entered supportive remarks on the Talk page, but it was never clear whether Mike was acquiescing in the resolution or whether he just didn't have this on his watchlist, or whatever. I could have invited him to participate, but I decided not to. From his previous behavior, I didn't really want to call his attention to it. I figured that if the notice was removed, I was happy, and wouldn't try to find out whether Mike had noticed it.

Mike has indicated elsewhere that he is fourteen years old. I hadn't known that at the time I asked him whether he could see his way clear to removing the NPOV notice. Know that, and given the sexual frankness of the article (reflecting that of the book it describes), I actually feel quite uncomfortable about making specific requests for him to review the article.

He probably shouldn't be a sysop, because he does not show any indication of being able to understand opposing points of view; because he thinks his understanding of Wikipedia is deeper than it is; and because his own statements and his contributions suggest that he is more interested in adminstering Wikipedia than in writing articles. But it probably wouldn't be the end of the world if he became a sysop, and he might even rise to the occasion. So, it may be cowardly of me, but I'm perfectly happy to sit out this vote and let other people do the heavy lifting. I think the paragraph he wrote beginning "I am confident with Wikipedia policies" is pretty revealing. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 22:31, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)

P. S. Thanks for your complimentary remarks on the article. It would be going to far so say that I'm glad Mike goaded me into doing more on it, but it was actually a lot of fun to work on. Now if I could just figure out who Bernard Norman, Jennie Denton, David Wolff, and the producer-character-whose-name-I-forget who's David Wolff' uncle or something, resemble... [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 22:44, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Seems I've found someone who likes this city as much as I do. I had a friend from Phoenix, Arizona come visit me a month or so ago... He seems to hate Salt Lake...He was here for 3 days and didnt give it a chance...

On the other hand, he thinks Phoenix is great! To me it has all the appeal of an overbloated strip mall.

Heh, I'm going to be adding more details to the Nancy Workman article...soon, when I get time... Jon 00:49, 15 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Go ahead with the editing, they are from the timeline of a online book on columbia university, located here. You might want to even try to wikify them, but thats a massive task. -- Ctrl_build 21:02, 26 Sep 2004 (UTC).

I think we should give it a {{Undecided}} tag until we can sort everything out. From the looks of it, this is almost project worthy. Sadly, there are no templates explaining the continued invesigation of copyright validity. I am creating one called {{{unknowncopy}}}. Ctrl_build 21:25 26 Sep 2004 (UTC)


Thanks for your support. RickK 18:39, Sep 30, 2004 (UTC)

Grampa Bill's G.A. Pages[edit]

Thanks for all your help with the LDS stubs and Apostles sections. I just thought this page might help you -- it has profiles on all of the Apostles since the restoration. Uchtdorf and Bednar aren't under the Quorum of the Twelve, but they were both Seventys before a few days ago, so they're listed there. It hasn't been updated in a while, but it's pretty good stuff.

Grampa Bill's General Authority Pages

Of course, I don't mean to imply you'll be doing all the work. I'll contribute when I can and I'm sure the others will too. I just thought you might find that site helpful, if you didn't already know about it. ^___^.

I tried to contact Grampa Bill earlier with a request to use some of his material for the David Whitmer article. We need to be quite careful to follow the law as well as the Wikipedia copyright policy. I sure hope we can make contact with Grampa Bill. Maybe you will try also. Tom - Talk 04:25, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Mormonism WikiProject[edit]

Hi. I think you should make that Mormonism WikiProject when you have some time; nobody's objected to it and you probably won't get much more feedback without going to user talk pages. So I'm going to do that to you. I'd make it myself, but I don't think I'd be able to do it right. ^_^ Thank you dearly. Cookiecaper 19:48, 15 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Kudos on creating the Wikipedia:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement. It looks great! COGDEN 01:16, Oct 18, 2004 (UTC)

Vision of Salt Lake, and City and County Building[edit]

Hey CHL...Again, I want to thank you for all your great contributions to the Salt Lake City and other related pages! I just added an article about the Salt Lake City and County Building, which I noticed was on your to-do list! I also noticed you added that picture of it to the SLC main article, and was wondring if I could also add it to C&C buildin page...

Again, I really appreciate all of your work. I'm guessing you are Mormon, from your user page. I am not, but I think its great to have 2 people who represent the 50/50 split that exists here working so hard to represent our little part of the world. I think it brings balance. :)

Keep it up!

