Talk:Russian invasion of Ukraine (2014)

Title/scope

Title needs to be changed. This is Russian involvement ("invasion") in the War in Donbass and 2014 Crimean crisis, not a war separate from those. If this is supposed to be the replacement for the 2014 Russian military intervention in Ukraine article, I recommend changing the title to something similar to that. At present, this strikes me as being nothing more than a WP:POV fork. RGloucester — ☎ 15:48, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

I agree, this should be under Russian invasion of Ukraine 2014 or something similar. Maybe Russian invasion of Ukraine but 1) that's a redirect, so we'd need an admin to do the move, and 2) it's ambiguous since this isn't the first time this happened.Volunteer Marek (talk) 15:56, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

I've moved it to draft space. It clearly isn't ready for the article space. Try and get the material from 2014 Russian military intervention in Ukraine in here, make it neutral, and then it can go to article space. RGloucester — ☎ 16:09, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Please don't. This article is more ready than most articles on the subject (which aren't ready after months of their existence). Additionally, moving it to draft space actually makes it harder to improve the article. I had several extensions to add which got lost because of the move and now I'm not certain how to move stuff back. I don't know if I can even post this comment. At the very least moving it to draft space cannot be done unilaterally.Volunteer Marek (talk) 16:14, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

This article is a fork of 2014 Russian military intervention in Ukraine. Unless you sort out and gain consensus for a merger here, this article will be deleted in the main space. RGloucester — ☎ 16:14, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

This is obviously not true. 2014 Russian military intervention in Ukraine contains old material about stuff that's happened weeks ago. This article is about the events of last few days. I agree that stuff from the former should probably be merged here in a Background section, but this is a separate article. Again, please don't act unilaterally here. Obviously editors are busy improving this article and arbitrarily moving it to draft space or redirecting it makes their work harder.Volunteer Marek (talk) 16:17, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

They cover the exact same scope. Just because that article isn't updated doesn't mean that there is justification for creating a WP:POV fork. Draft space is the only thing that will save this from deletion. RGloucester — ☎ 16:18, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

I am *extremely* annoyed here, as your arbitrarily moving this article into draft space destroyed several paragraph of text I've written to add to the article. Now I have to redo it again. I doubt the article will be deleted, and if it is, THEN we can move stuff from here to the other article (which would be inappropriate but who knows what crazy people will do at AfD).Volunteer Marek (talk) 16:23, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

I think the title should be Russo-Ukrainian war. Unless we can rename Donbas War to that? The point from how I read the original was to show the Russian theater, not the "Ukraine vs. rebels" side of it or that Russian was supporting them. --LeVivsky (ಠ_ಠ) 16:23, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

If you want to try renaming that article to Russo-Ukrainian War, be my guest. That proposal would be much more appropriate, as it wouldn't be establish a million forked articles. RGloucester — ☎ 16:42, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Contested deletion

This article should not be speedy deleted as being recently created, having no relevant page history and duplicating an existing English Wikipedia topic, because... (well, because the reason is wrong. We don't delete articles because they're "recently created" because then we'd have no articles on the encyclopedia. Same goes for "no relevant page history". And the article does NOT dupllicate any existing English Wikipedia topics.) --Volunteer Marek (talk) 16:18, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

agreed, its a new article, it has sources, and expands on the mainland invasion and actual war. that said, the original title should return, this article was made to show the war, not expand on intervention (as there is an article on that already) --LeVivsky (ಠ_ಠ) 16:21, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

• This is an absolute disaster. An absolute disaster in every respect. Forks, forks, forks, forks. Fork after fork. Why have you forsaken me, JUNTA JUNTA? No long shall I count juntas, but now I shall be forced to count forks. RGloucester — ☎ 16:51, 28 August 2014 (UTC)