Talk:List of aces of aces

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Tanker Aces[edit]

Person Country of service War Time
Michael Wittman Nazi Germany Third Reich (Germany) World War Two — 8 August 1944 A panzer ace.
Sydney V. Radley-Walters  Canada World War Two — end of WWII

Is this section OR Tank Ace or Panzer Ace is a term well used by video game companies and one or two book titles but is there anything concrete ? How did you become a Tank/Panzer Ace. Michael Wittmann was not even the top scoring German tnk commander. --Jim Sweeney (talk) 09:53, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Well, I've seen the definition as "10 kills" to become a tank ace. And "Panzer Ace" is not used by a book or two, it is used by a whole lot of books.[1][2][3][4] Most aces are German or Soviet, because that's where the tank battles took place. This is a temporal list, so the title passes on when the tanker is killed. I may have erred on putting Wittmann on the list (he may have been only the top ace of the Western Front for the Nazis), but Radley-Walters was the top ace of the west for the allies for the War. It doesn't matter that Wittmann didn't have the most kills at the end of the war, only the most kills at the time of his death. (see the part for fighter pilots, where there's more than one per country listed) 76.66.196.218 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 07:19, 23 April 2009 (UTC).
Yes and the same authors uses Infantry Aces [5], [6] its just a catchy book title which was not used by anyone to describe the tank commanders or is the a reliable source ? --Jim Sweeney (talk) 08:42, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
Well "Overlord: D-Day and the battle for Normandy" by 'Max Hastings' published in 1984, claims that Wittmann was at one point the greatest Panzer ace of the war. That's not a book published by Stackpole. And "Caen: Anvil of Victory" by 'Alexander McKee' was published in 1964 and uses tank ace. 76.66.196.218 (talk) 12:30, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

So may I safely assume that you are going to expand the list? Missing are at least the following German aviators.

German tank commanders

and what about the French, English, South African, Australian, etc.MisterBee1966 (talk) 10:16, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

There is a {{listdev}} on this article, it has {{stub}} templates on the bottom, so it is incomplete. Assuming that it is complete is a mistake. And as it does have a listdev and stub templates, and Wikipedia is a something that anyone can edit, I'd assume that I wouldn't be the only one working on it. I shouldn't need to put an {{underconstruction}} on the article, since it's being slowly built. 76.66.196.218 (talk) 12:15, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Requested move - 2009[edit]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

I suggest to rename the article to "List of ace of aces" to clearly distinguish the article from Ace of Aces. I don't think that the capitalization of single letters should be used for disambiguation purposes. MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:23, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Capitalization of single letters can be used for disambiguation purposes, just not in this particular case. The reason it can't be used is that the current title violates our capitalization guideline (as it's not a proper name, it's supposed to be "Ace of aces"). The "List of X" format should always have X in plural. Did you mean "List of aces of aces"? I think a better solution would be to move Ace of aces to Ace of aces (disambiguation) and this page to Ace of aces. Jafeluv (talk) 20:20, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.


Fighter ace of aces[edit]

You are going to need more articles than this just to contain this list. Under the definition given, tracing the "Ace of aces" only through World War I will take an article longer than the present one. Eight national services, a dozen or so title changes each during the war...I shouldn't be surprised if it made for a hundred item list.

The era between the World Wars is entirely uncovered. There was a Spanish Civil War, you know, and the American Volunteer Group....

Then there is World War II, which will be a humongous list all by itself....

I dunno, this article seems to be hastily conceived, ill-defined, and ultimately a trivial fanboy exercise. I can glance down the list and spot popular misconceptions galore, as the research is scanty. If you do finally correct all the errors, you still end up with trivia.

Georgejdorner (talk) 14:44, 25 April 2011 (UTC)


South African Flag[edit]

I altered the icon next to the entry for South African ace Marmaduke Pettle to reflect the flag of South Africa at the time of World War two. The article used to have the current "rainbow flag" instead of the flag that was used pre-94. I would have put this down to a simple mistake, but there is a pattern of some person or person going arounf Wikipedia and removing all the pre-94 flag icons from articles.

Look, I understand that to many black South Africans, the subject of the old "National Party" era flag is something of a sore subject. But the use of that flag in this context is historically correct. Look at the German entires in this article, for example. They use the flags that were flying over the country at the time the specific pilot was active: ie either the Imperial German flag or that of the Nazi state rather than the curreent flag. Please don't change this.

Hal Turner Fan (Uuser talk:Hal Turner Fan) 0826 April 2013 (CST)

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Hal Turner Fan (talkcontribs) 14:26, 5 March 2013‎ (UTC)

There's something wrong with his listing, the time does not list the time he held the title of "Ace of aces", it lists his lifetime, which is wrong. It should start from the time he acquired the title, and end either when the war ends, or when he was no longer serving (died, captured, mustered out, etc). Since it is a record for WWII, it can't start in 1914. The end date is correct if his kills were the highest of the war, then his death date would mark the end of his tenure as ace of aces. -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 02:25, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Mohammad Rayyan[edit]

Mohammad Rayyan also shot down a Gulfstream III, which is a civil aircraft. Does it count to the Rayyan's scores?Diako1971 04:28, 20 September 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Diako1971 (talkcontribs)


Eddie Rickenbacker[edit]

What does "Succeeded Luke on his death" mean? Who is Luke? -- SGBailey (talk) 10:54, 26 February 2014 (UTC)

It's Frank Luke. It was deleted with this edit [7] for no reason I can see. -- 65.94.171.126 (talk) 10:42, 7 June 2014 (UTC)
As the title "Ace of Aces" is accorded to the leading active ace of a particular conflict by country, if an ace is killed or captured, they are no longer active. And as one ace exceeds the number of kills of another, the title is passed on, so removing aces who held the title because someone who is dead had a greater kill count is wrong. Removing aces because they had been surpassed but at one time held the title is also wrong. (it's a temporal succession list) -- 65.94.171.126 (talk) 10:50, 7 June 2014 (UTC)