Talk:Nereids

Comments

the opis link is broken, it leads to the babylonian city — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.86.129.130 (talk) 15:14, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

this is a very important topic, the nereids were one of the major classes of divine beings of ancient greece and generally more respected than the other classes such as dryads and nymphs who were often isolated whereas the nereids were together, and btw i'm sure that some sources refer to 3,000 nereids213.106.124.3 (talk) 11:20, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

First of all, I don't think understanding the Nereids is of "high" importance to understanding Greece as a whole. Second, as a member of the Classical Greece & Rome project, I don't think the article, whatever its importance in the religion of archaic Greece, merits a priority rating of "high" in terms of the project's attention. Third, "mythology" is not just that of Greece, and even in relation to other topics of Greek mythology is of modest importance to WP readers: Nereid was viewed about 8,772 times in the month of February, compared, say, to Greek mythology with 196,937 hits, and Zeus with 240,824. Cynwolfe (talk) 14:06, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

The names appear in Iliad when thetis comes to console Achilles after Patroclus is killed. Forms and spelling in this list might reflect Homer. Wetman 08:30, 14 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Isn't the plural of Nereid Nereides? -- 81.153.96.219 19:00, 9 May 2004 (UTC)

Shouldn't the pronunciation of the word be in IPA? It just looks funny... --Kitty ^who? 21:25, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Where do we find they have blue hair? Njál 10:16, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Furtive vandalism added 15:35, 8 July 2005 by User:148.122.128.112 and not caught till now!--Wetman 11:24, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Is Cassiopeia a Nereid? It says so on her page, but here she is not listed. Can someone verify this? -Safay 18:42, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Cassiopeia is not a Nereid, but is associated with them in a famous legend. She boasted that her daughter Andromeda was more beautiful than any Nereid. This was "hubris", and Poseidon avenged the insult by ordering her to sacrifice Andromeda (who, herself, had done nothing wrong; she was considered her parents' property) to a sea monster. She was rescued by the hero Perseus, who killed the sea monster, and apparently the other gods forbade Poseidon or the Nereids to take any further revenge. The Andromeda article on Wikipedia has a painting of the angry Nereids tormenting Andromeda. 50.180.19.238 (talk) 02:02, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation

This page needs to become a disambiguation page. Way too many hatnotes. Bob the Wikipedian ^{(talk • contribs)} 00:19, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, but the disambiguations affect mainly redirects. I think it is best tackled with a combination of

• turning some redirects into stubs (where some literature on the exploits of these sea-nymphs exists, see e.g. Panopea)
• turning other redirects into dabs (where there is no literature of note, see e.g. Callianira).

Have asked the Greek project for assistance, added template to that effect. Dysmorodrepanis (talk) 01:47, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

The question is always "What is the Wikipedia reader looking for in entering Nereid?" Chopping the page on nereids into the smallest possible pieces is not encyclopedic thinking: it is in the nature of a gazetteer of names. General information is lost in this atomization process. Is the reader served, or just Wikipedia hobbyists? --Wetman (talk) 02:04, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Hatnotes

The top of this page was cluttered with hatnotes; it made more sense to have disambiguation pages for the various names there. So that's what I did. I trust that's OK with everyone. Moonraker12 (talk) 12:58, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

That was awesome, thanks for doing it! (By the way, shouldn't the species names have a period after the first letter?) --Waldir ^talk 13:46, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! It's been niggling me for ages! And you're right about the species names; I've re-done them where necessary. Moonraker12 (talk) 14:00, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Dablinks

This page is tagged now for excessive dablinks. I've fixed some of them ( the one's I know) which leaves a redlink to an "N (Nereid)" page, but I don't know if that's the best solution. Some of the links are to "N (Mythology)", and one of them ("Opis") doesn't link anywhere, leaving the name in plain text.
Any thoughts on what would be the best thing to do? Moonraker12 (talk) 13:19, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

List and parentage

I don't think it's a good idea to list a collection of Nereids from different sources. According to this article, Asia/Clymene is a daughter of Nereus and Doris but she is generally known to be a daughter of Oceanus and Tethys.

ICE77 (talk) 05:23, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

Conflation of nereid with mermaid - necessary?

