Talk:List of Ponzi schemes

While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard.

Lists Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Lists, an attempt to structure and organize all list pages on Wikipedia. If you wish to help, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.ListsWikipedia:WikiProject ListsTemplate:WikiProject ListsList
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Crime and Criminal Biography Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Crime and Criminal BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Crime and Criminal BiographyCrime-related
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Finance & Investment Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Finance & Investment, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of articles related to Finance and Investment on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Finance & InvestmentWikipedia:WikiProject Finance & InvestmentTemplate:WikiProject Finance & InvestmentFinance & Investment
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Additions to this list

Before adding to this listing please consider whether the incident was, in itself, actually 'notable'. And also ensure that proper external source references are included in order to prevent WP:BLP and similar issues. --AlisonW (talk) 17:07, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There was a scheme in the 1970s in the UK by a firm called Barlow Clowes. It was supposed to be a unit trust that invested only in government stock securing an unusually high rate of interest. Initially it was sound and used "bond-washing" to invest in bonds where the main return was capital gain and this was taxed at a lower rate. When this difference was removed in the Budget they turned to Ponzi-style fraud. It was notable all right and can be found in any broad sheet paper of the time. The political row lasted for many months. A simple Google search will give many leads.

Another fraud was Investors_Overseas_Service which is in Wikipedia. The article says it was a pyramid schem but it did involve the key element of using capital to fake up the dividend. Budhen (talk) 21:17, 13 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If anyone cares, in Canada we had a notable case and a book was even made out of it. His name was Michael Holoday and the book can be found at http://www.amazon.ca/Free-rider-Street-stole-million/dp/1552782352 Free rider: How a Bay Street kid stole and spent $20 million. The earnings weren't so big, but the story in itself is very interesting. Do some research if you wish for possible addition to the list. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.58.81.205 (talk) 20:35, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps we should include that Bernard Madoff got sentenced to a max. of 150 years in prison for a Ponzi scheme: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090629/ap_on_bi_ge/us_madoff_scandal Kevin chen2003 (talk) 00:11, 30 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I would challenge those who continue to edit out the reference to the Texas Guaranteed Tuition Plan as a Ponzi scheme to demonstrate that the plan was not, in fact, referred to by the state comptroller as such (references have been provided). Brianko (talk) 22:05, 21 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Just because a politician says something is true, doesn't mean it is. As a reference, consider just about all the candidates in the US 2016 presidential election, or for that matter, in any other presidential election. Gah4 (talk) 23:54, 5 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I suggest adding the Israeli Moni Fanan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moni_Fanan) Ponzi scheme to the list —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.138.224.37 (talk) 20:10, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2009/2009-68.htm —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.127.163.121 (talk) 13:35, 26 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In the Spanish forum filatelico and Afinsa Bienes Tangibles, [70], it states that Jehovah's Witnesses were involved: However it this statements lack sources ( The source does not talk about Jehovah's Witnesses involvement), and on top of that, such a sentence brings confusion: Were JW involved as the crime maker or as the victims. Was the Jehovah's Witness organisation involved or individuals who happened to be JW? If we talk about individuals, I suggest removing that information, as it brings no value to the case and is irrelevant. I don't see any other Ponzi case being listed as involving Catholics, Muslim or Jews. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mailley (talk • contribs) 01:43, 26 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Although not comparable in size with the aforementioned frauds, Joseph Brant Arseneau has been very innovative in coming up with new schemes such as the "the securitization of excess cash flow from renewable energy with the use of Renewable Energy Derivatives".

NOTE TO WIKI-STAFF: Although I may not know how to properly edit these entries (nor do I wish to destroy the previous poster's work by 'my' hand alone) I submit for your scrutiny, that the previous entry (above this entry of mine) involving Joseph Brant Arseneau may be libelous.

