|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Enid Blyton article.|
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- 1 Enid Blyton the writer?
- 2 Yanks
- 3 Disapproval
- 4 Nudism
- 5 Name
- 6 EB's writing quality
- 7 Birthyear?
- 8 NZ library ban
- 9 Gollywogs
- 10 Controversies
- 11 Step-parents
- 12 "Critically acclaimed"?
- 13 Merge bibliography subpages
- 14 Why is trivia considered trivial?
- 15 School experience
- 16 Racist quote
- 17 Unsourced material
- 18 Pen name
- 19 Enid on BBC4
- 20 Censorship
- 21 Malory towers...
- 22 Unclear phrase
- 23 Bias on personal life
- 24 Most successful work
Enid Blyton the writer?
The article could say something about what made Blyton start to write, how she created her famous characters, how she kept up the volume of writing, etc. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 188.8.131.52 (talk • contribs) .
The BBC have 2 archive collection about Enid Blyton - can be found here - http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/people/6144.shtml. Would they be useful external links to add to this page [User: koalaedina]
It hurts to read this article and find out some of the ways in which England treated Enid Blyton. Your manners are so much more grave than ours in Sweden. We love our own writer Astrid Lindgren more than any other writer in our culture, writer of Pippi Longstocking and so many other stories. Please, some one that can write properly and understand what I see, Please tell in the article of Enid Blytons view of Children in her books. As in Sweden with Pippi Longstocking those views were probably why she were ill seen by a few number of people. The children in books from both these writers had a mind of there own and were intelligent. They made there own decisions and thought things through. They mostly had success. This is not a popular way to describe children among a rare breed of people. Some men and women have never bin small themselves. They had to grow up instantly. Poor or in extremely competitive families. These people find sharp and witty children to be offensive. Librarians that I have met are often hostile to children in there library. Xxanthippe! You understand what I mean. Could you sharpen up the grammatical to an understandable form? Xxanthippe! You let the most truthful remark of how Yanks has become nowadays stand so please dare to let this line stand also: British literature and theatre are the most developed in the world but in the papers of to day, in every day life of Britain, people seem to be fare game to consume. This is an encyclopaedia. Why let this spirit in here? Don't lie, but why spread unfounded rumours in an encyclopaedia? --Erik Selander (talk) 10:55, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
You Americans smell to relax with your PC. A book can be good and yet have a girl playing with a doll. Why do you have to spoil everything with pathetics polemics?
- Fully agree - Tom
We need some mention of educationalists disapproving of her books because they are so simple to read (though they have stories and are devoured by children).
And then there's the matter of recent reissues of Noddy, with an ethnically cleansed Toytown...
I used to love these books as a kid, particularly the Mystery ones. Although upon re-reading them as an adult they are terribly sexist and racist. Mark Jeays
- And yet are still bought in thier millions all over the world, maybe a good story well told rises above such trivialities 184.108.40.206 (talk) 18:55, 10 August 2009 (UTC)
For good or bad such were the times Mark though they remain great children's books - the ones i didn't wear to pieces reading so much are safely stored away for my own future kids to read one day.
Paul Melville Austin
Should the attitude of Enid Blyton Ltd toward fan sites ("Shut down or we'll sue you, claiming copyright infringement and libel" even if the information is reasonably accurate, and works are used fairly) be documented? --Damian Yerrick
Didn't EB play tennis in the nude? -- Tarquin
EB's real name is Darryl Waters. I think someone should put that on the page. Also, I remember reading somewhere that she used to mistreat her own children.
- Waters was her second married name: see  for more biography. Charles Matthews 09:10, 29 Dec 2004 (UTC)
EB's writing quality
The main reason for the withdrawal of Blyton books from school libraries was actually very little to do with racism or sexism, it was far more connected with the fact that Blyton simply didn't write very well, and her use of English is rather poor. The tabloids seized upon this as another example of "Loony Lefty Political Correctness", but the racism and sexism aspect was certainly more of an afterthought than anything else.
laugh on both issues. IMO her critics, on both grounds, have mainly shown that they didn't understand what she wrote. Andrewa 16:24, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
- It was certainly the librarians. Her books grew out of her teaching background and 'reading schemes', so she was very self-conscious about vocabulary levels in different age groups. The article should add material on her early life, to expand on that. Charles Matthews 12:53, 17 December 2005 (UTC)
- That sounds good. I'm not able to write much, my information comes mainly from the books I was given as a child, some of which I still have, see user:andrewa/Enid Blyton. Most of them were Famous Five and similar which I did not like at all but people kept giving them to me, possibly in the hope of educating me in what children ought to enjoy! I was reading chemistry books, Arthur Ransome and Carl Barks comics mainly at that age. I have also used my mother's memories of using Blyton's teaching material in a primary school in England in the late 1940s, but I have to be a bit wary of wandering into original research there.