In the lede, nereids are glossed to mermaids - but the current article on mermaids equates them with sirens, which have their own provenance. This just has to be a mistake, so I have pulled the word 'mermaid'. (20040302 (talk) 11:06, 3 February 2012 (UTC))

List of names

I keep getting 51 Nereids in both Hesiod (the English text in Perseus) and in the list with a [3] in this article. I counted both multiple times. Could someone please verify the Hesiod Nereid count? here is my list from Hesiod (what am I listing that I shouldn't be?) 1.Actaea 2.Agave 3.(H)Alimede 4.Amphitrite 5.Autonoe 6.Cymatolege 7.Cymo 8.Cymodoke 9.Cymothoe 10.Doris 11.Doto 12.Dynamena 13.Eione 14.Erato 15.Euagora 16.Euarne 17.Eucrante 18.Eudora 19.Eulimena 20.Eunice 21.Eupompe 22.Galatea 23.Galena 24.Glauce 25.Glauconome 26.Halia 27.Hipponoe 28.Hippothoe 29.Leagora 30.Leomedea 31.Lysianassa 32.Melita 33.Menippe 34.Nemertes 35.Neso 36.Nisaea 37.Panopea 38.Pasithea 39.Pherousa 40.Ploto 41.Polynoe 42.Pontoporea 43.Pronoe 44.Proto 45.Protomedea 46.Psamathe 47.Sao 48.Speio 49.Themisto 50.Thetis 51.Thoe Ken M Quirici 01:38, 16 April 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kquirici (talk • contribs)

Although I can agree with a list of names of the fifty Nereids, the current list is ugly. I would prefer four list, one per source/author, or one annotated list, with superscripts for the different authors (e.g.: Thetis^{Hom,Hes,Hyg,Bibl.}).

Furthermore, the names shouldn't be numbered; numbering suggests number 1 is the oldest and number 96 is the youngest, which isn't true. Use a ',' or a '*' instead of a '#'.

Besides, most hyperrefs/links should be removed, since most names redirect to Nereid. Michael! (talk) 14:37, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Your criticisms seem sound. I'm not keen, though, on four separate lists based on each author. Wouldn't there be a good bit of duplication? And a unified list allows for the possibility of stray Nereids named in miscellaneous other sources. So I like the one annotated list better, though not the superscript, which doesn't seem stylistically conventional; small text might be one alternative (that's what I did for the notations at indigitamenta, which I haven't finished). You should feel free to go ahead and edit. Cynwolfe (talk) 16:03, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. I'll start with removing the useless links. Although I do have the works of Homer, Hesiod and Ovid, I lack those of Hyginus and Pseudo-Apollodorus, so I don't think I'm competent enough to provide a complete and correctly annotated list. By the way, in several articles, e.g. Danaids, there's one list per author/source. Michael! (talk) 19:26, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Useless links are removed:

Amphitrite, Arethusa, Asia, Galatea and Thetis are the only Nereids with an article of their own

Calypso, Dione, Dynamene and Psamathe are dubious articles, I mean I'm not convinced that either these are about a Nereid, or a link to these pages is relevant. Please have a look at it.

Panopea and Pherusa articles contain no information and could be deleted.

By the way, I also removed Doris from the list, because she's the mother of the Nereids. Michael! (talk) 20:25, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

I don't mean to intrude here - I'm not at all a specialist in this material - however all of Hesiod, Homer, and Hyginus (who lists only 40+) list Doris explicitly as a Nereid as well as the mother of the Nereids; I realize this makes 51 Nereids so either it is wrong, or another one doesn't belong. Doris in the Wikipedia article is said to be a semi-common name. is it not possible Doris named a Nereid with her own name? How did she get into the list - some original source of all three of the above transcribed incorrectly? Ken M Quirici 00:32, 27 April 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kquirici (talk • contribs)

On the list format, I suppose it would depend on how much they overlap. I would say in general (without looking closely at either the Nereids or Danaids) that if several names are found on two or more lists, it might be more useful for readers to have them collated into one, or into a table. If there's little or no overlap, separate lists would seem fine to me. If there are a very few names that overlap, you could just say "X, Y, and Z are the only Nereids who appear in both yadda yadda." Just suggestions. No big deal. Cynwolfe (talk) 21:02, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Well, I don't have any objections at all against one combined, annotated list. However, as I said before, I lack two of the important classical sources. Michael! (talk) 22:19, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

By the way, here are the lists of Nereids as given by Homer and Hesiod. Michael! (talk) 14:37, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Homer

Homer, Iliad XVIII 35-52:

σμερδαλέον δ᾽ ᾤμωξεν: ἄκουσε δὲ πότνια μήτηρ

ἡμένη ἐν βένθεσσιν ἁλὸς παρὰ πατρὶ γέροντι,

κώκυσέν τ᾽ ἄρ᾽ ἔπειτα: θεαὶ δέ μιν ἀμφαγέροντο

πᾶσαι ὅσαι κατὰ βένθος ἁλὸς Νηρηΐδες ἦσαν.