His inclusion in this section (Other notable schemes) is without merit (as is the use of the word "schemes" in connection with his name or his "structured finance process(es)".[1])
His being presumed as a fraudster (by catetorical link, at the bottom of the page) is also wanting for factual evidence.
His being associated with any wrong-doing (by being negatively contextualized on this "List of Ponzi schemes" page) which has not been proved nor even been suspected by any authorities (governmental or otherwise.)

In fact, as early as the late 70's, the U.S. government has used "securitization" processes (in HUD and student-loans, to name a couple[2]) and Arseneau and his team at the notably, multinational, company, IBM, began the securitization of Renewable Energy Derivatives circa 2006[3] with the result being "...a responsible use of the environment to finance properties in third world countries."

Therefore, the previous "bullet" above (and it's author) is at the very least irresponsible; and at the most, libelously actionable.

Please take whatever action you deem necessary (in this article/page) to secure your site as "having validity" among the world community by ostracizing and/or correcting those who would defame others without providing factual references.

Thank you in advance for (what I'm sure will be) your expedient and just consideration in this matter.

This was posted on the main page, and should not be on this page at all as it has no point being here. WPPilot 02:40, 12 December 2010 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by WPPilot (talk • contribs)

Woodbridge Group of Companies is now a $1.2 Billion US Ponzi scheme. The history is pretty long with many red flags.Regulators failed to do their job, once again IMHO! How does one get a "snap shot" of webpage before it is taken down? Many Insurance Agents have information regarding this scheme that are disappearing since the Woodbridge BK filing. ^[1] ^[2]^[3]^[4]^[5]^[6]^[7]^[8] and many more. 21:48, 26 December 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nofway (talk • contribs)

References

Re proposed merge with 'Airplane game' article

As the article Airplane game indicates, this was a pyramid scheme, not a Ponzi scheme - a merge to this list would be incorrect. AndyTheGrump (talk) 01:09, 23 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Re proposed merge of 'Double Shah' article

None of the links provided with this article are valid - it should not be merged here unless this can be corrected. If I can't verify it, I'll AfD it, as a possible BLP violation. AndyTheGrump (talk) 01:13, 23 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, it is only the reference links that are invalid - other links are ok. I'm not sure how significant this Ponzi scheme was though, so I'd like some input on the proposed merge. AndyTheGrump (talk) 01:18, 23 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Social Security

Why can't we add Social Security to this list? It fits the exact definition of a Ponzi scheme... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.20.179.14 (talk) 15:11, 24 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I presume you mean the US Social Security scheme? (This is an international project). As discussed on the Ponzi Scheme article talk page, though a minority view holds that there are similarities between Social security and a Ponzi scheme, this is controversial. To cover the debate fully, one would need a longer section than would be merited here, and in any case, if one were to extend the list to include everything that someone 'claims' is a Ponzi scheme, it could get rather long. The issue is however discussed here: Us_social_security#Claim_that_it_is_a_pyramid_or_Ponzi_scheme. AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:55, 24 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The important idea behind a Ponzi scheme is that the "investors" don't know how it works. We know exactly how social security works, which is enough to make it not a Ponzi scheme, though, as noted, there are similarities. Gah4 (talk) 00:00, 6 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I mean, you're not wrong. There should be a section called "disputed" that contains stuff that is disagreed upon whether or not it's a Ponzi scheme. CerealContainer (talk) 20:29, 27 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ponzi Scheme in a computer game

Around August 18th, 2011, 2 persons managed to pull a Ponzi scheme that ran for 8 months. The total amount, in USD, is valued at about 53 000. It happened in the MMORPG Eve Online and the total amount of the heist is reaching 1.8 Trillions of ISK, the in-game currency.

references:

http://www.evenews24.com/2011/08/12/one-of-the-biggest-scam-in-eve-history-ponzi-scheme-empties-over-1-trillion-isk-from-players-wallets/

http://www.phaserinc.com/index1.html

-Zerat ca (talk) 03:38, 6 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Pinnock