- My suspicion is that the reason that Blyton's books sold so well (and still do) is that she was 'way ahead of her time in her approach. The Teletubbies was based on a scholarly analysis of the way very young children speak. That's great, but in other ways, big deal. Blyton (and many billions of grandmothers) did it instinctively. Andrewa 00:58, 12 January 2006 (UTC)
on top it says it's 1897, the category is 1896 births though - can someone clarify?
NZ library ban
'This gave rise to the first rumour of a New Zealand 'library ban' on Blyton’s books, a recurrent press canard'
I grew up in NZ and as a child I do remember there being no Enid Blyton books in the school or public library. When I asked about this, I was told they were banned. This was back in about 1990. They were finally unbanned towards the end of the 90's. Any other Kiwi's back me up on this one? I would change the artical myself, but it could be the fact that the public libraries I went to just happened to have a ban on the books and it might not have been NZ wide.
- You would have to give a reliable reference. Some librarians simply objected to buying Blyton books, it seems, because they wanted children to read something more literary. Budget decisions are not 'bans', as such. Charles Matthews 21:55, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
- I remember growing up in New Zealand and hiring the books from public libraries, this would have been around '95 onwards. This could have been selection by the Library staff rather than an entire ban, at least from this point onwards. Nik Rolls (talk) 07:44, 21 February 2010 (UTC)
I grew up with Enid Blyton books, through the 70's, as my parents brought them out to New Zealand when they immigrated here. I recall that they were not available in Wellington public libraries, and was lead to believe they had been banned. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Medicnz (talk • contribs) 02:49, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
The article claims that only one Gollywog appears as a villain in one Noddy book. However I remember as a child reading a Noddy story in which there was a gang of Golllywogs patrolling the woods and harrassing people. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 220.127.116.11 (talk • contribs) 15:30, 11 September 2006.
- I had a nearly complete Noddy book set when I was a child - so we're talking over 35 years ago. As I recall the golliwog was frquently a villain of the piece. I also recall that some time during my teens the books were PC'd up and republished, largely without the golliwogs, and with other characters substituted. Cain Mosni 15:03, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
That's interesting - from my memory, in all the E.B. books I read with Golliwogs, the golliwog was the older, wiser toy, while the other toys were more childish. So it seems she had both positive and negative golliwogs. Which is as it should be - you don't want all black characters to be bad, but neither should they all be good. 18.104.22.168 (talk) 21:14, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
The "controversies" section needs a major rewrite - it reads like an editorial opinion piece. 22.214.171.124 21:00, 29 January 2007 (UTC)
Completely agree (SW)
isn't it odd that EB re-named her children to their step-father's name, but in almost all the Famous Five books, she slags off step parents and step parenting. (nankai, a step-dad) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 20:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC).
I was a little surprised to see this in the opening, and I say that as someone who still owns and reads some of Blyton's books. Since this is likely to be a controversial claim, perhaps we could name some of the critics who have done the acclaiming? Vashti 18:47, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
- After rereading the entire article, I think a POV flag is in order...the language in several places is anything but neutral.Alan 03:34, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
Merge bibliography subpages
- Please don't. Huge pages aren't helpful. Charles Matthews 10:43, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
- I agree that the bibliography is better if kept on a separate page. OrenBochman 15:00, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
- I agree that pages that get too long should be split into separate pages. However I would extend this thought to suggest, that for consistency, all similar pages, i.e. biographies be split in a similar way regardless of length, which would include bibliographies for authors, discographies for those in the music industry, filmographies for those involves with the film industry, etc. ForteTwo 03:33, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
I completed the merge, and made the source pages incoming redirects.
Why is trivia considered trivial?
I don't get it, but when something is tagged as trivia to be either absorbed into the article or else, I feel I'm gonna lose some interesting cultural references. Unlike some who know all the injokes and in references when they come up, I appreciate it being spelled out so I can add to my own associations. Can someone tell me why this censure exists?
By the way, I used to read all the Blyton books not realising she wrote the others such as the boarding school and magical ones. She would have given me a taste for sci fi for life. I read so much as a child that I didn't notice the author's name, just the yummy feeling of devouring more and more enjoyable stuff and didn't notice they were aimed at age groups so I just read my way through whatever I could get hold of. At least the kids were co-ed and managed their adventures together.Julia Rossi 02:27, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
- You should check out the links which explain why we should avoid trivia sections and how it can be done. The key thing to remember is this is an encyclopaedia, not a fan site or a place for general information about her and her books Nil Einne 19:49, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
I read on German W.P. that E.B. herself attended a school named "St Clare's", like her characters in some of her novels, and that her real-life experiences inspired those books (or at least that that was what she herself told) - but here I do not find a reference to that aspect of her life and work, so I wonder whether that piece of information is reliable, or, if it is, why you left it out ?!
Also I tried to include a link to "St. Christopher's School", which she attended (afterwards) (acc. to both articles), or rather I checked by this way whether it had an entry or article of itself on W.P., but apparently so far there exists only one for a school of the same name in Virginia (USA). So I wonder, does "her" school in Beckenham still exist or is there just no refenrence in this electr. encyclopaedia ?
