User talk:Oxspring66

December 2023

It is almost never suitable to copy content from another web site to Wikipedia, for more than one reason, the most important being copyright. When you post anything to Wikipedia you release it for anyone in the world to reuse it, either unchanged or modified in any way whatever, subject to attribution to Wikipedia. It is very rare that the owner of a web site licenses content for such very free reuse, and in those few occasions when they do so, we require proof of the fact. We don't assume that content is freely licensed on the unsubstantiated say so of just anyone who comes along and creates a Wikipedia account. JBW (talk) 16:19, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of User:Oxspring66

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. A tag has been placed on User:Oxspring66 requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section U5 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the page appears to consist of writings, information, discussions, or activities not closely related to Wikipedia's goals. Please note that Wikipedia is not a free web hosting service. Under the criteria for speedy deletion, such pages may be deleted at any time.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 08:02, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

Hello, I was under the impression that I was drafting up an article for a new topic in my personal sandbox, so was rather surprised to see that it had been deleted. Can you please explain how I create an article in my sandbox to ensure that nosey speed deletion freaks don't delete it before I have time to save my hard work? Oxspring66 (talk) 11:36, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

• Almost all of us, when we start editing Wikipedia, know little or nothing about Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, so nobody can be blamed for starting out doing things that are contrary to policies and guidelines that they don't know about. However, continuing to do the same things after being told about the relevant policies and guidelines is a different matter. If you continue to post copyright-infringing material, you may find that you are blocked from editing by an administrator. I also suggest that if you want help and advice from other editors, addressing them as "nosey speed deletion freaks" may not be a very effective way of encouraging them to help you. On the whole being civil to other editors, even if you don't think they deserve civility, is much more effective. JBW (talk) 22:19, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

  Hello JBW, thank you for your message, please could you explain what the things would be that break the relevant policies and guidelines? 92.4.98.18 (talk) 22:38, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

  I am unsure what I have posted which could be considered copyright-infringing material 92.4.98.18 (talk) 22:39, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

OK, I'll try to clarify things a little. Although you didn't copy large chunks of text word for word, there were several sentences which were sufficiently close to the original to make it clear that it was essentially copied. Minor changes in wording, such as replacing "It was initially formed to give the young people of Barnsley the opportunity..." with "The theatre was initially formed to give young people in Barnsley the opportunity..." are not enough. Roughly speaking, if someone seeing the two passages side by side will realise that one is derived from the other, they are too close. Something which is perhaps not made clear enough to new editors is that Wikipedia's copyright policy is actually more restrictive than copyright law in many countries, and essentially does not allow much benefit of any doubt. (For some reason Wikipedia's policy for images is much less restrictive, and allows use under what U.S. law calls "fair use", for which there is no equivalent in many legislatures, such as the U.K. Even there, though, there are very specific restrictions on the circumstances under which "fair use" can be applied.)

I have some more things to say which I hope may be helpful to you, but I don't have time now, so I will try to get back to you later. JBW (talk) 12:33, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

OK, here are some more comments, which, as I said, I hope may be helpful to you.

• As you can see above, your sandbox was nominated for speedy deletion by CAPTAIN RAJU, and it was then deleted by Fastily. Both of those are reliable and constructive editors, for whom I have respect, but this time I disagree with them. The speedy deletion criterion they used is intended for people who have no intention of contributing to the encyclopaedia, and are just here to use Wikipedia as a web host for a personal web page, or other material unrelated to work for Wikipedia, but that was evidently not so in your case. The page you created had all the appearance of being a draft for an article, not a personal web page, as is confirmed by your statement above "I was under the impression that I was drafting up an article for a new topic in my personal sandbox". That is a perfectly legitimate thing to do, and if only you had titled the page User:Oxspring66/sandbox, or better still Draft:Barnsley Youth Theatre, instead of User:Oxspring66, I doubt that it would have been deleted. In that situation, if it is felt that leaving it as a user page is unacceptable, renaming it (usually referred to as "moving" it) would be a better solution than deleting it.
• Having said that, I think it best to advise you against persisting with trying to create the article. Wikipedia does not seek to have articles about everything, but aims only to cover subjects which satisfy certain notability guidelines. Unfortunately, in my opinion there are far too many guidelines and policies on Wikipedia, and most of them are far too long and complex, which can make things confusing and intimidating for new editors, but the main point of the notability guidelines is known as the General notability guideline, and it is simply that to be suitable as the topic of a Wikipedia article, a subject has to have received substantial coverage in reliable independent published sources. An organisation's own web site or other publications do nothing to establish notability, as they are not independent of the organisation; a brief mention in a local newspaper or an announcement of a play to be performed is no help, as those are not substantial coverage; material posted to FaceBook, Twitter, Wikipedia, YouTube or anywhere else where anyone can post more or less anything is no help, as they are not reliable sources. I have searched for evidence that the Barnsley Youth Theatre satisfies Wikipedia's notability guidelines, and I'm afraid I found none. I therefore think that any further time and effort you may put into trying to create an article on the subject is likely to be fruitless, and to lead to disappointment and frustration, so my advice is not to pursue it. That is advice, not instruction, and you are free to take it or not, but it is based on many years of experience, and seeing what has happened to many new editors who come here enthusiastically, only to have their hopes dashed.
• If you are interested in continuing to contribute to Wikipedia in other ways, my advice to new editors is that it is best to start by making small improvements to existing articles, rather than creating new articles. That way any mistakes you make will be small ones, and you won't have the discouraging experience of repeatedly seeing hours of work deleted. Gradually, you will get to learn how Wikipedia works, and after a while you will know enough about what is acceptable to be able to write whole new articles without fear that they will be deleted. Over the years I have found that editors who start by making small changes to existing articles and work up from there have a far better chance of having a successful time here than those who jump right into creating new articles from the start. Obviously that advice may not appeal to you if you have no interest in doing anything other than publicising the Barnsley Youth Theatre, but in that case, for the reasons I have mentioned, Wikipedia is probably not the right place for you anyway.
• Just one more point. If, despite my advice, you decide to continue to write about the Barnsley Youth Theatre, and if you have a personal connection to that theatre, then you need to read the guideline on conflict of interest before you do so, and make sure you comply with what it says. JBW (talk) 22:02, 31 December 2023 (UTC)