Jon, Conqueror of Men 19:23, 16 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Thanks for comments[edit]

Thanks for your comments about page movement and such. I'll look into the project you mentioned. Jgardner 20:02, 2004 Oct 18 (UTC)


Heh, thanks for the comments! I moved the SLC history to its own page History of Salt Lake City...I was getting a a message about not letting the article excede 32K when I saved a change. I'm not a huge sports fan either, so I guess we will either have to recruit some sports fans or do some research... Oh well...I also wanted to work on the Culture & Celebrations part of the article, and add more about the city's diversity and various cultural celebrations. Anyways, catch ya later -Jon, Conqueror of Men 21:38, 18 Oct 2004 (UTC)


Thank you very much for your vote for my adminship. I greatly appreciate your support. ffirehorse 00:16, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

O.P. Rockwell[edit]

No, I'm not a decendent of Rockwell. (referring to your comment) I was in the process of doing a research paper and after reading several sources, the Extermination Order page made it sound like it was an absolute fact that Rockwell had attempted to assassinate Governor Boggs.

About Luana Beebe, there is very little information (that I could find) about her in detail, although she is said to have had a large impact on Rockwell. She is also where many of Rockwell's decendents came from, or the majority of them, since he had two other wives. I really just made an article for her in hopes that someone who had some more information on her would add on to it.

I don't have any time to spare to help with any of the articles right now, though; I just wanted to point out something that didn't sound right to me.

Põtåtõ §ålå<ETH> 00:16, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

You're an admin![edit]

I'm pleased to let you know that, consensus being reached, you are now an administrator. Congratulations!. You should read the relevant policies and other pages linked to from the administrators' reading list before carrying out tasks like deletion, protection, banning users, and editing protected pages such as the Main Page. Most of what you do is easily reversible by other sysops, apart from page history merges and image deletion, so please be especially careful with those. You might find the new administrators' how-to guide helpful. Cheers! -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 01:00, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

The VfD songs[edit]

They were part of a group nomination, that I think was voted to transwiki, but apparently whoever acted on the vote forgot those two, so I am in the process of re-listing them. Thanks for bringing this oversight to my attention. Niteowlneils 18:26, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Thanks for finding the previous discussion--I couldn't remember which song title it was under--and yes, I have no problem keeping info about the songs. Niteowlneils 18:49, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)


Thanks for being kind and supportive to this newbie as I make my first mistakes here.

As to notability outside of Alberta politics, I'm also founder and global-coordinator of the Revolutionary Knitting Circle movement, founder and retired director of the Activist Network in Calgary, and co-author of RFC 2369. But, I think I'll hold off on trying for my own WP page until I'm the first elected Green in Canada ;-) (Fingers-crossed!)

GrantNeufeld 08:11, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)


"Lost" in what sense? What constitutes an "unresolved" VfD? Thanks for clearing this up. Though perhaps it's my own fault for starting at the bottom of VfD ;-) Chris 04:59, 31 Oct 2004 (UTC)

PS - it might be worth noting that when I see an article that failed VfD and is still there, I tag it with {{deletebecause|failed VfD}} with an appropriate link. Chris 05:03, 31 Oct 2004 (UTC)
I figure an alternative interpretation of "lost" is The result was 'delete', so the article lost at VfD. An interpretation of "unresolved" might be no consensus was reached on this article. Perhaps we needa category for "no consensus on VfD" , since the implicit keep means that people that genuinely want to keep an article don't often come forward when they see a few "keep" votes up.
I know people might refer to something as "orphaned" when it's been left on its own, so perhaps "widowed", i.e. missing its partner discussion on VfD? HTH Chris 07:28, 31 Oct 2004 (UTC)


I thought that was what had happened, so I made the null edit just to point out to anyone else looking that "I didn't do it."  :-) Thank you for the early welcome. About all I ever do here is damage control and basic housekeeping chores, so this just means I'll be more efficient. I was so shocked at being nominated that I left a silly sounding thank you on Sarge Baldy's talk page -- "unexpected surprise" can be sent to the Department of Redundancy Department. It really was unexpected. Thank you for the confirmation on what caused the odd edit history, and thank you again for the early welcome. Happy editing! SWAdair | Talk 09:43, 1 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Page move[edit]