ἔνθ᾽ ἄρ᾽ ἔην Γλαύκη τε Θάλειά τε Κυμοδόκη τε

Νησαίη Σπειώ τε Θόη θ᾽ Ἁλίη τε βοῶπις

Κυμοθόη τε καὶ Ἀκταίη καὶ Λιμνώρεια

καὶ Μελίτη καὶ Ἴαιρα καὶ Ἀμφιθόη καὶ Ἀγαυὴ

Δωτώ τε Πρωτώ τε Φέρουσά τε Δυναμένη τε

Δεξαμένη τε καὶ Ἀμφινόμη καὶ Καλλιάνειρα

Δωρὶς καὶ Πανόπη καὶ ἀγακλειτὴ Γαλάτεια

Νημερτής τε καὶ Ἀψευδὴς καὶ Καλλιάνασσα:

ἔνθα δ᾽ ἔην Κλυμένη Ἰάνειρά τε καὶ Ἰάνασσα

Μαῖρα καὶ Ὠρείθυια ἐϋπλόκαμός τ᾽ Ἀμάθεια

ἄλλαι θ᾽ αἳ κατὰ βένθος ἁλὸς Νηρηΐδες ἦσαν.

τῶν δὲ καὶ ἀργύφεον πλῆτο σπέος: αἳ δ᾽ ἅμα πᾶσαι

στήθεα πεπλήγοντο, Θέτις δ᾽ ἐξῆρχε γόοιο:

‘κλῦτε κασίγνηται Νηρηΐδες,

Then terribly did Achilles groan aloud, and his queenly mother heard him as she sat in the depths of the sea beside the old man her father. Thereat she uttered a shrill cry, and the goddesses thronged about her, even all the daughters of Nereus that were in the deep of the sea. There were Glauce and Thaleia and Cymodoce, Nesaea and Speio and Thoë and ox-eyed Halië, and Cymothoë and Actaeä and Limnoreia, and Melite and Iaera and Amphithoe and Agave, Doto and Proto and Pherousa and Dynamene, and Dexamene and Amphinone and Callianeira, Doris and Pynope and glorious Galatea, Nemertes and Apseudes and Callianassa, and there were Clymene and Ianeira and Ianassa, Maera and Orithyia and fair-tressed Amatheia, and other Nereids that were in the deep of the sea. With these the bright cave was filled, and they all alike beat their breasts, and Thetis was leader in their lamenting: “Listen, sister Nereids,

English Translation by A.T. Murray

Hesiod

Hesiod, Theogony 240-264:

