Talk:Bargirl

Juicy Girl section

The entire "Juicy Girl" section is a mismatch; the term is relatively country specific (unknown in quite a few countries, such as Thailand, where bar girls and barfine prostitution are common) and yet it overwhelms the size of the rest of the article. -mr_Handy (talk) 05:14, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Point of view

This article gives no voice to the women employed or often forced to work as juicy girls/bargirls, and reads like a primer for servicemen looking for their services. Not appropriate, considering how many women are forced into this line of work as blatant sexual slavery. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.219.238.102 (talk) 15:24, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Why don't you expand on that? There's a section called "Working Conditions" - would that be a good place to mention sexual slavery? I agree this article seems to have been originally written from the point of view of an American serviceman stationed abroad. That's hardly surprising, given that this is the English-language Wikipedia and not the Thai or Tagalog Wikipedia. There's also no mention of minors (those girls in the Go go bar photo look about 14). On the other hand, I don't think it's appropriate to take the attitude that all bargirls everywhere are necessarily poor, exploited victims; there's a fine line between pity and judgment. -Rosekelleher (talk) 12:51, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

In U. S.

This article makes it sounds like it's exclusively an Asian thing. There are B-girls in the U.S. and probably every major city in the world, and they're not necessarily prostitutes, very often they're paid just to chat with the customers and encourage them to buy overpriced, watered-down drinks. Here's the definition at Dictionary.com: B-girl. The origin is shown as U. S., 1936, abbreviation of "bar girl."

And here's an article about a club in Boston that "was closed down for repeated complaints of B-girl activity": article --Rosekelleher (talk) 16:03, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

Also: "Much like Robert B. Parker's novel, Ceremony, popular accounts of the Combat Zone typically featured a cast of characters that included leering college boys, seedy 'B' girls and saucy prostitutes, flashy pimps, winos, wayward husbands, co-ed strippers, muggers, shady operators, conventioneers, frightened pedestrians, and hard-bitten cops." Jenkins, Henry (2003). Hop on Pop: The Politics and Pleasures of Popular Culture. Duke University Press. p. 437. ISBN 9780822383505.

See also: wikt:B-girl

Bargirls vs. bars

"These kinds of bargirls include hostess bars..." What does that mean? A bargirl is not a bar. -Rosekelleher (talk) 22:23, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

I'm going to try to rewrite that sentence. Apologies in advance if I get it wrong. The wording is unclear, so I can't be sure I understand what's being said. -Rosekelleher (talk) 17:35, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

suggestion

I just noticed this: "The girl is under no obligation after a bar fine or not to engage in sexual intercourse."

Shouldn't that be: "After a bar fine the girl is under no obligation to engage in sexual intercourse."

Just a suggestion. I don't want to change it myself because I'm not sure exactly what's being said. -Rosekelleher (talk) 23:26, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

Editing

I'm not an expert on the subject of bargirls, and I'm not contesting the accuracy of anything in this article. I just think the same information could be presented more clearly. I don't mean to be rude or unappreciative of anyone's efforts. It's great that someone created this article and added lots of useful information. I'd just like to do some rephrasing and rearranging. Hope that doesn't offend anyone. -Rosekelleher (talk) 22:28, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

"Unhappy girl"?

Is that real, or a joke, or some sort of political commentary? All the other variants listed in the introduction redirect (or link) to this page. "Unhappy girl" redirects to an article about a Doors album. -Rosekelleher (talk) 12:08, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

KTV girl

KTV girl is either a synonym or near-synonym used in countries that have the sleazy kind of KTV (KTV is the word used for private-booth karaoke/noraebang in China and Taiwan and some kind(s) of karaoke venues in other countries including Cambodia and the Philippines).

If not used in China and/or Taiwan it's at least used in either or both of the Philippines and/or Cambodia, at least by expats. It's probably derived from bargirl. — Hippietrail (talk) 12:58, 24 July 2015 (UTC)

Un-merge "Barfine"/"Bar Fine"

Quite a while ago, someone merged the page for "Bar fine" in here ( https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Bar_fine&oldid=235639928 ; back in 2008!) -- see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Bar_fine

In revision https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Bargirl&oldid=671453358 Neelix removed the information entirely. I've restored it, but it flows awfully with the main text of the article, and it seriously needs cites. If nobody objects, I'm going to split this out into its own page again under "Bar fine" mr_Handy (talk) 23:12, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

I strongly oppose the split. Splits are justified by sourced content, and there currently is none for this subject. Per Wikipedia's policy on verifiability, "the burden to demonstrate verifiability lies with the editor who adds or restores material, and is satisfied by providing a citation to a reliable source that directly supports the contribution". Please do not restore the content to this article without a source. Neelix (talk) 00:12, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

The unsourced content (and some of it may have lost sources in past edits) was there for 7 years since the pages were merged. There's a great deal of other information in this entry which was equally un-sourced, and most of what was there could be readily corroborated looking at other related pages (and indeed, the term "bar fine" is used elsewhere on the page, and if wikified would redirect back to this page.) I've restored a very abbreviated portion of the section in order to leave SOME kind of definition on wikipedia, citing sources that hopefully don't look too link-spammy (barring the academic one linked off the "Prostitution in Thailand" page.)

In any event, it's a significant concept, and one IMO worth restoring to its own page rather than a section on the morass of different things merged together on this one. Since we've now got an administrator on record opposing it, I'm going to drop out of this argument, but I would hope someone with more time can come up with a property sourced discussion at more length whether as a section on this page or its own. mr_Handy (talk) 05:57, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

Split page

Perhaps it's worth splitting this page entirely, to distinguish the sort of bargirls common in Asia, and the outdated US usage? mr_Handy (talk) 23:17, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you're suggesting. What would it mean to split an entire page? Neelix (talk) 00:14, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

The "bar girls" section (paid hostesses/dancers, etc openly employed by the bar, mostly outside of western countries) vs. the whole discussion of b-girls in the US. mr_Handy (talk) 05:57, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

I don't think that there is enough content to justify a split per summary style. Neelix (talk) 06:28, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

Fair enough. The current content is a mess, subsuming at least two barely-related concepts (see also the giant and now-deleted digression on "juicy girls" here) and whether it's on two separate pages or better-divided sections, this could be improved significantly. mr_Handy (talk) 06:36, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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