You moved a talk page to a Vfd page. This is very unusual. 02:55, 2 Nov 2004 (UTC)

It had what seemed like a rationale for deleting (or redirecting) the {{vfd}}-tagged page. I decided to turn the page into a disambig instead of listing it on VfD it anyway, so just moved it back. Cool Hand Luke 08:12, 2 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Admin votes question[edit]

How are admin votes generally publicized? By Watchlist only? How, for example, did you happen to vote on what's up at the moment? Tom - Talk 23:13, 3 Nov 2004 (UTC)


Hey CHL...congrats on the Adminship! It's obvious you deserve it! I was perusing your Wikiproject on Mormonism, and it is quite well done. As we both know, Mormonism and Utah go hand in hand in hand, so I was wondering in your humble opinion where all the secular articles about the area fit (for example buildings, the city at large, neighborhoods, politics, etc)? I'm not too up on the requirements for a Wikiproject, but do you think that something like that would be useful for a general "Utah" or "Salt Lake Valley" project to coordinate this activity, or that it could fit into the grand scheme of your mormonism project? I would ask to be a part of the Mormonism Wikiproject, but alas, I am but only a Jew, and frankly am not well versed enough. I can handle the buildings...:-P

Frankly, it seems the SLC main article is becoming stagnant from an editing POV, and I'm not sure if this is because we've reached a saturation point, or not. I feel that I've said about all I can think of for the city in general. Maybe it's time to fill up all the dead links, (ie: the last few neighborhoods and all those wonderful buildings.) Like I have said before, we have a wonderful body of articles, and I don't want to see it go dead.

Anyway, I am rambling...keep up the good work!

Your comrade in WikiZion: [[User:JonMoore|JON, Conqueror of Men - (Talk to Me, Baby!)]] 04:46, 5 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Glad to hear you are doing well...I understand that school can get busy. I'm currently out of school, so I have more time on my hands. I've been doing some research for a few articles. I just added a first draft for Salt Lake City Public Library It needs some work...I'm trying to locate a copy of the new Utah Architecture magazine which has a feature on it. I'm also doing research for Downtown (Salt Lake City) which I think is probably important to have.
As for the main SLC article itself there are a few things I would like to work on, such expanding the culture section, with a bit about the city's diversity, as well as a section on common stereotypes about the area.
Anyway, Cheers [[User:JonMoore|JON, Conqueror of Men - (Talk to Me, Baby!)]] 20:37, 5 Nov 2004 (UTC)


Thank you for your reasonable and balanced reply on the Israeli_violence_against_Palestinian_children talk page. I wish there were more people with your perspective on Wikipedia. --Viriditas 05:02, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC)


I understand not all LDS are homophobes. This is a unique state, with unique demographics. It's nice to know there are those out there who can think for themselves and don't automatically tow the Church's line without at least thinking critically about it. I've met more than a few gay Mormon boys who are more than a little screwed up. It's sad, but the suicide rate for gay Mormons is something like 3 times the norm. Read an angry post I made to LiveJournal on Nov. 3 ;-)...

I do understand I'm on someone else's "turf" so to speak, but I chose to live here. This is a great city, with a fascinating history. It's not too big, but surely not small. The quality of life is great, and many fascinating things to do.

As per the previous discussion, yes, a Utah Wikiproject might be most desirable. We could have SLC as a subcategory of that.

Anyway, why are you still reading this? Shouldn't you be doing homework? Get at it! The world needs more lawyers!!! --[[User:JonMoore|JON, Conqueror of Men - (Talk to Me, Baby!)]] 06:18, 7 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Sorry about the Speedy insistence[edit]

Sorry I didn't just redirect the Utopian Fiction page. I guess I still have much to learn. --TheGrza 07:29, Nov 8, 2004 (UTC)

Counting a user's edits[edit]

Hi. How did you find out I had exactly 607 edits?

Thanks for the answer (on User_talk:P3d0#Counting edits). So it's just a binary search. Too bad... I already knew how to do that.
Hopefully, as an admin, I'd be able to cook up a database query that would give the answer more readily. --Doradus 19:49, Nov 8, 2004 (UTC)
Just by pure coincidence, I have found found this link that count's a user's edits. (This is Doradus (formerly P3d0)... I have started using a different name because of complaints about the old one.) --Patrick D 05:11, Nov 9, 2004 (UTC)