Νηρῆος δ᾽ ἐγένοντο μεγήρατα τέκνα θεάων

πόντῳ ἐν ἀτρυγέτῳ καὶ Δωρίδος ἠυκόμοιο,

κούρης Ὠκεανοῖο, τελήεντος ποταμοῖο,

Πλωτώ τ᾽ Εὐκράντη τε Σαώ τ᾽ Ἀμφιτρίτη τε

Εὐδώρη τε Θέτις τε Γαλήνη τε Γλαύκη τε

Κυμοθόη Σπειώ τε Θόη θ᾽ Ἀλίη τ᾽ ἐρόεσσα

Πασιθέη τ᾽ Ἐρατώ τε καὶ Εὐνίκη ῥοδόπηχυς

καὶ Μελίτη χαρίεσσα καὶ Εὐλιμένη καὶ Ἀγαυὴ

Δωτώ τε Πρωτώ τε Φέρουσά τε Δυναμένη τε

Νησαίη τε καὶ Ἀκταίη καὶ Πρωτομέδεια

Δωρὶς καὶ Πανόπεια καὶ εὐειδὴς Γαλάτεια

Ἱπποθόη τ᾽ ἐρόεσσα καὶ Ἱππονόη ῥοδόπηχυς

Κυμοδόκη θ᾽, ἣ κύματ᾽ ἐν ἠεροειδέι πόντῳ

πνοιάς τε ζαέων ἀνέμων σὺν Κυματολήγῃ

ῥεῖα πρηΰνει καὶ ἐυσφύρῳ Ἀμφιτρίτῃ,

Κυμώ τ᾽ Ἠιόνη τε ἐυστέφανός θ᾽ Ἁλιμήδη

Γλαυκονόμη τε φιλομμειδὴς καὶ Ποντοπόρεια

Ληαγόρη τε καὶ Εὐαγόρη καὶ Λαομέδεια

Πουλυνόη τε καὶ Αὐτονόη καὶ Λυσιάνασσα

Εὐάρνη τε φυήν τ᾽ ἐρατὴ καὶ εἶδος ἄμωμος

καὶ Ψαμάθη χαρίεσσα δέμας δίη τε Μενίππη

Νησώ τ᾽ Εὐπόμπη τε Θεμιστώ τε Προνόη τε

Νημερτής θ᾽, ἣ πατρὸς ἔχει νόον ἀθανάτοιο.

αὗται μὲν Νηρῆος ἀμύμονος ἐξεγένοντο

κοῦραι πεντήκοντα, ἀμύμονα ἔργα ἰδυῖαι.

And of Nereus and rich-haired Doris, daughter of Ocean the perfect river, were born children, passing lovely amongst goddesses, Ploto, Eucrante, Sao, and Amphitrite, and Eudora, and Thetis, Galene and Glauce, Cymothoe, Speo, Thoe and lovely Halie, and Pasithea, and Erato, and rosy-armed Eunice, and gracious Melite, and Eulimene, and Agaue, Doto, Proto, Pherusa, and Dynamene, and Nisaea, and Actaea, and Protomedea, Doris, Panopea, and comely Galatea, and lovely Hippothoe, and rosy-armed Hipponoe, and Cymodoce who with Cymatolege and Amphitrite easily calms the waves upon the misty sea and the blasts of raging winds, and Cymo, and Eione, and rich-crowned Alimede, and Glauconome, fond of laughter, and Pontoporea, Leagore, Euagore, and Laomedea, and Polynoe, and Autonoe, and Lysianassa, and Euarne, lovely of shape and without blemish of form, and Psamathe of charming figure and divine Menippe, Neso, Eupompe, Themisto, Pronoe, and Nemertes who has the nature of her deathless father. These fifty daughters sprang from blameless Nereus, skilled in excellent crafts.

English Translation by Hugh G. Evelyn-White

• I’ve come late to this conversation, but I didn’t we used to have parallel list comparing the various sources? I’m sure I’ve seen one here in the past.

On the subject of what to do with the various Nereid-related pages, it may be no bad thing to have a page for a name that applied to more than one mythological character (Panopea and the others); it could be done as a set index, like we have for ships bearing the same name (like this one)

Can I also suggest moving the Homer and Hesiod passages (above) to wikisource? They'd be more accessible there. Moonraker12 (talk) 22:32, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

PS: My mistake, it’s here. So it might be better to link the list section to there, and to reference each name to a source, so that it’d be clear how much overlap there would be.

Like:-

• Actea [1][2][3][4]
• Amathia [3][4]

(and using <ref name="App"/> <ref name="Hes"/> <ref name="Hom"/> <ref name="Hyg"/> <ref name="Ov"/> ) Moonraker12 (talk) 22:54, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

A link to maicar is already used as the source of the list section. However, I prefer the original sources and I've got two minor objections against that "maicar" website:

• Limnoreia (Λιμνώρεια; Hom Σ 41) is missing in the Homer column of the "maicar" table
• -εια is usually transcribed as -eia or sometimes latinized as -ea; however, "maicar" gives it as -ia

Of course, this doesn't necessarily mean that website is untrustworthy, but it's better to use the primary sources and refer to those (instead of a secondary source like that website). That's also why I gave those two passages of Homer and Hesiod here. If you know the correct passages of Pseudo-Apollodorus or Hyfinus, don't hesitate to quote them here as well. (As far as I know, Ovid didn't give a list of names of the Nereids, but I might be wrong.)

By the way, several Nereid names were links to a disambiguation page like this: Amphinome. It contains no information at all about the Nereid (and it probably won't ever give additional information), so I removed each of those unnecessary links. (Actually, I haven't deleted them; they're still there, as comments (which you'll only see if you edit the page.) Feel free to revert it if you're they aren't irrelevant here.)

Michael! (talk) 19:39, 25 January 2013 (UTC)

 Done for Homer. Michael! (talk) 11:44, 1 April 2013 (UTC)

 Done for Hesiod. Michael! (talk) 12:37, 1 April 2013 (UTC)