Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Martok

Martok

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Martok (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Minor if recurring Star Trek character, sadly seems to fail GNG. Reception is limited to a few "Top 10" lists (which per this RNS discussion) are not considered reliable nor helpful in establishing notability (anyway, they tend to be pure plot summary). I am not seeing anything else (note there is some stuff like [1] about J. G. Hertzler, the actor who played him, but this is not the same). There is a sentence here or there in some minor WP:INTERVIEWS with Hertzler like [2]. He has short plot summaries in printed "Star Trek encyclopedias" like [3] but those sources are not independent anyway (they are just shorter, print versions of wikias for folks who want to have a dust-gathering Star Trek book). Overall, I am afraid there is little to salvage here - sources show no SIGCOV, are either plot summaries or about the actor (not character). At best, redirect to List of Star Trek characters (G–M). _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 04:15, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fictional elements-related deletion discussions. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 04:15, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Science fiction and fantasy-related deletion discussions. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 04:15, 11 May 2021 (UTC)

• Keep per Nom. That is, while I greatly appreciate Piotrus' efforts to enumerate what is available on this character, I disagree that it is insufficient to establish notability. Most specifically, dead-tree books about the franchises are independent, transformative works. A plot summary, for example, is necessarily transformative in that at any point where it does not echo the script or the resultant fictional presentation, it abridges the primary sources and makes an editorial decision about what is important and what is not. Further, RS which discuss the character as portrayed by the actor contribute to notability for both topics: if there's a rule that says there must be an either/or decision, I'm unaware of it. Jclemens (talk) 05:20, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
• Redirect - The reception listicles are trash, so those are useless. The sourced development info probably has a home somewhere, but I'm not sure if it necessarily needs to go with the character. Given that the additional sources provided by the nominator are limited to trivial mentions for the most part, it doesn't appear to be anything that can meet WP:GNG available at this time. TTN (talk) 12:49, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
• Keep I agree with Jclemens that the ratings of such sources as Syfy Wire counts for something, providing non-plot information, as does the Star Trek Explorer. We have plot-summary information in print. But in addition a WP:BEFORE search at Google Scholar reveals more: For "The Klingons as Homeric Heroes" I can only see the preview, but that provides a sentence of analysis already. 'This Side of Paradise' gives a bit of characterization. The Fifty-Year Mission, the officially unofficial and therefore independent encyclopedia, has a bit of background on the character origin/development. Kultur- und Sozialklingonologie, an analysis of Klingon culture, has a bit more of in-universe information about Martok. And We only want to be your partners: Star Trek: Enterprise - politisch-ideologische Dimensionen einer Fernsehserie zwischen Kaltem Krieg und war on terror has both personal characterization of the character of Martok, as well as comparing him to real-world politicians, and what type this character represents if the Federation and the Klingons are a reflection of the two sides of the Cold War. Even if the treatment in each of those sources is not very long, together they can easily fulfill the requirements for "more than half a paragraph" of WP:WHYN. Daranios (talk) 15:35, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
• Keep per Jclemens & Daranios. Starspotter (talk) 17:57, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
• Keep Dbutler1986 (talk) 19:36, 11 May 2021 (UTC)