I thaught it might be interesting especially for an author who became a teacher herself AND choose schools as setting for a number of her books: so her own school experience very obviously MUST have left quite an "impact", don't you think so ?!
- I also noticed that the article does not say a thing about her teacher training, where and how long and why chosen (German W.P. says the career was chosen against the will of her parents who rather wanted her to become a musician).
Regards,188.8.131.52 15:51, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
- Actually, the first part is not true: the German wikipedia only states that Blyton had gone to a boarding school herself and that this boarding school later became a model for St.Clare's.--184.108.40.206 (talk) 06:40, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
On reading an article in the Scotsman  that in parts appeared to be derivative of this one, I encountered a quote that could require a shift in the “controversies” section – George was said (by the narration, not just some character) to be “as black as a nigger with soot” (it is Wikipedia policy not to use astericks). A search for it finds some apparently reliable sources. Does anyone have an old book that could be checked to confirm and/or see by what time it had been excised? This would clearly require a prominent place in discussion of whether her books were racist, and would also change the question of whether her books are “staunchly defended” by many people.Billwilson5060 (talk) 10:18, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
The following is unsourced information:
- In a survey of adults between the ages of 25 and 54, conducted by Cartoon Network in England in 2004, The Famous Five was named as the top children's book. The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe, by C. S. Lewis, came second, ahead of Robert Louis Stevenson's Treasure Island. Tolkien's The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings tied with a second Blyton title – The Secret Seven in fourth place.
- Her nephew was the Doctor Who composer Carey Blyton.
- The name of an important female character in her Malory Towers series (Darrell Rivers) was inspired by the name of her second husband, Kenneth Darrel Waters.
- Letters from Bobs, one of Blyton's early works, sold more than 10,000 copies in just one week.
While this is interesting, we can't use it unless you provide a source. Also, none of this is really trivia, as trivia by its definition is "unimportant information" - it therefore shouldn't be in a trivia section but instead the information should be incorporated into the main article. - Tbsdy lives (talk) 20:12, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
The infobox states:
- Pen name Enid Blyton (1937 - 1968), Mary Pollock (1940 - 1943)
- Writing period 1922 - 1968
Enid on BBC4
Perhaps inevitably, this page has attracted much attention since the BBC drama which was broadcast last week. We should be wary of citing it. The opening credits stated : "The following drama is based on the lives of real peope. Some scenes have been invented and events conflated for the purposes of narrative". While it portrays her life, it seems dangerous to quote from it as though it were a completely reliable sourcec.Informed Owl (talk) 11:52, 22 November 2009 (UTC)Informed Owl
Informed Owl: you are clearly a Blyton fan, and want to whitewash her memory, which is your right. However, the reference was not specifically to the drama, but to quotations directly from Imogen, whom one might rightly describe as a reliable source.
I am not a Blyton fan and I have no interest in whitewashing her memory. My sole interest is accuracy on Wikipedia. The sentence I reverted although purporting to quote Imogen, used the TV programme as a reference which as I said above came with a clear warning that it was a drama with invented scenes. If anyone can give a more accurate and reliable reference for the comments attributed to Imogen, then there can be no problem with the quotation going back in.Informed Owl (talk) 23:24, 25 November 2009 (UTC)Informed Owl
- I suggest you leave it out until there is a reliable source. Xxanthippe (talk) 23:33, 25 November 2009 (UTC).
- In the drama, her brother Hanly tells her of their mother's death, and during the same day Blyton says she remarried six months ago. The article says Blyton's remarriage was in 1943 and that mother died in 1950. Is the drama wrong regarding the dates, or is the article wrong? Jim Michael (talk) 21:32, 28 March 2010 (UTC)
- There's an oddity here. I put a comment (reverted) which intentionally started "the film portrays..." and mostly emphasised consistent traits (though I'll agree it did refer to one incident that may have been 'dramatised'). But it brought out some aspects of her character that have not been covered adequately in the article and it seems legitimate to quote them. As a reference, how does a film differ from a book existing in some far-distant library? Both can be inspected with a little effort. Chris55 (talk) 19:47, 29 March 2010 (UTC)
Does anyone know where I can find out which books were censored and which weren't by title and edition and printing?
I am going from memory here, but I believe the censorship occurred around 1965-70. I am most familiar with The Adventure Series: Look for printing date before 1965, illustrations by Stuart Tresilian, buff-coloured binding. See http://www.enidblytonsociety.co.uk/ for original covers. D A Patriarche (talk) 07:29, 10 November 2013 (UTC)
On reading that her husbands name was something to do with Darrel Waters I realized that the main character in her Malory Towers books who seems to reflect her in some ways (Does not like Maths yet enjoys physical activities such as swimming, tennis and lacrosse) was called Darrel Rivers. Does anyone else think there may have been a slight connection? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kipper101 (talk • contribs) 17:52, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
- Pressured; persuaded; burdoned; pressed into doing things etc.
Bias on personal life
Reading one of the sources: http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2002/03/30/1017206160031.html , I see that the other daughter shows a different picture of EB and that BOTH Enid and her first husband had affairs. This needs more balance.