I lost some money when I was young to Pinnock Finance - excellent report in Hansard. ~~(The phrase "you have to be a pillock to invest in Pinnock" springs to mind.)~~ — RHaworth (talk · contribs) 00:07, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Fat&Happy (talk · contribs), did you actually follow the link before you reverted my comment? Pinnock Finance is a classic example of a Ponzi scheme. My note above was more a note to myself to add an entry to the article to fill the gap between 1930s and 1980s. This is a talk page for goodness sake - a bit of personal reminisence is allowed. — RHaworth (talk · contribs) 00:51, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Suggested add

Someone may wish to add Brian Kim. --Epeefleche (talk) 07:25, 13 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Michael McIndoe scammed £30m from fellow footballers ^[1]

References

^ http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3065700/Michael-McIndoe-s-30m-fraud-saw-Gabby-Agbonlahor-Robbie-Keane-Jimmy-Bullard-300-victims.html. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on List of Ponzi schemes. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

Added archive https://web.archive.org/20060111151340/http://www.usdoj.gov:80/usao/gan/press/12-01-04.html to http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/gan/press/12-01-04.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 09:39, 26 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 13 external links on List of Ponzi schemes. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 00:07, 27 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Courtright

Regarding the Courtright reversion, it all looks fine to me. It doesn't claim anything to be proven that isn't proven. The article title isn't proven ponzi schemes. Gah4 (talk) 04:39, 20 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

DOJ, and twice

I think that DOJ orders and investigations should be able to go here, assuming that they are properly written. That is, alleged for things that are actually alleged. Though the previous one might be about twice the size that I would expect. Gah4 (talk) 02:10, 8 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Larry Benedict name always appears on Wikipedia Ponzi scheme list When searching Larry Benedict Wikipedia

If he has a connection to a Ponzi scheme it should be recognized because he is getting viral this year and people should know the truth 185.76.177.90 (talk) 11:43, 14 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

In December 2017, the Woodbridge Group of Companies (a/k/a Woodbridge Securities) was charged as an alleged US$1.2 billion Ponzi scheme run by real estate developer Robert H. Shapiro (not to be confused with attorney Robert L. Shapiro) by The U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC).

The date, Monday, was 12/7/2017. The Chapter 11 filing on Monday[when?] https://www.ndtvprofit.com/amp/onweb/woodbridge-group-of-companies-files-for-bankruptcy-in-delaware

Robert H Shapiro pled guilty and was sentenced to 25 Years. https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdfl/pr/mastermind-13-billion-investment-fraud-ponzi-scheme-one-largest-ever-sentenced-twenty Nofway (talk) 14:57, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] ttps://www.sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/2017/lr24020.htm

[2] ttps://www.reuters.com/article/us-woodbridge-sec-charges/sec-sues-bankrupt-woodbridge-group-over-1-2-billion-ponzi-scheme-idUSKBN1EF2GP

[3] ttps://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-04/woodbridge-group-of-companies-files-for-bankruptcy-in-delaware

[4] ttp://www.investmentnews.com/article/20171208/FREE/171209932/barred-florida-broker-goes-on-to-sell-millions-in-defunct-woodbridge

[5] ttp://www.thinkadvisor.com/2015/05/04/state-regulator-goes-after-unregistered-rep-fines

[6] ttps://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/holmby-hills-historic-owlwood-estate-sold-for-90-million-300329587.html

[7] ttps://www.aspentimes.com/news/woodbridge-under-sec-fraud-investigation-over-aspen-glen/

[8] ttps://www.pacermonitor.com/public/case/23146000/Woodbridge_Group_of_Companies,_LLC

[9] ttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3065700/Michael-McIndoe-s-30m-fraud-saw-Gabby-Agbonlahor-Robbie-Keane-Jimmy-Bullard-300-victims.html. {{cite web}}: Missing or empty |title= (help)

[1]

[2]

[3]

[4]

[5]

[6]

[7]

[8]

[1]