Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2022 June 6

June 6

Template:Florida Complex League Pirates Gold roster

• Template:Florida Complex League Pirates Gold roster (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Pirates no longer have two separate FCL teams; template is not needed as this team is not active Joeykai (talk) 22:56, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

• Delete per nominator's rationale. NatureBoyMD (talk) 12:36, 7 June 2022 (UTC)
• Delete I'd say subst onto the article. I think it's useful to see the list of players the team had considering there isn't much of this information anywhere I've looked. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 23:11, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

Template:Yazidi tribes

• Template:Yazidi tribes (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

The template is redundant as only one tribe has an article. List of Yazidi tribes should be enough for now. Semsûrî (talk) 12:08, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

Strongly Oppose. There are more than only one Yazidi tribe linked in this template. The tribes can be expanded and linked to this template. There is no reason for deletion. Dortana (talk) 14:10, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

Comment There are two, now. And please don't create dozens of subs just for this template to exist. --Semsûrî (talk) 14:14, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

Merge blue links, non-redirects with Template:Yazidi diaspora to a more general Template:Yazidis navbox template if a navbox is wanted (seeing as how Template:Yazidis exists). Gonnym (talk) 13:59, 7 June 2022 (UTC)

• Merge with the diaspora template. Perfect place for it considering how weak this template is for navigation. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 23:14, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

Comment: Template:Yazidi diaspora and Template:Yazidi tribes are two different things about two different topics. The first is about their live and their settlements in the diaspora and the second about tribes. Dortana (talk) 08:44, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

Template:HS listed building header

• Template:HS listed building header (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

These templates make editing listed building pages with the VisualEditor very difficult. This is an accesibility issue as it prevents editors unfamiliar with wikicode (either due to lack of experience or a disability that makes manipulating large quantities of text harder) from contributing. A simple task such as wikilinking Park Bridge, Aberdeenshire in List of Category A listed buildings in Aberdeenshire is impossible. When one clicks on the table in VisualEditor and tries to edit it, the editor freezes which is a confusing and poor user experience. These pages are especially long and so would benefit from the ease of editing that the VisualEditor brings.

The template adds formatting for coordinates, but this could easily be achieved using other templates within a table. This would allow these templates to be editable with the VisualEditor interface.

I propose this template and Template:HS listed building row are deleted (or at least, deprecated) and swapped for standard wikitext tables. NemesisAT (talk) 10:13, 30 May 2022 (UTC)

• Keep. This deletion nomination for templates that are used productively on over 1,000 pages seems premature, given that there is no discussion at the talk page for either template, and a TemplateData section has not been added to either template's documentation page. Start with attempting to modify the templates first, please. – Jonesey95 (talk) 15:21, 30 May 2022 (UTC)

  I've tried editing again and sat and waited for it to load and a dialogue for editing has finally loaded after a while waiting. So the page is at least editable, however each parameter can only be edited essentially as source code. The VisualEditor tools for adding references, images, and templates are not accesible. Thus I still think the tables should be converted to standard wikitext tables, and TemplateData would not resolve these concerns (though it could add some explanation for each parameter). NemesisAT (talk) 17:38, 30 May 2022 (UTC)

As the template freezes the Visual editor when edited for me, I don't think a TemplateData section would be much use. I started the discussion here as I just don't see a good reason for this template to exist. It makes the code a bit shorter for source code users, but this should not be at the expense of visual editor users. NemesisAT (talk) 15:42, 30 May 2022 (UTC)

Please see the instructions above: Templates should not be nominated if the issue can be fixed by normal editing. Since that has not yet been tried, this nomination is premature. It sounds like you need Wikipedia:Help desk if you are having trouble using your page editor of choice. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:54, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

The issue can not be fixed with normal editing. Having the table as a template makes it impossible to use VisualEditor features to format items within the table. The only way to fix this, as far as I know, is to not have a template and use a normal table instead. There is no need for a template when a standard wikitable would suffice. NemesisAT (talk) 08:26, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 11:39, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

Template:S-line/Seibu Railway left/S-Train

• Template:S-line/Seibu Railway left/S-Train (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)
• Template:S-line/Seibu Railway right/S-Train (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

Unused and superseded by Module:Adjacent stations/Seibu Railway. Gonnym (talk) 05:18, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

• Delete — DaxServer (t · m · c) 09:17, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

Template:Transclusion

• Template:Transclusion (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

The template alleges it is utilized to avoid disruption and unnecessary server load while editing heavy articles. The unnecessary server load claim is unsubstantiated, and what it calls avoiding disruption really is an excuse to store article text in single-use templates to make it more difficult to edit the content, in direct contravention of WP:TG, and in a clear sign of WP:OWNBEHAVIOUR. — Guarapiranga ☎ 04:07, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

As a sidenote, I'll add that the accusation that this is somehow WP:OWN is not a valid delete rationale and seems off-topic (if you really think this is that, feel free to go make some dramah at the WP:Dramaboard) and a ridiculously obvious failure to AGF. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 22:07, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

Keep per WP:IAR/WP:5P5. avoid disruption and unnecessary server load while editing heavy articles is a perfectly legitimate reason to use templates, particularly when those do not need to be edited frequently (for example, Template:2021 Canadian federal election synopsis documents the final results of an election - it is extremely unlikely there is any good-faith reason to go substantially messing with these, and what other minor edits tend to happen are not really hampered by the use of a template) and even more so when they are really large (for example, Template:2012 Summer Olympics calendar comes in at nearly 40 kb (!!) of wikitext; and the 2021 election template comes it at well over 100 kb (!!!)). Also "keep" as the nominator does not present an accurate reading of the guideline (a mere guideline, on top of that) they are citing: Templates should not normally be used to store article text, as this makes it more difficult to edit the content.. So, beyond the fact that there are no firm rules on Wikipedia; the guideline itself makes clear that exceptions are possible. In this case, both on WP:KISS principles (since most editors will not need to edit those, such large templates being put directly in articles probably does more harm than good); and on the grounds that moving such tables out of mainspace is very likely to reduce disruption and vandalism to them (most vandalism is in article space, not in template space; and most vandals are not familiar with Wikipedia namespaces and template transclusion...). A template explaining this seems therefore perfectly appropriate. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 22:04, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. It does make an excellent list of low hanging TFD fruit. :) --Izno (talk) 17:39, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

— Guarapiranga ☎ 02:04, 11 June 2022 (UTC)